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Using a keyed chuck with hammer drill mode

  • 08-11-2022 2:16pm
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,037 ✭✭✭Shelga


    Ok I’m coming to Boards because the internet is no help for once! I’m trying to drill holes in an old (circa 1940s) concrete wall, to put up shelves. I have a 7mm masonry drill bit, and a hammer drill.

    It’s a Parkside drill from Lidl, but the instructions say don’t use the keyed chuck in hammer drilling mode?? How else are you meant to use a smaller diameter drill bit though?? I’ve tried drilling the holes using screwing mode only, and I’m just wrecking the walls.

    Help!



Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 71,184 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    I'm presuming this is an SDS with a slot in keyed chuck?

    You can get 7mm SDS bits; you would be best served getting the sizes you need or a set.

    I had to put some 6mm holes in old concrete walls, Dewalt Extreme SDS bits and a 1.1kW Lidl SDS drill was like cutting in to butter. Had to use ear defenders though!

    I've blown out two chuck adapters on that drill, the one it came with plus an Amazon no-name replacement. Have a Bosch one now. I suspect they just get shaken apart by the hammer function.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,479 ✭✭✭The Continental Op


    As above suspect the OP has this drill?

    If so not surprised its making a mess of the wall with the adapter and a masonry bit - too much wobble and most of the SDS effect is lost.

    Just get a 7mm SDS bit.

    Wake me up when it's all over.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,037 ✭✭✭Shelga


    Thank you, yes it’s a 1550W SDS drill with a removable keyed chuck. Am a bit apprehensive now about how much power is required, but I’ll get the SDS drill bits! :o



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,479 ✭✭✭The Continental Op


    An SDS bit will power through concrete. Its not the total power its the way the power is applied to the SDS bit. The SDS function of the drill above is rated at 1.2 joules which is more than enough for DIY SDS drilling in concrete.

    When drilling hard masonry or engineering bricks the difference is astonishing. Where an ordinary hammer drill may take minutes to make even a shallow hole, the SDS will pound through it in seconds.

    With the adaptor you negate the full SDS chucking system effect and add a bit a wobble which never adds to accuracy.

    Wake me up when it's all over.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,037 ✭✭✭Shelga


    Right, nothing is working. No matter what I do, the drill will not penetrate more than half an inch into the wall. I’ve tried creating a guide hole with rotation mode before switching to hammer mode. I’ve tried using different sized bits. The wall is a mess at this stage!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,479 ✭✭✭The Continental Op


    So you went out and got an SDS bit?

    Chances are you have hit a steel lintel?

    Wake me up when it's all over.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,037 ✭✭✭Shelga


    I’m using a different tool now with a keyless chuck, so a standard 6mm masonry drill bit. I had success with some holes but nothing now. So frustrating. Could really old concrete be particularly difficult to drill into?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,479 ✭✭✭The Continental Op


    Could really old concrete be particularly difficult to drill into?

    200% YES but bare is mind you may have hit something other than concrete.

    Wake me up when it's all over.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 71,184 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    What wattage is the new tool?

    The power transfer from a ~800w normal drill via keyless chuck is a fraction of what you'd get from a 1550w SDS using an SDS bit. But as said above, you might have hit something that isn't concrete.

    I had to use a 500w drill last week to put something in 1950s... something. Blocks, I think; might be shuttered concrete. Horrendous.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,330 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu



    So your still not using an actual SDS drill with SDS bits? I drove myself demented trying to put up curtains with a standard mains hammer drill, destroying multiple masonary bits in the process. SDS goes into concrete in seconds by comparison.

    As I understand it, concrete continues to cure more or less forever, so it just keeps getting harder and harder. Concrete lintels are harder than concrete blocks to start with as well.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,370 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    If its a poured concrete wall from the 40s then it will have rebar in it and you are probably hitting that.

    Alternatively it will be full of random stones as aggregate which are incredibly hard. These walls are crazy strong and very hard to demo, nevermind drill into!





  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,638 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    buy an sds bit of the correct size and try that. For the sake of 7 or 8 euro it makes sense.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,479 ✭✭✭The Continental Op


    Wake me up when it's all over.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,638 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    I just based the price on Woodies. Crazy that they didn't just buy one after the advice they were given and decided to try a different drill.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,037 ✭✭✭Shelga


    Thanks everyone. I had to return the original drill as it wasn’t working properly, and got another one but it’s not powerful enough I don’t think- think it’s 500W?

    Does anyone have any suggestions for SDS drills that should definitely work?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 71,184 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Any of them, really. Was that one not working with actual SDS bits or were you continuing with the just the chuck adapter?

    The power going in to the wall with a 500w chuck drill versus a 1550w SDS is like comparing a bicycle to a car in terms of power tbh.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,183 ✭✭✭standardg60


    Completely agree old poured walls were never designed to be drilled into, the stones used are just too big.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,183 ✭✭✭standardg60


    Ha, a bad workman...

    No idea why you didn't heed all the advice above, but if it is a poured wall I'd put the shelves up elsewhere.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,960 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    I have had that drill for 4 years & it's excellent. I have never come across a wall that it wouldn't drill through. From your comments it suggests that the drill was fine but you didn't follow the instructions on how to use it.

    Strange because if it's the Lidl one it would of come with a selection of SDS bits



  • Posts: 0 Eve Wailing Sushi


    never ceases to amaze me when people ask for help on boards, get it, but ignore the help & just change the question they’re asking as they troubleshoot their own problem incorrectly.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,037 ✭✭✭Shelga


    The bit wasn’t spinning at all in the first drill I used. I had to return it. The only other hammer drill Lidl had in stock at that time was less powerful.

    I’m not ignoring people’s suggestions. I’m trying to figure it out.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 71,184 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Those drills have a specific hammer only, chiseling mode that disables rotation. Is there any chance at all that that mode was engaged?

    I used it with the chisel bits it comes with to demolish the supports for an old oil tank, it is really useful - but only for that specific use!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,037 ✭✭✭Shelga


    I tried it in hammer mode, rotation mode, chiselling mode- it wasn’t spinning at all, just making noise.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,370 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    If its poured concrete you are going to be driven demented trying to get a number of holes in specific locations, you might get lucky and get 1 or two but never them all as you will just hit impenetrable aggregate. (And worst case would be you blow out a large stone and a chunk of your wall comes down)

    Time to move onto free standing shelves (Ikea Billy Bookcase anyone?) Or move the shelves to a different wall.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,370 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    Are you sure you had the SDS keyed chuck bit inserted correctly? You need to pull back the locking sleeve, push in the SDS chuck bit and then release the sleeve, you may need to rotate the chuck bit so that it catches.

    Noise with no movement sounds a lot like the chuck bit was sitting in the sleeve without actually being held....could you just pull the chuck bit out? (You shouldnt be able to without releasing the locking sleeve on the drill!)

    Post edited by GreeBo on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,183 ✭✭✭standardg60


    I don't think they ever got a SDS bit, probably just burned out the bushes on the original drill.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,370 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    Well the keyed chuck was SDS if the drill was an SDS drill...I hope :)

    But I'll edit my answer for clarity!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,183 ✭✭✭standardg60


    That's true, though i've never used the adapter, just SDS bits directly. As Continental says above i doubt using the chuck is half as effective.

    Anyway it's gone back to the shop now, OP no longer has an SDS drill so we'll never know.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,037 ✭✭✭Shelga


    I did buy an SDS bit and inserted it the way Greebo helpfully suggested, pulled the locking thing back until it clicked into place, and when I turned it on, it made tons of noise but just didn’t move at all!

    I have kind of abandoned the task for now, as I was getting so frustrated with it for 2 days and don’t have time to go to Screwfix to buy a 1500W SDS drill this week, but I genuinely appreciate all the responses and was not trying to ignore any advice.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,183 ✭✭✭standardg60


    Ah ok sorry didn't realise you'd got one, you didn't mention it just that the drill wasn't working.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,479 ✭✭✭The Continental Op


    OK so did you actually try drilling with it? Some SDS drills don't really do much until the bit is pushed up against what you are drilling.

    Wake me up when it's all over.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,183 ✭✭✭standardg60


    Rather conveniently where I'm currently working has examples of both old blockwork and poured concrete.

    The aggregate used in the blocks is far bigger than modern blocks so if you hit one of the stones with a hammer drill you'll be there a while. The SDS bit went in no problem though.

    The poured wall on the other hand has even bigger stones, that's a piece of 3x2 timber for reference, and you can end up weakening the structure trying to fix into it, as you can see from the myriad of holes from previous attempts.

    It's in pretty poor shape now as a result, I left the batten in place for fear of causing more removing it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,479 ✭✭✭The Continental Op


    ^^^^^

    Not near the sea are you? That looks suspiciously like concrete made from beach stones.

    Wake me up when it's all over.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,183 ✭✭✭standardg60


    No, but i imagine that's where a lot of them came from back in the day, a lot easier than digging them out of the ground.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,370 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    Im no where near the sea and my garden walls are the exact same, thankfully the house is solid brick!



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