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US Midterms 2022 - Read OP before posting

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,897 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Same as everyone else who votes I presume.

    Whoever is most closely aligned with their ideals....



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    So If a Democrat ran on an Anti immigration policy and Racist voted for them that's the candidates fault ?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,897 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    At the House of Representatives level, the Senate level, the White House level, the Republicans are disjointed and in disarray. And it is fantastic to see. After 6 years of their incredibly regressive rhetoric and completely selfish actions, they finally are turning their hatred inwards.

    Jo Biden did this, his measured and focused performance over the last 2.5 years, since he was made the Democratic nominee has given an example to America of what real politics should look like. He has to keep going, he owes it to the younger voters and the progressives to repay the effort and loyalty they have shown him through the last two elections to give them a reason to do so again in 2024. The country came very close to falling off the edge if it had empowered those who denied the reality of the 2020 election, it has to continue moving away from such people.

    The wheel is always turning, the Republicans will come to the fore again, that's necessary in fact, but for once it looks like people who should never have gotten near the sort of power that they had access to have been given a clear message that the country has no time for the nonsense that they have come out with and that many of their supporters continue to come out with.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 84,804 ✭✭✭✭Overheal




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 84,804 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Now that Pennsylvanians have chosen to reject an astroturfed senate candidate, Abbott has chosen the state to be a new focal point in his political grandstanding, I'm not sure what message this is sending to the moderate and center-right voters in PA other than some form of political retaliation for not holding their noses and eating the Wegners crudite.




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  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,980 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    You've got to admire the brass neck of Rick Scott in trying to oust McConnell following a terrible election.

    An Election that he was in charge of for the Republican party.

    But it's McConnell's fault somehow.

    Not defending McConnell btw, he's an abominable excuse for a human being, but Rick Scott is another special example of the GOP.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,023 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    Can't wait for the Gaetz Vs MG Taylor fight!



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Yet again, no evidence that DeSantis is involved or associated with "fascism".

    The empty smear is more empty than I thought.

    And by the way, false whataboutery doesn't an argument make.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,023 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    Looking good for the re-run with Trump announcing



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,625 ✭✭✭✭duploelabs


    He didn't denounce them. RDS might not be a fascist but he's the #1 candidate amongst fascists, says a lot about the company you keep when you cheer him on



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Okay and I'm going to take this moment to not denounce the Flat Earth Society. Does that mean I actively support the Flat Earth Society? Does it mean I've been holding a secret crush for the Flat Earth Society my entire life?

    This kind of stuff borderlines on delusionary conspiracy theories.

    Imagine if hordes of your political opponents were knocking on your door, demanding that you denounce the Flat Earth Society. Would you give them what they want? Would you want to give the Flat Earth Society extra, undeserved publicity?

    Of course not. I certainly wouldn't do it!

    Why not?

    Because as I said before, certain extreme groups in society are already self-discrediting and, unless there is some evidence to suggest that DeSantis has actively supported Neo-Nazism in his life, we can pay him the respect of assuming that he doesn't support Neo-Nazism or fascism.

    It's really not complicated.

    This is just a nasty tactic by some Democrats to smear DeSantis' name. That's all, it's got nothing to do with the truth. Nothing at all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,625 ✭✭✭✭duploelabs


    Aside from the strawman argument (don't remember the flat earth society killing 6 million Jews and waging war across Europe), Did the flat earth society come out in support of RDS? If so, show us where?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    And I'm sure some murderers, rapists, and other unsavoury characters in society have voted for both the Democrats and Republicans.

    What's your point?

    That every unsavoury person must be individually condemned, lest you be on the side of those unsavoury people?

    What is this? It's certainly not a sophisticated argument. Give me a break...this is getting embarrassing now.

    Unless you have evidence that DeSantis is actively involved in fascism (or has been in the past), he does not need to denounce any already self-discrediting group in society. He doesn't need to give them the oxygen of publicity.

    Where is the evidence that DeSantis has been involved in fascism?

    I'm waiting for it...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,560 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    If Neo Nazis supported Joan Burton then I'm fairly certain she would make it as obvious as she possibly could that she wants absolutely nothing to do with them

    Also, Joan Burton wouldn't have policies that appeal to neo nazis, and if she did, she would need to do a bit of self reflection about what she's actually in favour of



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,560 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Nobody needs to condemn Neo-Nazis?

    Are you serious??

    The Nazis aren't leprechauns, they're not mythical creatures. They're real people who seek power and the last time they succeeded in taking control of a major industrial country, 50 million people were violently killed

    Nazis should be condemned absolutely every time stick their heads over the parapet.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,811 ✭✭✭joe40


    If an Irish politician had the same policies, values and views and as De Santis would you support him.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,495 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    Its a good thing that you started this discussion with zero credibility.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,511 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,625 ✭✭✭✭duploelabs




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,897 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    It's really not complicated, says the guy inventing all sort of complicated 'what if's' to avoid facing the fact that it is very relevant that DeSantis comments on Flag waving Nazi's because Flag waving Nazi's are coming out to support him.

    No one is asking him to denounce every hateful group on the planet, just those that are flying his flag beside hateful ones, if you can't grasp that, then the only thing I can tell you is to remind you of the phrase that 'it's better to have your mouth shut and be thought of as a fool, than to open it and remove all doubt'.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Still no evidence that DeSantis is a fascist then?

    Yup, precisely my point.

    You're merely complaining that DeSantis hasn't condemned a fringe group that almost nobody supports, and who no self-respecting person would think about, let alone amplify the attention given to them by talking about them.

    As I say, desperate stuff.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,897 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    FFS. No. How could it be.

    The issue here is DeSantis refused to distance himself from hateful people who clearly support him. That's it. Nothing else.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Even if we grant the premise that what you say about me were true (and it most certainly is not true), it still wouldn't undermine the point I made re: Ron DeSantis and fascism.

    In other words, you are engaging in a logical fallacy known as Tu quoque.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,422 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    11 seats left to call in the House. Still on track to be 221-214 in favour of the Republicans when the dust settles.

    3 of the 4 tightest races left are ones where Democrats are winning so, if anything that lead could increase for the Republicans.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,897 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    I'm imagining you now with little pet strawmen figurines by your computer that you are playfighting with as you rail against the evil liberals.

    No one said that DeSantis is a fascist because he has supporters who are Nazis, we've said that he has refused to denounce these fascist supporters. That is not a good look. You turning yourself in to knots to try to absolve him from this is comical.

    Also, I did point out that DeSantis policy of book banning does resemble Nazi approaches in 1930's Germany. Others have pointed out his use of military and police force imagery to project a certain image is also similar to what such regimes do. Nazi's overwhelmingly support Conservative candidates, that much is indisputable.

    And DeSantis refused to distance himself from this fact. That is telling, and unsurprising in a country where Conservatives haven't won the popular vote in nearly 20 years, they need to hold on to every vote they can.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,860 ✭✭✭hynesie08




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,897 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    At this point, the Democrats are actually better off if the Republicans have the house, it shines a light on their division and should motivate Democrats for 2024.

    If Democrats were to retain it, it would like the Senate for the last 2 years with all commentary saying they should have legislation sail through but with covert operators like Sinema and Manchin able to disrupt that.

    Also, given Pelosi's husbands recent experience, her being out of the limelight to some degree is probably better also.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,980 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Agreed - With a margin of only 3 or 4 seats to play with the GOP will eat themselves alive trying to do anything.

    McCarthy only managed to get 180 votes in the internal leadership vote last night , meaning that he has to convince another ~40 of them to vote for him on the House floor in January to even take the leadership gavel. Him being able to achieve that is far from a given.

    Watching them consume each other as they try to block the Democrat agenda , whilst terrible for America may actually be good in the longer term as it will show how utterly unfit they are for governance in their current guise.

    Here's an easy bet - I guarantee that not a single piece of GOP legislation will be passed by the House that isn't some pointless attack on Democrats or some stupid "Anti-Woke , Pro-Freedom" nonsense.

    They will not put forward a single thing to actually try to help the American people - Nothing on Healthcare , nothing on Social Security , Nothing on Education (apart from "banning CRT!!!!!").

    Nothing.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,778 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    Not trying to sound snide, but why do you think they want to get anything done? The GQP 'm.o.' has been, block those evil Democrats. With a majority in the House, they can do that. They'll be dragged kicking and screaming to keep the government running in budget negotiations, but they'll fade at the end as they got hammered for that.

    But otherwise, maybe they'll do some harmless things like announced new Post Office names or rename some military bases. Nothing more. Nothing substantial. Lots and lots of posturing for the cameras, though.

    When the Democrats lost the house in 2010, the GQP took over...and did nothing.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,422 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout



    The Republicans will no doubt use the House advantage to do things that will please their base but irritate the average voter, such as:

    • Hold numerous hearings on issues that are conflated way beyond their real world impact (e.g. holding 6 hearings on Benghazi)
    • Shutting down the Federal Government over the Debt Ceiling
    • Impeach Biden over something absolutely trivial or irrelevant (this might now be less likely given how tight it is and how many Republicans in swing districts might not want to do it)
    • Block any moderate bills that might set out to help the average person economically
    • Introduce bills on Culture War issues that have absolutely no hope of passing in order to please their base ("A Federal ban on teaching CRT", for example)


    All of that can only help Biden in 2024



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