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The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 3) Mod Notes and Threadbanned List in OP

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  • Registered Users Posts: 18,774 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    But my point is on a political and background level the majority of those in the ROI have very little in common with that SF/NI rhetoric.

    Even SF policies in NI are tailored for that audience which would not wash/resonate with the majority of ROI voters.

    Barring the occasional embarrassing slip up the SF Republican rhetoric is much toned down compared to the NI SF stuff.

    Instead the strategy is populist for the ROI even though the SF policies in NI are vastly different.

    For example 2015 Stormont SF endorsed Social Welfare Cuts.


    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,609 ✭✭✭Fionn1952


    How do you propose paying for looking after ordinary workers if you're creating an economy that is hostile to those international companies paying the salaries of those of us who's tax you're hoping will pay for it?

    I'm no proponent of trickle down economics, and I fully agree with providing support to those who need it most. I believe that people working should be paid a living wage, I support our strong social welfare funding; I'm not arguing against protecting the poorest people in the state, but I sure as sh*t don't think nuking our economy is going to solve it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,928 ✭✭✭Bishop of hope


    And I take that point too. But economically we need those multinationals, no govt here can deliver anything without them.

    Corporation tax is what's paying for our give aways at present and any that SF of on power will want to finance. There's a fine balance needed to keep them here.

    I'd say SF in govt will be a big disappointment to those following them on the premise of being better off.



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    It's going have to be done sooner than later,as would seem clear to me that tech is headed for collapse,and corporate tax rate likely rise over next few years..

    the likelihood of the commission for taxation on generational wealth becoming reality is near certainty



    Easiest way to look after low paid workers is to raise wages,we have record inflation at same time as record corporate profits.....seems obvious to me,what is the issue is anyway



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,482 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    Raising wages to help the low paid has a knock on effect .

    Those with more more qualifications will want the differential maintained.

    And rightly so….



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,051 ✭✭✭rolling boh


    If somehow SF manage to be part of the next government their voters will have their hopes dashed fairly quickly when the difficult choices in power have to be made .SF will find out along with whoever is in with them that all the big talk is just talk .I can understand people looking at them while the present parties have failed on the big issues like housing health etc but SF will do little to improve things if even that .



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Ya,the knock on effect being improving the income and lifestyle of the low paid💪


    A rising base wage,rises wages for everyone and improves things for everyone ....it's only propaganda from the rich that leads to accusations of inflation..... inflation happens anyway irregardless of wage increases



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,313 ✭✭✭mikethecop


    lol that how you think the economy works eh ?

    just give everyone loads of money and everything will be grand ?



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Except nowhere did I say,nor insinuate this....


    quite what you hope to achieve by posting non-sequiters is beyond me🤷,perhaps you would be better served by shouting at paintings?🤔



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,313 ✭✭✭mikethecop


    Shouting at paintings ? does that mean something



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  • Registered Users Posts: 55,694 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    How you reckon SF, who are anti capitalism, anti Enterprise, anti Europe, anti anyone doing well for themselves, anti multinationals will look after all these poor downtrodden people?

    the magic money tree?

    btw, what is an “ordinary” worker?



  • Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 76,290 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    Posts deleted

    Do not discuss Hutch and his trial or Dowdall

    Post edited by Beasty on


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,774 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    It is a nice Non Hutch/Dowdall story. A nice harmless Martin Ferris one.

    As usual SF the party of contradictions- the party that reminds us that the IRA is gone. It is in the past. We must move on from the past etc.

    But This same party set up a ‘closed door’ do for Martin Ferris to ‘celebrate’ his life and times in ‘the struggle’.

    Simon Harris was asked to comment on it. But no doubt certain quarters will spin such comments as the usual ‘freestater stuff’ And those quarters will wonder aloud why such parties are bringing up the past.

    When the real reason is SF etc don’t want the details highlighted to the masses! Only to ‘Celebrate the struggle’ and keep it nice and vague and fluffy. But let’s not go into details, that is so unfair!

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    What is substantially different to what he done,than roger casement?


    Bring up the past alright,but don't try claim any difference between violence 100 years ago and the troubles,while labeling others as contradictions 👏👏



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,774 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    A treaty was signed about 100 years ago Ireland moved on, and SF was stuck in the past, SF did not want to accept the will on the people of the Free State/ROI, that was one major difference after casement.

    Other major differences in the ROI the functions of the state including the Gardai are supported by the majority in the ROI. It is not a foreign state or foreign forces, but my country.

    Any person should have more respect for my country and the institutions thereof IMO. Casement fought forces representing a foreign power with no mandate.

    Farris on the other hand did not recognise the country he was born in. with no mandate. Casement got a mandate based on a sympathy vote after his death. 1918 elections and so on.

    Whereas in the ROI which SF/Provos saw ROI institutions as a 'legitimate targets' despite the fact, the vast majority of people in the ROI support the ROI institutions gardai, judiciary. courts etc

    SF/Provos did not recognise the Free State/ROI. SF/Provos still don't really, but are slowly catching up to reality. But it is a slow process of normalisation.

    Ferris had no mandate of the Irish people at time of his offences - and collecting murderers of gardai shows his contempt of the ROI institutions/law and order.

    The only reason SF have some form of a mandate now, is because they stopped killing Gardai, children, elderly at funerals and so on. Do you see the differences? Most citizens of the ROI did not want the Provos, so the Provos had to change tactics, to get any mandate from the Irish people.

    Post edited by gormdubhgorm on

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    So a round about,long winded way,to say their was no effective or practical difference between them🤣


    Looks to me,there contradictions about alright,but you may perhaps check the mirror to find em



    The bloke gave his life to a political movement,gave up an reasonably high profile sporting career because he could not turn a blind eye to the situation in the north....those blokes released for killing a gaurd served their sentences and in theory their debt to society,unless yous don't believe in justice and prefer vengeance 🤔


    But it mostly highlighted the sectarian contradictory nature of free state more than anything.....what did not releasing em under the gfa say to families of killed RUC officers,only their lives were worth less



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,313 ✭✭✭mikethecop


    are you seriously comparing martin ferris to Roger casement ?

    really ?



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,774 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm



    The poster is because to do otherwise and admit there is fundamental differences the whole house of cards will fall down in their warped little minds.

    Such as as Provos/Ferris et al not viewing the ROI as a state, despite the fact the vast majority of the citizens despising the Provos/SF. Basically the Provos/SF were enemies of the Irish people they attacked my country and it's institutions. They did not recognise the courts of the ROI. Even to this day 'New SF' cannot utter the words Republic of Ireland.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Nothing quite like an ad hominem attack,when unable to discuss subject matter with facts and logic🤔


    Out of your depth,yous literally brought up Martin Ferris and when engaged with,ended up having resorting to refering to anyone who deosnt fall in line with your dogmatic,rather extreme position,as having 'warped little minds'



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,774 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    No I think you need to reread. What you have is cognitive dissonance, a condition many in SF still suffer from to this day. The Provos are/were enemies to my country and it's institutions as a proud citizen of the ROI. I don't care about NI they are not really like us in the ROI, and have more in common with the Unionists - because of an equally warped mindset.

    Casement never attacked a country and institutions that were the representation of the Irish people, for the Irish people and by the Irish people. Which were give a mandate for that Representation. What Casement attacked was British rule. What Ferris attacked was Irish institutions, and the country I live in the ROI.

    Of course there is another major difference between Casement and Ferris. Ferris was a much better footballer. The only obvious similarity to me between Ferris and Casement. Is that both had Beards. After that the whole context is completely different.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



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  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Except I haven't any cognitive dissonance,you may like contractions have to check the mirror there (your attempts to proclaim one violence good,other bad at same objective is a classic example btw!)....


    What is the difference between casement being arrested for gunrunning and Martin Ferris for the same🙂....kinda hilarious your inability to admit they being same in practice and effectiveness


    Be kind of curious to see what state owned institutions yous feel Ferris attacked🤔,


    The man being an elected offial,who likely has done more service to the state than 99% of population



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,774 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    No point in engaging if you are not addressing my points -

    You asked me the difference between Casement and Ferris and I told you.

    The main ones being the institions that both men attacked -

    1) Ferris attacked an Irish state founded by Irish people for Irish people - there was a majority mandate for that Irish State FreeState/ROI. Ferris was attacking an Irish State against the wishes of the majority of the Irish people, an organisation which had no qualms of killing his countrymen in the ROI and the representatives of the Irish institutions.

    The Provos had no qualms in killing Gardai that was the group Ferris was part of - the Provos. No doubt he did the usual SF/Provo thing and not recognise the Irish courts either. Ferris also refused to condemn the murder of Garda Gerry McCabe. Ferris also robbed banks in the ROI.

    2) Casement only attacked British forces in Ireland, and British institions in Ireland.

    Major difference.

    --

    Now I can understand why you as a SF/Provo supporter cannot see this difference. Because it is what I would call the 'SF/Provo sickness'.

    You focus on the gunrunning, but who were those guns aimed at?

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I asked was there any difference in what Ferris done and what casement done....and yous started rambling on about 1918 elections and mandates (while elsewhere dispising abstenionism in modern era as regards Westminster),of which neither were alive for


    So unable to name actual incident of Ferris attacking state institutions,yous fall back to dogma and rethoric 👏👏,who needs facts and logic,when dogma and feelings will do🤷



    Casement attacked noone in Ireland (still isn't buried where he wished to be either😪),he was arrested attempting to land arms,same as Ferris....which is somehow different in practical and effective terms for you,for reasons unstated



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,774 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm



    I have a few times at this stage = the institutions attacked Ferris robbed a PO and Bank in the ROI that is an Irish institution. Irish citizens money. Ferris guns could be pointed at Gardai, or any in the ROI who got in the way of the provos campaign of terror which included the Irish State - ROI.

    Also Ferris refused to condemn the murder of his fellow Kerryman Garda McCabe. Which shows he has a Provo mindset has no respect for the institute of the Garda Siochana. An Irish institution. You can put as many clap emojis as you like. But you are not reading my replies, and just playing the SF obtuse game. Sniggering behind the balaclava is what I call it.

    The very fact you think there is no difference to Casement and Ferris is the very definition of not only SF dogma, but dogma itself.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    So no actual state owned institutions attacked then,took a while,but you got there alright🙂,now which PO do you think Ferris robbed (noting of course,you have shifted goal posts from attacked to robbed,because you've been exposed on facts and logic ground)



    Why would he condemn it?what does politics of condemnation achieve??...same as the hollow words of condemnation offered on the attacks on psni this week in Strabane,while blind eye turned to thousand plus people put under effective lockdown,while British army was out and about.....politics of condemnation is the politics of reactionairy clowns,plenty in SF deserving of criticism for indulging in same there TBF



    Except despite several long winded,abusive dogmatic posts,you haven't shown any practical or effective differences between the two.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,774 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    Ladies and Gentlemen behold the SF/Provo mindset. No matter how you dress it up Ferris attacked Irish institutions and does not have the balls to condemn the murder of his fellow Kerryman murdered in the line of duty.

    What does condemnation achieve? It shows maturity, humanity and the recognition of grievous wrong. Not doing shows how the SF/Provo mindset is warped. So instead we get the mental gymnastics and 'republican phrases' which you seem to have learned and parrot 'What does the politics of condemnation achieve?'

    I just told you. If a SF member or sitting SF TD did condemn the murder of a Garda by the provos, would they be asked the leave the party or would they be shunned by the party faithful or something?

    Post edited by gormdubhgorm on

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    So no actual answer as regards what it achieves,👏👏just another ad hominem and rethoric laden post,devoid of facts,which relies on feelings and abuse to paper over deficit of factual inout


    Given no gaurd,nor state offial comes out and condemns any IRA members killed by gaurds/state in last 100 years, particularly last 50,would anyone be kicked out of any other party ,for condemning say the murder of hugh henir killed in Clare during the troubles....or is this one of those murders that are ok,but totally not a contradiction?


    We have the last of the centenary of anniversaries coming up in Newcastle next summer,will we have state representatives there to condemn the killing of Liam lynch,or will the media/political class here simply gloss over it,like they do to the several hundred summery executions of the civil war? (Of course we won't,as condemnation achieve nothing in practical terms)




    ETA: politics of condemnation was best articulated by Muslims during time they were subjected in awlful abuse and racism years ago https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.aljazeera.com/amp/opinions/2017/7/11/from-politics-of-condemnation-to-politics-of-refusal

    Its a fairly broad concept,that you would dismiss it as "parroting phrases",makes me qs,your depth of input into politics over last 10 years,


    given shinners seem to have smashed cultural hedgemony within the 26 counties,except to learn more about it,as critiques are expected to be pushed more to drone about Marxism over next 18 months😎

    Post edited by [Deleted User] on


  • Posts: 2,725 [Deleted User]



    There will never be a United Ireland until the festering boil that is SF is lanced. The stench of nationalism is becoming worrying. We need to be very careful.



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,901 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    That is incredibly offensive. And there will be posters who will defend that behaviour.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    It involves a level of gloating and supremacy that is equal to orange men marching down the Garvahy road.


    This is their vision for a future - one where orange men and green men goad and mock each other over their murdered relatives. Lovely.



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