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Waterford North Quays

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 392 ✭✭Rustyman101


    The only thing that can be done is a change in political representation across the board, and I don't mean vote in SF and everything will be ok, it definitely won't!

    We need people in the corridors of power with Waterford 1st on their agenda.

    Not the current mix of hicks and boot-lickers.

    I got johnos pothole fixed in strabally, nothing wrong that but I was against the boundary extension cos mick said no.

    JD in dungarvan seemingly did great work for irish immigrants in USA, fab maybe do something here and we wouldn't have so many !

    Now how we get 3 or 4 decent representatives is a mystery ?

    Plus all the in fighting between KK, WX & WD.

    Like it or not WD is the capital city of the SE.

    It's not treated as such by local or national politicians until that mindset changes we are goosed, which we are by the way !



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,570 ✭✭✭vriesmays


    Wait till you see WIT's downward trajectory over the next decade.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,071 ✭✭✭Finnbar01




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,071 ✭✭✭Finnbar01





  • Registered Users Posts: 545 ✭✭✭Crocodile Booze


    So I see the North Quays is now a shoddy looking used car lot that looks like something out of a 1970s American cop show.

    What's the latest plan?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 418 ✭✭GandhiwasfromBallyfermot


    Plan? Waterford Council?




  • Registered Users Posts: 4 swiftmampi


    Eddie Mulligan will fund it with that €5 million he owes.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,041 ✭✭✭gw80


    Welcome back vriesmays



  • Registered Users Posts: 22 Mad Peggy


    she is a very nice lady she has called to my door a few times and is lovely to talk to



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 418 ✭✭GandhiwasfromBallyfermot


    Didn't she have a convicted sex offender or someone campaigning for her during the last election? And wasn't she caught rotten laughing on Facebook at people who brought it up?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,909 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    she maybe a nice woman, but shes clearly not the right person for her role....



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 455 ✭✭Valhalla90


    She is a party first woman this is the problem. Waterford should come first! for example the boundary extension saga she was against it. FF didn't want to upset anyone in Kilkenny, so she went with the party line!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,631 ✭✭✭snotboogie




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,909 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    just spotted this, its great to see the whole idea hasnt died, the whole north and south quays have incredible potential



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,132 ✭✭✭Gardner


    there isn't a hope in hell any developer in their right mind would go near the north quays in the present climate unless they are been heavily subsidized by the state which in turn leads to a poor practice going forward on a local/national level when offering out public tenders.

    Short and sweet view should be taken with all of this, abandon the north quays development and the new river crossing and divert all public money in regards to putting the south quays under public ownership again and develop the entire south quays.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,909 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    i suspect ppp's could well be the only way forward, markets are too volatile at the moment, developers need some sort of state supports, in order to get the job done, but i do agree with the south quays, the car parks have to go...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,881 ✭✭✭BBM77


    First of all, why abandon the new river crossing, moving the train station to a better location and other infrastructure works? Your plan is to leave the north quays as is. Ingenious plan 🙄 Even if the north quays does not happen for some time getting the infrastructure works done will make things easier in the future.

    Secondly, developers are interested.

    Agree the south quays need to change, the surface parking is a particular bug bearer of mine. But this abandon the north quays thing that is being spouted by some quarters at the moment is not an option either. It is BS in my opinion.

    Post edited by BBM77 on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 455 ✭✭Valhalla90


    Once the bridge is done it opens up the whole site with a quick access direct into the city centre in minutes, this is very attractive from a developer's perspective. Train station move is just as important. We cant accept dereliction in our city centre anymore. Carparks for sure need to go!



  • Registered Users Posts: 162 ✭✭JourneyMan8


    they should never "shift focus" to the city centre if it's not done in a while as that councillor said in that article. Reading the plans for the North Quays is super exciting and inspiring for once, it would be the making of Waterford. Get that done and everything else all over the city will start to fall into place.

    don't even get me started on the south quays, the depression always returns when i drive back to waterford and the first thing i see is car parks.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,589 ✭✭✭Asdfgh2020


    The view of the retailers and hoteliers that line the quay would be very different. They regard having close by Parking as the ‘life blood 🩸’ of their operations. If all the parking (not sure exactly how many spaces there are but there must be at least 500) was removed over night there Would probably be cries of ‘council again decimates local businesses’ and makes it more difficult for the public to access shops, hotels, restaurants etc……similar to the perceived ‘mess’ that was made of the quay by reducing it to one lane. I’d be all for removing as much parking from quays as is practically possible but there would no doubt be a negative ‘kick back’ from some



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,174 ✭✭✭hardybuck


    Perhaps it's time for the Council to pause and think outside the box for a minute. Is lumping apartments and offices into the North Quays really the best route forward? Fact of the matter is that this is probably going to be an expensive site to develop, hence the need for significant co-investment from the State to make the project viable.

    You also have the genuine risk of sucking footfall out of the existing city centre over to the North Quays. The previous developer seemed to have a significant interest in retail - and that could have really impacted existing businesses in what is already quite a disjointed city centre in Waterford. That could be resolved by making the project primarily about residential and office space however.

    If there was an opportunity to pause and reflect, I'd encourage the policymakers to think creatively about things which could go into the site which other cities don't have - particularly the other regional cities. Is there something you could put there which would boost Waterford?

    Dublin City Council got slated for a proposal to put a white water rafting facility into their quays near the IFSC. It was slated because people didn't think a Council ought to be spending €25m on a leisure facility in the midst of a housing crisis, but the proposal had some merit when you looked at it objectively.

    Copenhagen built the Amager Bakke which is not only one of the cleanest waste to energy facilities in the world, but it also doubles up as an unbelievable ski slope. That's an example of what's possible when creative thinking and joined up policy making can be facilitated.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 455 ✭✭Valhalla90


    There is no shortage of parking in Waterford lets be honest, we have City Square, Railway Square, Bolton St, Gasworks, the closed Newgate multi storey. Problem is people want to park outside the shop. I think everyone accepts now the carparks on the Quays have to go. North Quays form a huge part in Waterford becoming an actual riverside city again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 418 ✭✭GandhiwasfromBallyfermot


    Nail on the head there regards the problem I think. People are too lazy to walk from Bolton Street or Gasworks into town and want to park right outside the shop. Remove the car parking on the quay and leave the spaces on the road outside the GPO/Ulster Bank/Fieldmaster as blue badge, age friendly, and set down spots.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,909 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    this is a great post, i do believe both the north and south quays need to be redeveloped, we need to move on from our past and present use of these spaces, both have incredible potential, but we must involve as many stakeholders as possible to make it a true success. pre existing local businesses must be involved in the whole process, to make sure any new developments dont become destructive for these businesses, we have to get over this whole hyper competitive nature of modern business, whereby only the bigger truly succeed, while smaller businesses end up completely destroyed, its always important to remember, most are employed by sme's!

    this was my great fear with the falcon approach, you could see it had the whole monopoly approach written all over it, it could have potentially done great damage to smaller local businesses, this whole rising tide sh1te is simply just that!

    we truly need to be extremely careful what we do here, its well known that such developments cause 'negatives' to local property markets, we cant keep doing this, we cant keep continually screwing over younger generations in regards this critical need, i.e. security of accommodation, and yes, i am calling this a 'negative', because thats what it is, i.e. continually causing a rise in property prices is causing mayhem for us!

    its critical that we implement viable counteractive measures alongside these developments, as increasing property prices are probably inevitable, but we cant keep playing this free for all game in regards property, it ll ultimately cause the long term failure of all, this wont be easy though, but we have to try something....



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 418 ✭✭GandhiwasfromBallyfermot


    Extract from Michael Walsh's Management Report for Thursday's Plenery Meeting. After months of silence Michael has finally decided to write something other than "The council is hoping to progress a proposal to completion in the coming months" about the North Quays in his management report.

    Sounds like positive news and I'd be very interested to see what plans this joint venture has. Hopefully it's a development along the lines of the original plans. I am a little uneasy however that the council are selling the land to this JV before anything has even been announced on it. The last thing we need is this proposal to fall apart and then yet another strategic site in Waterford City is in the hands of a private developer who'll sit on it until it appreciates in value, and they can sell it on.

    Would it not make sense for Waterford Council to become a part of the joint venture along with ISIF and the private developer thus ensuring some sort of input into the general direction of the development? Similar to the Abbey Quarter development in Kilkenny which is a JV between Kilkenny Council and ISIF, although I know that is a far smaller scale than the North Quays.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,881 ✭✭✭BBM77


    My biggest fear is that it will be used for social housing. Can just see it now, FFG pushing government funding for social housing on the site for the “benefit of Waterford”. We have seen what is happening with SETU Waterford “expanding footprint” into the old crystal site. Just going to be student accommodation. Michael Walsh and the council need to stick hard to their guns and keep at least the section directly in front of the south quays for commercial and offices.

    Post edited by BBM77 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,174 ✭✭✭hardybuck


    I'd be more concerned about the Council trying to play a role in the development of this site, outside of providing critical infrastructure.

    They have no experience or expertise in this sort of work. They're restricted by all sorts of rules and restrictions that don't apply to a private developer.

    Better to sell the thing and reinvest the money in something else.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,080 ✭✭✭azimuth17


    This has been the bugbear from the start. People with no commercial expertise. Something akin to the Dublin Docklands Development Authority should have been established for the SDZ



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,589 ✭✭✭Asdfgh2020


    The council is full of overpaid incompetent plonkers who like yo whittle away government money on projects that the private sector wouldn’t touch……



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 455 ✭✭Valhalla90


    This is the only chance to get it right! The train station relocation is crucial. A new riverside hotel is also needed there,along with some restaurants, a bit of retail and so on. Make a riverside boardwalk, it needs to stand out though. Residential will definitely be a huge part of it. It's a brown field site that should definitely be developed with high density.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,465 ✭✭✭JohnC.


    They should be doing things the private sector wouldn't do. That's kind of the point. If government money was only used for things which can make private style profits, the country would be in a terrible mess. What would roads be like if they only exist for profit? Are you prepared to pay a toll on every road? How many bus routes if they only exist for profit?


    People need to get over the idea that public services have to make a profit. They don't.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,909 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    the land should never be sold, theres clear evidence across the country, that by doing so, increases the likelihood of it being used for pure speculative purposes, and if you re wondering why your kids, grandkids, nieces and nephews property prospects are in the sh1tter, look no further!



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,132 ✭✭✭Gardner


    see our old buddy Mr. Cass is still on twitter peddling false promises.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 418 ✭✭GandhiwasfromBallyfermot


    I don't know him and have never met him but whenever I see him on Twitter he always strikes me as someone who's slightly lost the plot. His tweets are manic to say the least.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 418 ✭✭GandhiwasfromBallyfermot


    Additional €60m for Waterford North Quays Project (irishexaminer.com)

    As a Waterford person, experience has thought me to ask..... what's the catch? This looks like good news.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,881 ✭✭✭BBM77


    Know how you feel. The words Waterford and government support are words that do not often come together. Even if the train station was relocated and the new bridge better integrating Ferrybank with the rest of the city was done it would be a huge step forward. Here’s hoping.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 418 ✭✭GandhiwasfromBallyfermot


    Exactly even the infrastructure alone for the NQ would be brilliant. I live in Ferrybank and the new bridge would be transformational for me, I'd cycle over to town for work instead of drive. The dual carriageway and the roundabout at the train station is just too dangerous for that at the moment.

    I will be eagerly awaiting news from today's cabinet.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,639 ✭✭✭south


    It has been approved



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 455 ✭✭Valhalla90


    Approved! Is there any renders of the proposed developments, I know this is infrastructure related the announcement today. A 15 storey hotel is planned. Be good to see the plan for it!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,080 ✭✭✭azimuth17


    Great news,



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 418 ✭✭GandhiwasfromBallyfermot


    Brilliant news, been a long time since cranes were seen in the sky above Waterford. Should see boots on the ground in Q2 2023.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 317 ✭✭nomoedoe




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,759 ✭✭✭✭Jamie2k9


    Great to see some moevment. I think I prefer the artist impressions of this plan but could have been a bit more brave with building height.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 455 ✭✭Valhalla90


    There is plans for a 15 storey building but this doesn't show it. We will know the exact details when it goes for planning under the SDZ!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 773 ✭✭✭Dunmoreroader


    It's fantastic news but I don't see how they can claim it will commence Q2 2023 unless they are going to take major elements of the Falcon master plan. Look at the size of the planning application Falcon submitted, truckloads if I recall, and how long it took to submit.

    My pessimistic (more realistic?) prediction, born of years of dashed hopes and enforced cynicism is Harcourt Dvlpmt. boots on the ground and cranes in the air by Xmas 2023, and we'll be doing well.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 418 ✭✭GandhiwasfromBallyfermot


    The infrastructure contract which is the bridge, roads & moving of the train station will begin in Q2 23, that is separate to the Harcourt development and has separate planning which is already approved. The actual development is a different story and will need a new planning application which I assume will be drafted and submitted while the infrastructure work is going on.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 418 ✭✭GandhiwasfromBallyfermot


    So there's two moving pieces to this:

    The infrastructure contract which should start in Q2 23 now that government approval of the funding is received. A contractor has already been approved by the council for this (rumoured to be BAM) all that's left now is contracts to be signed which was waiting on approval of funds from the government.

    The actual development contract for the buildings, hotel, offices, apartments etc. This is where Harcourt come in. They now have to go for new planning for a SDZ but this development won't actually start until the infrastructure above is complete.



  • Registered Users Posts: 700 ✭✭✭bamayang


    Could the new company make use of any of the previous planning application?


    Is there any "artists impression" of the new train station?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 773 ✭✭✭Dunmoreroader


    Thanks for the clarification. So BAM boots on the ground & cranes in the air no sooner than next April (Q2 2023) and Harcourt boots/cranes no sooner than BAM are finished the infrastructural works? 2025? 2026? Can the infrastructural and commercial works not run concurrently or at least overlap to some extent?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 455 ✭✭Valhalla90


    The infrastructure element and actual development can proceed together. It would make no sense to wait for total completion of the infrastructure works!



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