Russia - threadbanned users in OP

Ukraine are not on any hook.

They are blameless. Reiterated by Poland, NATO, USA and everyone else.

Although the UK appear not to have announced a formal decision on what happened, or even mild speculation. AFAIK.

They is no logical explanation that I can think of why Zelenskyy would double down on it.

The coordinates thing is freaky, but I imagine just one of those things.

I certainly take your point about Ukraine being blameless. My "off the hook" turn of phrase was meant in the most general sense, not intending to apportion culpability. They wouldn't be firing any missiles if Russia wasn't trying to destroy them, and it is certainly great to see the unilateral support Ukraine are getting from its allies on this matter.

As someone who occasionally deals in co-ordinate systems and there are many different systems and projections, the cockup theory is entirely believable where any manual input of figures is involved. I've seen many examples of rogue data, even the omission of a simple +/-

Target 53.42797607873251, -7.929273201583614 and your missile hits Athlone. Target 53.42797607873251, 7.929273201583614 and oops, you blow up some poor suckers near Friedeburg in Germany.

Then why aren't NATO saying that is what likely happened? I mean, if we're discussing it here on Boards, it's hardly news to them.

Anyway all this gets away from the relentless attack on civilian infrastructure in Ukraine, designed to create a humanitarian crisis and drive more refugees to the EU.

We may give up on the UN to stop this, they've shown themselves to be useless in this conflict. But what can the EU, Allies, NATO etc do to stop this use of missiles? Is there not sufficient justification there now in terms of threat to both NATO states in terms of refugees and the crass disregard for civilians to intervene and tell Russia that enough is enough and that agreed airspaces will be defended from now on. Defended is the key word, the onus will then be on Russia if they choose to further engage in this way.

He could at least have left a note to explain how he manged to shoot himself five times with four different pistols.

Novaya Gazeta offers a bleak vision of Russia's post-war future, with a depleted national guard, eroded security services, thousands of demoralized, disenfranchised soldiers, and in the fall out, PMCs like Wagner seizing control of state functions. If I was a Russian elite, be it Kremlin-connected, or heading up a corporation, I'd be watching events very carefully now. The French revolutionaries' favourite method of dispatch was the guillotine, perhaps in Russia, it will be the sledgehammer. It makes for chilling reading...

It would seem that the missile came from a Russian source, whether that was launched from russia, Belarus or Ukraine (by russia). If so we can say that Poland knows and so will USA. The question is why deny that, what possible reason would they do that. Yes they might not want to get drawn further into this war, but why worry about that. Russia has proven it will do nothing to countries helping Ukraine. My guess is Poland/USA/and some others like UK are now plotting a very large escalation in Ukraine and need to keep it quiet until the act is implemented, why would they publically declare "we know you done it, we're gona get ya"

To me this is the most logical conclusion, an allied push, to drive Russia home. That might have to wait until April when the weather permits, but that's only 4 months of planning, procurement and logistics. No point in showing your hand.

Zelensky could be in on it, playing the role he currently has been, time will tell.

The reason Zelenski might be doubling down on it is because they don't believe the missile was theirs and because their experts believe the debris they have seen indicates it was a KH-101 stealth cruise missile, not to mention they can probably account for every S-300 they fired.

The question that should be asked is why Ukrainian experts are not being allowed to look at the evidence directly? There's one standout reason for that.

Russian forces shoot a boat to sink it while retreating across the Dnieper river.

This then attracts the interest of their trigger happy comrades who shoot at them in an exchange of "friendly fire".

Karma is a b1tch.

What a naive question. It's not a certainty, but it is a risk. And you would need to spell out a more detailed scenario before getting even an approximate estimate of the risk.

In a full scale nuclear war, London would not only be hit by one warhead, but perhaps several. Maybe even 5 or 6. As well as every other major city in the UK including Belfast. I think the Soviets also had a plan to nuke Dublin as well so as not to give the UK a safe haven on their eastern border in which to regroup after the fact.

Even still, with the massive amount of nuclear fallout, we would be fucked.

More great sound effects-

The last guest I recall speaking out like this came back the next day very humble and very patriotic, I suspect it will be the same with this guy