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"Green" policies are destroying this country

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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,126 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Then why have you been disagreeing with everyone here who explained it too you ad nauseam. The explanations were exactly the same as the E.U. definition.

    Not that it makes the slightest difference. We all know that all the marginal pricing policy has achieved is making renewable energy companies rich and hasn`t reduced the price of energy by as much as a cent, and it never will. It`s a scam



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Nuclear power is going to increase, absolutely it is, but only by a small amount yet even then its overall % share will drop at a global level.

    90% of all energy generation funding in the last 5 years has been into renewable energy. That's projected to go to 95% for the 2022-2027 period.

    Nuclear will never be more than a niche generator



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    You disagreed with that definition repeatedly even when I gave you the link to it.

    Bring a horse to water and all that 🤷‍♂️



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 91,586 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Japan - over 80% of nuclear power plants offline since 2011, not counting Fukushima. They wouldn't need to build new ones if they'd built the old ones to spec.

    USA - nuclear power plants average age 41 years , only 3 completed in the last 30 years and those were started in the 1970's (seriously) , also the US has abandoned construction on 42 plants and has a history of shutting down poorly performing ones, especially when faced with gas.

    South Korea - corrupt. But it's an industry thing#presumably because of the huge wads of cash floating around and the timescales involved, you can easily kick the can for a decade.

    Until they start building it's PR. Even then nuclear has a poor record of completions compared to other mature power sources.

    With nuclear the more you look the worse it gets.



    # https://wiseinternational.org/nuclear-monitor/nuclear-corruption-and-partial-reform-south-koreas-nuclear-mafia During the eighteen months from the beginning of 2012 to mid- 2013, major corruption incidents occurred in the nuclear power industry in every country currently seeking to export nuclear reactors: the United States, Canada, Japan, South Korea, Russia, France, and China. A number of other countries that operate or plan to have nuclear power plants also had major corruption cases, including Lithuania, Bulgaria, and Pakistan; moreover, serious allegations of corruption were raised in Egypt, India, Jordan, Nigeria, Slovakia, South Africa, and Taiwan



    With nuclear the more you look the worse it gets.

    https://adherents.com/2022/02/04/the-collapse-of-south-koreas-nuclear-industry-due-to-greed-and-corruption/

    After the Chernobyl (Ukraine) disaster in 1986, most reactor builders had adopted a number of new safety features. KHNP followed suit, but later realized that the astronomical cost of these features would make the APR1400 too expensive to attract foreign customers .

    "In the end, they eliminated most of them," says Park, who now teaches nuclear engineering at Dongguk University. "Only 10% to 20% of the original security additions were kept" .

    Most important was the decision not to add an additional wall to the reactor containment building, a feature designed to increase radiation protection in the event of an accident. "They presented the APR1400 as 'new' and safer, but the so-called optimization was essentially a regression to older standards," says Park. "Because there were very few design changes compared to previous models, [KHNP] was able to build so many reactors so quickly."


    By comparison 80% of Japanese reactors built to older standards are STILL offline.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,126 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    LOL Get up the yard you chancer.🤣

    I told you that your definition was in variance of the E.U. link you posted.

    You were in raptures here believing a whitewash job from the head of a wind energy company that wind in October had reduced electricity prices until you had to eventually admit you were conned and that only a drop in fossil fuel prices could do that because under the marginal pricing policy wind is priced at the same price as the most expensive fossil fuel in the mix.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,126 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Actually wind and solar look more like the niche generators than nuclear.

    For 2021. Nuclear 7,031 TWh, Wind 4,872 TWh and Solar 2,702 TWh.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,126 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Not really much of an arguement in favour of wind over nuclear where France is concerned




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,324 ✭✭✭paddyisreal


    The 3 articles I linked to are for future investment and are nothing to do with legacy nuclear in these countries. It's like comparing dial up with broadband and these major economies are investing for a reason while us here rely on windmills !



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,460 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Fossil fuels providing 80% of generation today.

    This calm cold weather is to stay with us until the 16th/17th or so.

    I hope we have enough gas reserves- oh wait……..



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,391 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    not the only country experiencing this problem, dont be surprised if we hear of the odd part of europe experiencing power problems over the coming days....



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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,460 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Which is a good reason to keep fossil fuels in the system isn’t it.

    Now if we had our own fossil fuels that would be even better.

    Hell- even our own reserves of fossil fuels! (We have 90 days supply of oil on an unconnected island- whiddy island).



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,391 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    unfortunately for the short term, yes....

    ...our own fossil fuel reserves are simply too small, and not economically viable to invest in, multiples of billions are probably needed to (re)open our fields, which would more than likely only last for a few years, if even, we re better off putting that time and money into more long term energy investments, i.e. renewables....



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl




  • Registered Users Posts: 29,391 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    we ll have on shore storage and of course the interconnects, this is where we have decided to go, cry all yea want about fossil fuels, its done....



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    What onshore storage ? Who's crying point out that the wind does not blow is not crying. There will be people crying though with no power in the middle of winter. The interconnector wont be supplying enough simple as that. People seem to be hedging the bets that it will be windy somewhere in Europe It maybe but it wont be enough to supply everyone. When the wind does not blow in Ireland guess what it does not at sea either.

    edit typo



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,460 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Nah- just ok the exploration licence for barryroe and allow Larry to get the job done- however insert a clause that states Ireland has to be the first market any fossil fuels get offered to and market price is paid.

    Security of supply.

    Build more renewables in parallel with this of course.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,460 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie




  • Registered Users Posts: 29,391 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    read again, please!

    yes, most countries are now strongly facing the risk of power outages, including ourselves, yes the interconnects may not be able to fulfill these requirements, but we re not prepared to accept the only true alternative after that, i.e. nuclear, but this may change if we start to experience regular power outages, who knows....

    we have accumulated sufficient data that confirms, if a wide scale effort is made, i.e. substantial investments European wide, we may hopeful prevent such events, i.e. serious power outages, but we re seriously under pressure in creating this infrastructure, and i suspect we may not do it in time, i.e. european wide power outages are very possible in the coming years before construction is complete....



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,391 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    exactly, we dont have it, we didnt build it yet, so....



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,460 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie




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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    The decision on Shannon was deferred by ABP to an unspecified future date while they are provided with more data around projected national future gas demand. If clarity on demand and energy security are the only remaining information they need, I’d suggest that the likelihood of ultimate approval has gone up rather than down (given the worsening energy security position)



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,391 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    im not aware of any, but i simply may not be aware, i am aware of the debates of lng of course, but i personally think its best to get away from international fossil fuel markets asap, as they more than likely will remain highly volatile indefinitely, again, the main cause of our current inflation problems is directly related to them, so the only solution is to become as independent as possible from international markets, and again, nuclear and renewables are truly our only options, but....

    i am aware of plans for on shore hydrogen storage, but all of this stuff is more than likely years away, we re in desperate need of a more unified European solution here, but i fear its not happening quickly enough, each european state cannot do this alone, we simply cant finance it....

    ...again, the approach of taxing and indebting the bollcoks out of citizens and countries simply wont work!



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    I agree this should be made an EU infrastructure project. There are no boarders to this issue were all going to have to pull in the same direction.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,460 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    The responsibility for the lack of gas storage on this island lies directly with minister ER and he is sitting on his hands regarding this critical infrastructure.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,391 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    yea theres no other way out of this, but the eu isnt exactly coherent nor collective under such conditions, one of my ultimately fears is a wide scale eu collapse, if this happens, we re all fcuked, my suspicions that multiples of billions/trillions of euro wide investments are urgently required, but this doesnt seem to be happening quickly enough, i do think the approach of negative rates, or lower rates for such investments are required for this, but that also may not happen....



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,460 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Whatever about the LNG- it’s the CNG storage I’m interested in.

    We should have somewhere to store 90 days of NG in case something were to happen with the Moffat supply.

    Corrib only supplies at most 30% of gas needs and dwindling.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,391 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    yes, but the green party has a deeply imbedded mandate not to do so, so....

    but the greens cannot have it all their own way, we truly have to consider alternatives such as nuclear, but that also isnt going to happen under this current government, so....



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,126 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Interconnectors are not with much if there is nothing there when you need it. They only interconnector that is keeping the light on here is the gas interconnector with Moffat hoping that the Norwegians don`t ration output or the U.K. doesn`t run short and decide to help themselves. If we were depending on renewables via an interconnector these day, no matter how many we were connected, too we would be spending a lot of time in the dark.

    I presume the on shore storage you refer to is hydrogen. For any proposed solution to a problem to work it has number 1 to be financially viable, and number 2, capable of operating to scale to solve the problem. Right now I have seen nothing to even suggest hydrogen is a financially viable solution nor anything detailing how it would operate to scale.

    You can get to a level now where wind energy will provide a certain percentage of your needs. 2020 that was 42%, last year it dropped to 35%, and from the figures for the first 11 months of this year it looks as if it would do well to remain at 35%, but for an intermittent unreliable source like wind percentages mean nothing. You can add all the turbines you like, but when the wind does not blow it does not blow, and unless we bite the bullet and consider nuclear I`m afraid fossil fuels are going to be around for a very long time to come.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    On a side note. Looking at an app I use I mentioned yesterday. Limerick AQI is 499 and Dublin is 68 and that's with Smokey fuels banned. Guess people are burning what ever they can to stay warm.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,993 ✭✭✭spaceHopper


    Not the case, they are afraid to say no but if they keep saying maybe but first tell me more, well then the developer my go elsewhere and the project dies.



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