Energy infrastructure

Ben D Bus · 10-11-2022 6:34pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119858041#Comment_119858041

Even if the likes of my humble domestic storage heaters could be smartened up to charge when there is excess power available it would make a difference. I thought that was the direction smart meters could take us. An improvement on the 'dumb' day/night rates.

10-11-2022 11:14pm

The govt appear to be banking on the planning legislation changes to ensure offshore wind targets are met by 2030

https://www.irishtimes.com/environment/climate-crisis/2022/11/08/taoiseach-pledges-action-on-wind-energy-at-cop27/

The provision of offshore wind energy will be accelerated under changes to planning legislation which will make it harder to block projects, Taoiseach Micheál Martin has said.

Attorney general Paul Gallagher is currently conducting a review of planning legislation with the intention of consolidating and streamlining the legal framework for planning decisions. It is expected to be finalised later this month, and published before the changeover in government in December.

It is understood that it will seek to speed up the planning process for major projects of national importance such as offshore wind farms, judged by the Government to be central to efforts to decarbonise Ireland’s energy sector and reduce greenhouse gas emissions.

It is likely to confine the right to object to projects to people living in their immediate vicinity. It will also narrow the scope for people to take judicial reviews challenging decisions to award planning permission, which can currently delay projects by years

The bolded bit will face legal challenge and will likely be overturned due to Aarhaus.

Birdnuts · 11-11-2022 8:21am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119859575#Comment_119859575

Yep - also important ruling yesterday via Aarhaus by the Supreme Court concerning costs of JR litigation. It doesn't say much for the current AG that he appears 2b giving very flawed legal advice to this government, who also appear hell bent on making the planning process nothing more than a rubber stamping exercise for developers. Says alot about Eaman Ryan's Blueshirts on Bikes that they are so silent on this matter and ongoing malpractice issues in ABP

CatInABox · 11-11-2022 10:24am

In fairness, the government are also taking other, more realistic steps, such as setting up the new planning court, and other reforms of the planning setup. It seems to be a "throw everything at the wall and see what sticks" approach, which makes them look likes idiots on one hand (contravening Aarhaus), and also making them look good on the other (the new planning court)

11-11-2022 2:20pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119860529#Comment_119860529

That's just it. The planning Court is great but all the problems stem from a lack of resourcing.

If they staffed the various entities right you could have permission, appeal, judgement etc all done inside 6 months instead of 6 years

Capt'n Midnight · 11-11-2022 8:54pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119856966#Comment_119856966

Our gird will soon handle 95% non-synch sources. If we had another 5.2GW of onshore wind then the green areas are what would be produced by wind with the bright green being the surplus. ( https://www.smartgriddashboard.com/#all/snsp and changing 50% to 100% )

Red would be the times when we'd need storage or demand shedding or peaking plant or interconnectors which should be doubled in capacity over the next few years.

If that 5.2GW was offshore then it would have a better capacity factor and increased geographical separation. Both would lead to more power more of the time. Reducing the red areas.

Data centres already have UPSs and generators so can do short term demand shedding if the price is right. Some could export to the grid.

Bass Reeves · 12-11-2022 12:22pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119858360#Comment_119858360

Very few storage heaters in place now. They are being replaced by heat pumps.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119856966#Comment_119856966

It sounds great in theory. But you have to factor in September. The reason they curtailed wind is because Moneypoint is running full tilt for the winter AFAIK because it take 4-5 days to take it in and out of production.

Lots of wind yesterday evening but quite mild again this morning. We can turn in and off gas fairly fast but bringing Moneypoint or some of the legacy plants in and out is not as easy.

The idea than an interconnector to France will solve this problem is flawed. The needed capacity would have to be massive. A decent sized hydro storage project is probably as viable but there is no appetite for that especially by the greens.

Hydrogen manufacturing by electricity has a significant negative energy connotations. Batteries by there nature are similar by the time you take there production into account.

This is all pie in the sky stuff

Ben D Bus · 12-11-2022 5:26pm

Coal is producing 2.9% of generation over the last 24 hours. At 900MW(?), if Moneypoint was running at full tilt it would never be below around 15%, no?

The reason wind was curtailed is because it's still limited to 70% of total generation for grid stability reasons? And it's been at 70% a lot over the last few days.

cnocbui · 13-11-2022 12:10am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119864790#Comment_119864790

Energy storage via hydrogen is the central plank of the ESBs vision for achieving net zero, so that means the national strategy is pie in the sky.

Capt'n Midnight · 13-11-2022 12:44am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119867641#Comment_119867641

If we had another 5.2GW of onshore wind then the red bits are the only time we'd have needed stuff other than wind in the last month.

The ESB plan is to have 30GW.

Our demand this month varied between 2.5GW and 5GW. That's between 8.3% and 16.7% of 30GW.

87% of the time offshore wind has a capacity factor of at least 8.4%. And 74% of the time it's at least 16.6%. So no storage or imports or other generators needed most of the time. (it's windier in winter too so it's actually better than that, and solar can do a lot of peak demand in summer )

cnocbui · 13-11-2022 12:49am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119867708#Comment_119867708

The ESB, unlike you, have to cosnsider the real world. In that enlightening video of theirs, it's stated that in Autumn 2021, there was a 6 week lull in the wind, so trying to argue storage needs on the basis of a single month, might not be a good way to look at the issues.

antoinolachtnai · 13-11-2022 10:41pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119858041#Comment_119858041

Who is saying this? It’s better to use the raw material to provide a value added service rather than to just export the raw material.

interesting but little known fact: no matter how many gas generation plants or data centres ireland builds, overall emissions will stay exactly the same.

Capt'n Midnight · 13-11-2022 11:32pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119867721#Comment_119867721

6 weeks you say ?

Storage is cheap. If we only had the Corrib Field and what the Dutch have in storage now, we'd have enough gas to keep us going until 2026, no faffing about with a couple of hours worth of expensive batteries.

(Ireland used 58.7 TWh of gas in 2020. vs The Netherlands' natural gas storage was 127.38 TWh in October, Corrib providing 30% of demand)

I may have found your 6 weeks We only got 11% of electricity from wind in July, but with 10GW of wind that would have been 22% and so on. With 30GW of wind that 11% would have been boosted to be our main source electricity.

Besides we get 18 hours of daylight in July so the 5GW of solar being planned here would have done a lot of heavy lifting then, even on overcast days.

padjocollins · 25-11-2022 11:25am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119867641#Comment_119867641

just one other one to keep an eye on flow batteries , like many other things that have come and gone , potential . still , putting it out there https://www.theregister.com/2022/09/30/chinese_battery_vrfb_us_patents/

25-11-2022 12:05pm

The financial and technical agreements for the Celtic Interconnector between Ireland and France have been signed off. Should be operational by 2026

https://www.gov.ie/en/press-release/b4f97-conclusion-of-the-celtic-interconnector-agreements-between-france-and-ireland/

The Taoiseach Micheál Martin, the French Minister for Energy Transition Agnès Pannier-Runacher and Irish Minister for the Environment, Climate and Communications Eamon Ryan welcome agreements on the Celtic Interconnector linking Ireland and France

The total cost of the project is €1.623 billion

The electric interconnector has a capacity of 700MW, covers a distance of 575km and will enhance Ireland's security of energy supply and renewable energy imports

RTE news : Celtic Interconnector will lead to lower prices - Ryan

http://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2022/1125/1338174-ireland-france-interconnector/

plodder · 25-11-2022 2:12pm

From the Telegraph. Red line shows potential disruption to gas supplies this and next Winter based on two negative scenarios.

These are dangerous circumstances for Britain. It has outsourced most of its gas storage to Germany and Holland, or indirectly through the LNG markets. Neither forms of back-up can guarantee energy security in a sustained crisis.

The Government has reopened the Rough storage site but this is just a fifth full so far. Nor is it enough. This country has onshore salt caverns and disused gas wells in the North Sea. Either could be exploited for strategic storage in time for next winter. It is not happening.

What's dangerous for Britain is even more so for us.

marno21 · 26-11-2022 3:28am

Wind currently generating 92% of domestic demand (3374/3660MW), with 900MW heading its way to the UK.

The UK themselves are net exporting 4.6GW (importing 900MW from Ireland, exporting 3.08GW to France, 1GW to Belgium, 1.05GW to Netherlands and 300MW to Norway).

Shows what the value of interconnectors can be to this country going forward.

(UK gen atm is 12.6GW wind, 11GW gas, 440MW hydro, 4.4GW nuclear, 1.35GW biomass and 170MW other).

Apogee · 02-12-2022 9:46pm

Valentia Island Energy have applied for an investigation permit for a potential 92 turbine 920 MW offshore windfarm. One of the small number of projects on west coast and unique (I think) in being community-led.

https://afloat.ie/port-news/island-news/item/57075-valentia-island-energy-project-applies-for-site-investigation-permit-for-floating-wind-farm?ce_b4=Y29sdW1vY29ubmVsbEBmZXhjby5jb20&cas_b4=cGF1bC5vY29ubmVsbEB0aXRhbnNvbHV0aW9ucy5pZQ&utm_medium=email&utm_source=outlook&coid=dGl0YW4tc29sdXRpb25zfDE2Njk2Mjc0ODV8NDI1MzY

Can recall reports about anaerobic digesters/biogas infrastructure going back 20/30 years, but it looks like government might finally be making some meaningful investment via ISIF:

The Ireland Strategic Investment Fund (Isif) will earmark some of its cash to develop biogas, a fuel made from farm waste. The State-owned fund has allocated €1 billion for investment in climate-related businesses, one of four areas that it targets, along with agriculture, housing and indigenous business. Cathal Fitzgerald, its senior investment director, food and agriculture, said on Tuesday that it would earmark some of that €1 billion for biogas — or biomethane — projects.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/2022/11/29/state-fund-targets-biogas-development/

Some idea of proposed projects was recently outlined in article from Farming Independent

https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/agri-business/plans-for-130-large-scale-agricultural-anaerobic-digestion-plants-by-2030-42130573.html

brownangel · 08-12-2022 11:12am

Re Eirgrid dashboard.

Does anyone know how to view the graphs. On my Windows 10 PC, they fall off the bottom of the screen.

Markcheese · 08-12-2022 6:28pm

https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/agri-business/plans-for-130-large-scale-agricultural-anaerobic-digestion-plants-by-2030-42130573.html

Expect massive public outcry -to each individual plant , there is a risk of smells ,and there would obviously have to be traffic to provide the feedstock and remove the digestate ,

They're brilliant If they're mainly powered by waste , if you need to grow crops to power them it's a bit trickier to justify, , probably better than methanol ,

Obviously they're going to be in the middle of dairy and pig farming areas for animal waste , or if it's mainly grown feed stock then tillage areas ,maize ,sugar beet , and possibly grass silage ..

bk · 09-12-2022 11:20am

“Expect massive public outcry -to each individual plant , there is a risk of smells ,and there would obviously have to be traffic to provide the feedstock and remove the digestate ,”

That is pretty much already the reality of living in rural Ireland, at least in heavily farmed areas. Farm machinery all over the roads and the stink of silage.

Markcheese · 09-12-2022 11:34am

Well the stink of slurry anyway ,

its likely to be a good thing in that regard - if you live next to a farm that's supplying slurry to an AD plant ,the digestate that they get back to land spread doesn't usually smell much ,

And even the anerobic digestion itself shouldn't be bad , it's a sealed process.. and the gas produced has to be scrubbed,to remove sulphur ect ,

Markcheese · 09-12-2022 11:38am

One of the big issues would be traffic , slurry In , grown crops in , and digestate in, all in lorrys or tractor-trailers,

And possibly gas out by truck as well to an mains injection site,

hans aus dtschl · 09-12-2022 3:09pm

Yep definitely traffic would be the thing I'd say

Apogee · 12-12-2022 3:27pm

Probably unlikely we'll learn much that we don't know already, but may be of interest nonetheless

https://twitter.com/EirGrid/status/1602273293666750465

Meanwhile, Eirgrid say they will begin digging trenches in the spring

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/munster/arid-41022899.html

marno21 · 12-12-2022 6:49pm

New national record demand being set atm. 7008MW of demand, previous record was 6848MW

This includes 633MW of import from the UK who are very short today with the price around £1000 per MWh the last time I checked

12-12-2022 7:05pm

ESRA have conducted a study on the North/South interconnector, both grids and the fact that both regions now align with having an 80% renewable target for 2030

https://www.esri.ie/publications/all-island-coordination-of-energy-infrastructure-and-renewable-energy-supports