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solve the housing problem easily...some solutions?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,338 ✭✭✭Bit cynical


    However it is important to take into account the entire country rather than a single street as your street may not be representative of the whole country.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,603 ✭✭✭...Ghost...


    Taking the whole country average rent and purchase ratio is like taking the average world temperature to plan your wardrobe for a summer in Lapland. It is pointless and might leave you holding sunscreen in a snowstorm.

    I gave my street as anecdotal and real life experience as I had around the peak of the boom been renting a property near to where I live now and where I grew up. I purchased at the peak and I know the rental pride of the property dropped from €1800 in 2008 to €800 in 2010. I had been very in tune with purchase prices in Dublin in general, as well as rental prices for work reasons. Taking an average just doesn't give us what we need in the context of the points I made.

    I made my point several posts ago, so I'll leave it there.

    Stay Free



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,338 ✭✭✭Bit cynical


    We need to be careful generalizing from a particular example to the whole country.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,616 ✭✭✭maninasia



    Absolutely true.

    From the numbers nationwide the rental housing crisis is probably the worst in the developed world, East, West, you name it!

    The lack of housing is astonishing across the country.

    Just go to Daft.ie and look yourself.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,616 ✭✭✭maninasia


    It's not only Dublin though.

    It's actually the entire country basically. Just search Limerick , Cork, Galway or even towns or counties such as Kildare. You are getting single digits, double digits for rental properties in towns and cities!

    And this my friends is a record breaking situation

    Limerick city -8, Galway City -33, Cork City - 45, Kildare County -53 , Athlone and Surrounds -11, Waterford County -28

    The situation seems to be as bad as Dublin or worse in certain places such as Limerick.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,184 ✭✭✭riclad


    our population has been increasing since 2010 ,but the no of rental propertys or houses for sale has not kept up with demand , there simply is not enough rental units avaidable in citys or large towns .there are new hotels and offices being built but where will those workers live .and thats before the people from ukraine started to come here ,



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    What do ye reckon, will this go some way towards freeing up properties for sale and long-term rentals? I think so but a lot will come down to the implementation


    It’s understood the new rules will mean anyone offering accommodation for up to and including 21 nights will need to be registered with Fáilte Ireland. Platforms offering short-term lets will be required to check property details and only advertise properties with a valid registration number.


    All short-term and holiday lettings will be required to register with Fáilte Ireland via an online portal that will confirm whether they have the necessary planning permissions. The tourism body has estimated the measure will take 12,000 full-unit properties – meaning houses or apartments – out of short-term platforms.


    The agency said there was about 27,000 properties with 130,000 beds in the State being advertised on online platforms, with 20,000 of them thought to cover full properties. Sources indicated that the plan is to have the legislation through the Oireachtas and the required European Union notification procedures in place by the end of March next year.

    Personally I'd prefer if they just outright banned AirBnB etc but I guess this is the next best thing 



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,545 ✭✭✭Topgear on Dave


    Ome more good hard crackdown in the landlords will fix it, just one more set of rules. That will sort it. Definitely this time.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,519 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    It will make no difference. People ate too afraid to rent longterm now especially where they will require possession of the house within the next 12-36 months. Even then the rules regarding renting are too onerous for anyone entering the market now.

    If you target you 90 day allowance to weekend's and high priced times ( concerts etc) you can probably achieve 8-10k for a one bed and 15k for a two bed. Maybe leave a few card at the accomodation for off the book lettings.

    Most of the houses that have left the long term letting ate never returning. If they continue to change the rules much further when my present tenant's leave o e of my properties ( a small farmhouse) I be changing it to an aerBnB.

    The funny thing is I will have no problem changing the planning I reckon on a H&S grounds

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,519 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Would it. There is always a demand fir short-term accomodation. This drives other parts of the economy. There is no guarantee that these houses will return to the long term letting.

    There is a percentage of properties that are maybe granny flats or small units next to an existing property that are unsuitable for long term letting or where the owner have no interest in renting longterm

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on

    Slava Ukrainii



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,892 ✭✭✭enricoh


    Tourism is our biggest indigenous industry. Tourism industry is reckoned to take a 1 billion hit next year due to hotels used for refugees n asylum seekers. If air bnb is banned we can forget about tourism going forward.

    https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/news/ireland-inbound-tourist-numbers-in-february-still-below-pre-pandemic-levels/

    According to ITIC, employment in the tourism sector was at around 242,500 in February

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    A more recent link from the same site you reference

    The European Alliance of Cities for Short-Term Rentals has published a letter addressing this need to tighten short-term rentals, SchengenVisaInfo.com reports.


    In this regard, the mayors, deputy mayors, and other city officials of Barcelona, ​​Bologna, Brussels, Arezzo, Paris, Vienna, Amsterdam, Brussels, Lyon, Porto, and Florence and 12 other EU cities claim that the European Commission is abandoning the project of a legislative initiative that would regulate the way people rent their properties for short-term vacationers.


    In Amsterdam, for example, short-term holiday rental listings rose from 4,500 in 2013 to 22,000 in 2017. Meanwhile, in the Lisbon neighbourhood, Alfama, more than 55 per cent of apartments are now listed under platforms as Booking and Airbnb for short-term renting.


    In addition, in the centre of Florence since 2015, they have increased by 60 per cent and in Kraków by 100 per cent between 2014 and 2017.


    So it looks like there much more to come on this.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,740 ✭✭✭It wasnt me123


    It’s not private landlords or Airbnb’s fault for the situation we are in. It’s the government who have no plan apart from to get private developers to build for them - why can’t our county council’s build again? We have plenty of empty buildings, both residential and commercial - why don’t the county councils renovate them so they can be put back into use?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    County Councils don't build, they hire others to do it for them.

    In that vein pretty much every council have companies restoring/renovating properties but this is incredibly slow and expensive as each one is a custom solution.

    In terms of new builds, this is where the councils agree to buy x units off the plans + social housing + affordable housing allocations.

    After that they are also doing the retrofits of existing social housing to bring them up to B1/A2 ratings.

    Then you have the projects the councils have being built which are exactly what you are talking about.

    With all of the above though, there's a lot of things to also factor in

    • A finite amount of builders
    • Inflation increasing costs which means less completions for the same cost
    • Planning delays
    • Supply chain delays
    • Etc

    At the end of the day, you can shout and roar all you want, but if the materials are not there and there's no contractors available then nothing will be built in the time frame needed.

    On the flip side, it is 100% possible to return 25,000+ properties to the long term rental market overnight by banning airbnb.

    It's a no brainer to be honest



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,440 ✭✭✭macraignil


    So your solution to the housing crisis is to kill the tourism industry in Ireland?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Come back to me when you know how many hotel bedrooms there are in the country.

    I think you'll find that the phrase "we're grand" pretty much covers it



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,519 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    I agree with everything regarding LA and house building. If the councils build or refurbish more it will effect building elsewhere as resources will be transfered from ron one area to another. However I do think with tweaks to the system we can get nearer 30k units per year.....as long as it's profitable for developers/builders to continue and as long as they can access resources.

    However I think that banning aerBnB will return houses to residential use is probably optimistic and unrealistic.

    I think a large cohort will either continue the 90 day use and let the property empty. Remember these regs are only for RPZ's anyway.

    I think if the government wants to bring those sorts of numbers back in use in the rental area it needs to change some of the rental regulation and give a carrot to these people to return

    However any carrot would have to knock on effects on small LL and would cost the government too much

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,092 ✭✭✭riddles


    Looking to the government to do anything other than create problems is a waste of time. They know they are writing cheques they can’t cash at the moment.

    One of our many issues is the imminent collapse in the tax payer ratio. Something which the government knows well but is not commenting on. They are trying to erode / delete the OAP as an example.

    When you have an unknown and unplanned demand with housing you can never meet that demand as is the case with housing - “if you build it they will come” suits this problem very well.

    At least looking at the demand trying to understand what commitments we need to make and can pay for is a logical possible starting point. Socially housing economic migrants makes no sense at all.

    The international protection program as laudable a concept it may well be in theory. Is now a dismal failure hijacked by people traffickers and criminals in general. The people are buying from these gangs the promise of a better life. So why have borders?

    I don’t know what the answer is but I also know the current government aren’t doing anything but adding to the problem. As soon as we can’t borrow money the party is over. What happens to social cohesion then.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Remember these regs are only for RPZ's anyway.

    I hadn't seen that mentioned anywhere? Do you have any more details on that or where its mentioned?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Add in the tender process into the equation, and the time it takes to set up a Framework.

    With building booming, there isn't an interest in builders in building for the local authorites, they can make more money building privately.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I tried to book a weekend in Kenmare for next May, on Airbnb.

    nothing, zilch., so I don't think things are "grand"



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,519 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I just plugged the first weekend (check in Friday, check out Sunday) in May into google and found 22 hotel/B&B/Guesthouse/glamping options. The same for airbnb is 59 properties

    2nd weekend, 24 options. Airbnb says 67

    3rd weekend, 22 options. Airbnb says 69

    4th weekend, 0 options and airbnb says 0 also so I'm guessing there is something big on that weekend, no idea what though.

    1st weekend in June, 25 properties, Airbnb says 45

    So yeah, outside of high demand times, there's loads of spare capacity, and as you indicated, during high demand, there is, well, high demand. Its no different to any other place.

    The same situation exists in Galway city during race week and other places during special events. Nothing new there.

    Still doesn't justify taking 27,000 properties out of the long term rental market around the country



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,919 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    If you think that the landlords of 25k properties are going to take on the risk of inevitable non-paying tenants, then you must be smoking something mighty strong.

    If you ban short term rentals, then as well as tourism, you are also screwing things for companies who bring staff over for short contracts, student teachers on section, student doctors on rotation, people who've just had a relationship breakdown and need somewhere for a few weeks while they plan what to do next - and probably lots of others who I've not remembered too.

    Post edited by Mrs OBumble on


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,431 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    Inflation increasing costs which means less completions for the same cost


    A large component of the "cost" of a house is the sunk cost that is paid for the land when developers outbid each other for stupid money.


    I came across a while back, a 1 acre site that has a ruin of a clay walled cottage cottage on it, plus planning permission which necessitates incorporation of that old cottage into a new house, which is for sale about a half a mile outside a village for nearly 400k.

    So people are going on about inflation in construction costs. Yet the estate agent selling the above place thinks that there is value in paying 400k for that site, paying to construct a house on it vs. buying an already built one. It's not even a nice site.

    The only thing that is giving it the 400k "value" is that there is planning permission on it. That is an almost wholly arbitrary man-made designation.

    Rural cluster sites in the area will cost you a minimum of 200k. A problem which would be easily solved by doubling the number of such clusters overnight with a strict time limit for planning expiration - after which the site is sterlised forever.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    None of your choices require airbnb and can be met without it. They were prior to airbnb ever existing, they will again if it gets banned



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,431 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    They can't be all "accidental landlords" or people who bought after airbnb became a thing.


    If you think that 25k landlords will board up their houses and let them sit there to rot if they can't rent them out on airbnb then you must be smoking something strong.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,658 ✭✭✭notAMember


    I think Mrs OBumble has the head well screwed on there actually.

    People are mobile. We take temporary jobs in another part of the country , or out of the country for 6 months and let their place out for that time. It is absolutely not worth the hassle to do long term rental for those situations.

    So yeah, I'd say a lot of them will just come straight back off the market, further squeezing supply down.

    But that's what every notion that restricts landlords does. Keep on making it harder to supply, so the supply decreases, same same. And then the hand-wringing when what everyone told you would happen, happens. If it wasn't both so tragic and so blindingly stupid it would be funny.

    Until people get it through their noggins that you have to support suppliers to actually get a supply, nothing changes.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,431 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump




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  • Registered Users Posts: 25,919 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    If just AirBnB is banned, then property owners just move on to booking.com or whatever other platform.

    The only way to achieve keeping tourists out of short term lettings is to ban short term lettings.



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