Little changes we can make to normalise cycling and encourage its uptake

Thelonious Monk · 21-11-2022 4:28pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119901568#Comment_119901568

I do actually. I break them all the time. When no one is at a pedestrian crossing I'd slow down but still go through a red. I turn left on reds all the time. Pretty much every time I go out on a bike I do these things, which is daily. I don't believe the same laws should apply to cyclists that apply to motorists, it doesn't make sense.

21-11-2022 4:52pm

https://www.irishtimes.com/crime-law/courts/2022/11/21/blind-man-who-was-drunk-while-cycling-before-crashing-into-a-car-has-been-fined/

This is a really good development, bad cyclist behaviour has consequences.

Stamping out cyclists who break the rules of the road will do more to encourage others to take up cycling as it will reduce accidents involving cyclists thereby lessening the perception that cycling is dangerous.

I as a pedestrian dont think I should stop at pedestrians lights either, I mean why should i obey a red light,sure what harm am I going to do if I cause a cyclist to fall off his bike when he collides with me.

Seth Brundle · 21-11-2022 5:07pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902575#Comment_119902575

Gotta love your faux concern there.

Whilst the fella was both pissed and legally blind, he should not have been on a bike. However, your eagerness to highlight a wrongdoing by someone on a bike is quite transparent. Whilst it does show that the gardai take action against people on bikes when necessary, your point that it will make the perception of cycling being safer is completely without basis.

Again, your faux concern would look more real were you to post links to other recent articles, even something general such as this...

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-style/people/2022/11/19/remembering-road-traffic-victims-we-had-no-notice-of-mammys-death-and-that-haunts-us/

blanch152 · 21-11-2022 5:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119901482#Comment_119901482

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119901490#Comment_119901490

To be honest, I have condemned all bad road behaviour, I have also pointed out that the same people often cycle, drive and walk, so the groups are interchangeable and that the bad behaviour can occur across all three categories by the same person. I have also pointed out to a general Irish cultural issue with following norms of good behaviour.

The only criticism I have received for my all-encompassing criticism has been from those who defend all cyclists all of the time.

21-11-2022 5:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902632#Comment_119902632

We are talking about how to increase numbers cycling though and part of that is to improve the behaviour of cyclists on the road.

If you are constantly witnessing adult males speeding through red lights, cycling at speed on footpaths, weaving in and out of cars,coming out of nowhere with no lights, no reflective gear etc you are going to be afraid of them.

You certainly wont be thinking cycling looks like a nice hobby I might take up, you might think I want to stay as far away from the selfish cyclists as I can so I will stick to my car.

My niece was raging the other day, a motorist wound down the window to shout at her because she wasnt wearing a reflective vest, motorist said niece couldnt be seen.

I said you should have been wearing a vest and the motorist had every right to shout at you, you probably gave her a bad fright.

blanch152 · 21-11-2022 5:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902465#Comment_119902465

Eh, no they don't. I have broken road traffic rules as a pedestrian, cyclist and driver, as have most people. Defending one category when all are at fault for bad behaviour on the spurious ground that the consequences are different even though the behaviour is the same is the hypocrites way out.

Your position can neatly be summed up as it is ok for cyclists to ignore every rule and every law as they only discommode and scare elderly walkers, pedestrians with dogs, young mothers with prams and don't actually kill them.

Edit: Not to mention the cyclist on the path ringing a bell aggressively at a blind person.

magicbastarder · 21-11-2022 5:22pm

and this is why many cyclists recommend not using a bell. 'ringing a bell aggressively' could just be 'ringing a bell' to many people.

Macy0161 · 21-11-2022 5:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902690#Comment_119902690

And also a legal requirement to have one, to what purpose if to ring it is to do so "aggressively".

Seth Brundle · 21-11-2022 5:28pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902655#Comment_119902655

We are talking about how to increase numbers cycling though and part of that is to improve the behaviour of cyclists on the road.

Yes but call me a cynic but your posts tend to be pointing fingets towards the evil cyclists, etc.

If you are constantly witnessing adult males speeding through red lights, cycling at speed on footpaths, weaving in and out of cars,coming out of nowhere with no lights, no reflective gear etc you are going to be afraid of them.

But I'm not constantly witnessing that. What I do witness is many people driving to the point that they are a danger to vulnerable road users. I see this when I drive, cycle or walk.

I do occasionally see people breaking red lights whilst on a bike. However, this is usually kids near a school I pass on my way to work. Ironically, it is rare not to see some drivers break red lights at every set on my commute - many of them overtake me (stopped for the red light) to do so.

You certainly wont be thinking cycling looks like a nice hobby I might take up, you might think I want to stay as far away from the selfish cyclists as I can so I will stick to my car.

Again - "selfish cyclists" - you've met them all and discovered whether they were selfish or not? Or are you making even more baseless generalisations?

My niece was raging the other day, a motorist wound down the window to shout at her because she wasnt wearing a reflective vest, motorist said niece couldnt be seen.

I said you should have been wearing a vest and the motorist had every right to shout at you, you probably gave her a bad fright.

Why should she have worn a reflective vest? There is no legal requirement and there is actually no evidence to support the claim that these make a difference - it is more a convenience to blame a victim by drivers who are driving too fast and not able to see everything arpound them.

You don't even mention the stupidity of the ignorant driver seeing that she wasnt wearing a reflective vest yet couldn't see her - Schrödinger's driver who can see her but can't see her!

That said, if I were your niece, I'd have said back to you that you're just a prick for saying that to me. But I'm not your niece!

Seth Brundle · 21-11-2022 5:29pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902713#Comment_119902713

It is not a legal requirement on all bikes.

AndrewJRenko · 21-11-2022 5:30pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902669#Comment_119902669

I know it’s a mad idea, but do you think maybe you should sort out your own law breaking first, before you make a big song and dance about other who are basically doing the same as you?

21-11-2022 5:38pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902714#Comment_119902714

I think its pretty stupid to cycle on a pitch dark rainy evening and not take personal responsibility for your own safety by making yourself as visible as possible. You want to put the entire responsibility on the driver so we will have to agree to disagree. I mean maybe the driver was almost on top of my niece before she saw her and she could have seen her from much further back if she had been dressed appropriately.

I mean fat use your bike camera is going to be if you are under the wheels of a car and how much better for you if a driver sees your vest in time to react.

It is a pity that cyclists cant use common sense and wear reflective clothing, maybe we do need to make reflective clothing mandatory.

I actually rarely see drivers breaking red lights but I see cyclists breaking them all the time, Im usually the only cyclist to stop on red when Im cycling.

And of course the children are breaking the red lights, they are copying the adult cyclist behaviour, if they didnt see adults careering though red lights then they wouldnt do it either.

blanch152 · 21-11-2022 5:42pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902727#Comment_119902727

"I have broken" doesn't mean "I still break" so actually, the first part of your post is sorted, so I can actually make a big song and dance about others who excuse certain bad behaviour while hypocritically criticising others. As I said already, you trivialise bad behaviour purely on the basis it doesn't kill people.

Seth Brundle · 21-11-2022 5:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902760#Comment_119902760

I think its pretty stupid to cycle on a pitch dark rainy evening and not take personal responsibility for your own safety by making yourself as visible as possible. You want to put the entire responsibility on the driver so we will have to agree to disagree. I mean maybe the driver was almost on top of my niece before she saw her and she could have seen her from much further back if she had been dressed appropriately.

I mean fat use your bike camera is going to be if you are under the wheels of a car and how much better for you if a driver sees your vest in time to react.

It is a pity that cyclists cant use common sense and wear reflective clothing, maybe we do need to make reflective clothing mandatory.

I'm taking it for granted that she had working lights (given you didn't mention berating her for not having them). Lights are what people see in the dark. Reflective clothing is only visible in the dark when lights are shone on them - in which case the person would probably be seen anyhow.

However, despite working lights and high-viz, I still get close passed by drivers regularly. Go figure.

Again, you claim to be pushing for safer cycling but all the time, you're placing the entire burden for it on the shoulders of the person on bike. Your arguments are all used by those who have a bugbear about cycling hence my cynicism in terms of what you post.

21-11-2022 6:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902819#Comment_119902819

Yes, she does have lights on the bike but she crossed a line of traffic and was turning so the front and back light wouldnt have given her enough visibility to an oncoming car.

Its an incredibly stupid thing to do. Where does taking a bit of personal responsibility for your own safety become placing a burden on anyone,seriously, you continue to tell your family not to wear hi vis vests because they dont legally have to, I will not only tell my niece to cop herself On, I will actually go out and buy a couple of vests for her to wear.

They make an enormous difference on cold dark wet evenings, its nonsense to say they dont, I wouldnt go anywhere without mine in the winter and in fact many cyclists and pedestrians wear them during the daytime too.

I have no bugbear about cycling, I have a bugbear about entitled male cyclists bullying other road users and your posts here today are an example of that.

b v · 21-11-2022 6:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119897732#Comment_119897732

Went out today for my first spin in ages. Just a quick 3 or 4 km.

I pumped up my tyres in the petrol station ✅

I checked my brakes front and back✅

I made sure my front and rear lights and helmet lights were on ✅

My new rear-facing camera was on ✅

My road tax ❌ unfortunately I didn’t have this.

21-11-2022 6:12pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902896#Comment_119902896

Did you wear reflective clothing.

Enjoy cycling and be safe.

AndrewJRenko · 21-11-2022 6:13pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902760#Comment_119902760

You don’t believe that this kind of thing happens often then?

https://twitter.com/alandub13/status/1400031637333811201?s=46&t=LxNr6kp3P8ocVeJK4_s1rw

21-11-2022 6:16pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902903#Comment_119902903

Is this thread about cycling or bad driving.

And no, I have to say I dont see incidences like this very often.

If I did do you think I would cycle.

b v · 21-11-2022 6:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902900#Comment_119902900

Did you put a hi vis on your car when you last drove?

I’ve good front and rear LEDs.

But yes, I have a luminous white top that I wore which I usually wear on an evening stroll.

BTW, hi-vis are a red herring. Brought up as a defence when the cyclist wasn’t wearing one and ignored when they were.

AndrewJRenko · 21-11-2022 6:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902575#Comment_119902575

If you want to trade headlines, this could take a while;

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/woman-who-drove-into-hard-shoulder-before-fatal-collision-with-motorcyclist-avoids-jail-1388464.html

A driver with four previous convictions for traffic offences kills a motorcyclist, walks out of Court free, and only has her driving ban increased when someone reminds the judge of the statutory minimum.

When are we going to stamp out this behaviour?

blanch152 · 21-11-2022 6:22pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902903#Comment_119902903

The consequences when it happens are greater, but the incidence is far less than pedestrians crossing when they shouldn't for example.

21-11-2022 6:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902465#Comment_119902465

And there you go, with your usual disingenuous response.

Its always along the lines of "well, its okay if cyclists do this, because motorists do this..."

Its so predictable its funny at this stage. I could type your replies for you.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902727#Comment_119902727

The same could be said to every cyclist who complains about motorists when it comes to red lights.

AndrewJRenko · 21-11-2022 7:57pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902914#Comment_119902914

So these are fairly rare events then?

https://twitter.com/alandub13/status/1451914722522148869?s=46&t=ziD0GVzZDmXja67MGkobBg

AndrewJRenko · 21-11-2022 7:59pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119902947#Comment_119902947

If you want to play the ‘incidence’ game, what’s the incidence of drivers breaking speed limits? What’s the incidence of drivers driving with a phone in their hand or on their lap? And what are the consequences of those offences?

21-11-2022 8:35pm

And yet again, another thread being dragged down to the usual predictable pissing contest.

But most notably, not a single comment or word said by anyone on the "cycling lobby" to the lad who openly admits he flouts the road traffic laws on his bike on a daily basis and defends cyclists who break the law.

In the spirit of the earlier discussion, I shall take this as approval of his actions by those who haven't condemned it.

Enjoy your night, lads.

magicbastarder · 21-11-2022 8:50pm

never mind.

Flinty997 · 21-11-2022 9:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119903540#Comment_119903540

The thread is about encouraging cycling.

The real question is why you'd (and others) jump and derail the thread with all the old arguments that could be discussed in another thread.

21-11-2022 9:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119903719#Comment_119903719

The thread was gone off the rails before I joined it, Flinty997.

Hence my comment in my first post on this thread - that these threads never go anywhere!

AndrewJRenko · 21-11-2022 9:42pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119903540#Comment_119903540

Notably, not a single comment or word said by anyone on the "drivist lobby" to the lady with four traffic offences who killed a motorcyclist on the M50. In the spirit of the earlier discussion, I shall take this as approval of her actions by those who haven't condemned it.

Little changes we can make to normalise cycling and encourage its uptake

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