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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,394 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    I for one would be well up for a battery building party 😂

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Moderators, Education Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 8,170 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jonathan




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,082 ✭✭✭silver_sky


    I think it was about 4.55 or so. I see a spike in the grid frequency where it jumped up around that time too.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,951 ✭✭✭paulbok


    Around then for me as well and I'm in NE Roscommon.

    Forecast is for down to -10 degrees tonight so heating around the country will be hammering the grid tonight.



  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 6,090 Mod ✭✭✭✭graememk


    That's really interesting. What sort of COP are you getting?


    Done some back of napkin math.

    Going on the Seai data,

    Peat Briquettes have about 5kwh/kg.

    Sod peat is about 3.6


    Our turf are closer to briquettes so say 4.5.


    9kgs in my buckets.


    40kwh per bucket


    Up to about 5 these days.

    5buckets 200kwh of heat.

    Stove? 50% efficient? I'm running it hot, with plenty of air.

    100kwh/day in turf?

    Whole house (early 80's bungalow) to at least 18, with hall and living room to 21. Kitchen is set to 20



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  • Registered Users Posts: 65,405 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Must check my gas use, but 100kWh per day after all inefficiencies does seem a lot. But I guess it is cold at the moment. Isn't there enormous hassle feeding in 5 large buckets of peat every day and cleaning out the mess? Does your life look a bit like this from 5AM to 10PM? 😂





  • Registered Users Posts: 1,454 ✭✭✭DC999




  • Registered Users Posts: 65,405 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Got my €30 gift card from the ESB. Am I the first one here? 😁





  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 6,090 Mod ✭✭✭✭graememk


    Your gas use is practically zero 😂

    Milder weather I'm down to about 3 maybe, and now I'm setup for march and my use will drastically drop.

    These days I have more air going to the stove, the fire gets a top up when I'm in for food, normally I wouldn't need to/bother. As it's usually shut down throughout the day.

    In the evening, I fill my buckets (4), take out the ash tray (into a carrier), bring empty one back in and let the fire at it. Quick sweep/hoover and done.

    2 are used in the evening, topped up with the 3rd for the overnight burn, 4th brings to lunchtime, and cycle repeats.



  • Registered Users Posts: 65,405 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    @graememk - "Your gas use is practically zero"

    Unfortunately not. But even in the last few very cold days, the heat is set in the kitchen to 19C, with only radiators on, on the ground floor and the living room will only reach 17C. So central heating has been on for average 5h per day, this probably would have been at least 10h without any of the electric heating that I do. Average was less than 1h per day up to last week. With 3 people WFH. Gas fire is on in the living room in the evening for on average 3h this last week or so.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,430 ✭✭✭con747


    Got the card earlier this morning, not sure if it is activated yet though.

    Don't expect anything from life, just be grateful to be alive.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,394 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    OT but many years ago I was living in a house share with a coal fire and a back boiler for heating. I arrived home and the landlady was out so I had to light the fire


    Me being a jackeen from the big smoke had never had to light anything more complex than a gas fireplace. Had to ring up my mum and get her to explain how to make a fire from coal 🤣

    The coal was wet to boot and I had no kindling and just some garbage firelighters, so she got a good laugh at my misfortunes

    Anyway, after dealing with that nonsense I decided that I'm never going to have live in a house where I can't press a button to make the house warm 😁

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,394 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    If his COP is anything like mine at the moment then it's terrible 😭

    Okay it's probably not all doom and gloom but unfortunately the backup heater will have to kick in the odd time during the cold snap which really hurts performance

    The guys to made the open energy monitor were also making a heat pump monitoring kit which can measure SCOP, must see if they made any progress with it as I'd like to do some proper data collection on mine


    I somehow did some rough estimation years ago and the overall COP was fairly close to the 4 the manufacturer was advertising, but they do suffer a bit in cold snaps when they're specced for our normally mild climate

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users Posts: 65,405 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Yeah and when do you heat by far the most? Right. In a cold snap. A COP of 4 for air to air is a complete con in real life.


    No matter how cold the weather gets, the COP of my electric heaters running on battery is about 19 and on direct night rate it's about 23 though 😂


    At day rate it's only barely above 1 (and far more expensive than using gas), but I only use them at night rate or via battery



  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 6,090 Mod ✭✭✭✭graememk


    I'm getting there, just not there yet.. I dare say i'll have a heat pump within 5 years. and likely to be sooner rather than later.

    Cost is a great motivator, between myself and my dad we got "€500" cut, More than enough to heat 2 houses, And there is a labour cost there too, but it just comes in as part of our work week, we also have the machinery too etc.

    I'm getting there. (sorta already have instant heat if the tank is charged!)



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,082 ✭✭✭silver_sky


    Attic down to 1C. Do I leave my battery charge as normal? 😕 current SOC at 43%, may make it til morning but will be pushing it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 65,405 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Have you a BMS? Discharging is fine, but I wouldn't charge LiFePO4 at just 1C



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,082 ✭✭✭silver_sky


    Not DIY, it's an off the shelf PureDrive LFP battery. Has it's own BMS.



  • Registered Users Posts: 65,405 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Then you have nothing to worry about. The BMS will have built in low temp protection (cut off)



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,454 ✭✭✭DC999


    Just got a text from the ESB asking if I could be kind to the grid tonight from 4-8pm. I will 😊 Looks like Ireland will pass the Dec 2020 peak today. Forecasting 200MW over that on the eirgrid dashboard. I signed up to the energy saving yokey ESB are doing so get those texts.

    At least we’ve some wind today. When the grid got hammered last week, there was next to no renewables. Wasn’t a wisp of wind.  



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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,394 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    I think we blew past that a couple of days ago, looks like it's going to go even higher this evening

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users Posts: 65,405 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    And lots of sun today. At some point I was comfortably heating my house with 2 * mining rig, 2 * IR panel plus my PC with a mining GPU in it and the baseload of my house (with the washing machine running), purely from PV. While it was -1C outside.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,454 ✭✭✭DC999


    For heating in kWh per day we’re using a total of 35-40kWh daily in the last month. That’s the lowest we can get it without being cold in the house. But it’s v. comfortable now with the setup we have. Higher than I expected but never measured it before. No heatpump, no battery, no fireplace / stove, no DHW tank used for showers. Very small but v. leaky gaff with a bad BER and single glaze windows in places. Insulation is on the list when I find the money tree 😊. Shout if you've seen it recently

    Per hour:

    • Uses ~7kWH of gas heating per hour. That’s on the lowest boiler setting and with TVRs not at max. 15 year oil boiler so I’m afraid to know what efficiency it is. But still works perfect so we’ll run it until it dies
    • And about 1.5kWh of electric rads per hour (when they are running). So the 7kWh for the gas boiler is high compared to the downstairs of the house only needing ~1/4 of that (and of course there’s close to no efficiency losses from electric rads compared to the gas boiler). And that's the gas boiler on the really low setting, not pumping out heat

    Per day:

    • Split is 22kWh from gas heating (am trying to minimise gas usage). Gas heating on for a max of 3 hours per weekday. Longer at weekends though.
    • 15+kWh electric (2-3 oil rads). And for the electric rads, that’s going up a little each day as the shell of the house remains cold with the weather like it is.

    Downstairs is at least 19C in the sitting room from morning to bed time. Might seem a waste but it’s a single room in middle of the house and the heat goes upstairs or into the walls and not (much) outside. Have a setback temp in sitting room for night of 16C to keep those walls warm – never did that before so trying it this year. Walls are concrete so are our only (poor mans) thermal-mass and wall temps sit as low as 15C at external wall to 20C but just immediately around where the rad is. Warmer walls means a low watt electric rad can heat the room as doesn’t need to go from 13C to 19C in the morning. As walls aren’t ‘radiating’ cold into the room.

    Sitting room is 5x5m (and leaky) and a 1.5kW electric heater can heat the room. Which is impressive. But rad needs to run a lot of the day (on a thermometer so it knocks off when gets to temp), and need to have the door closed. If temp drops more than a few degrees, it can’t re-heat the room. Not powerful enough on its own. It’s on 24*7 and turns on based on thermostat.

    Hall and upstairs could be as low as 14C when not heated. Which is grand when we’re not in those spaces. External walls (inside the house) could be as low as 12C in places. Gas heating comes in at morning, when kids get home from school and evening before bed. Just need to vent the rooms once each morning to remove condensation to stop damp – so I watch that. 



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,394 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    Out of curiosity what's the most valuable output of the mining rigs these days, the heat or the crypto?

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,394 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    Did a quick check there and we're using about 20kWh more electricity compared to September when the heating was off

    That's almost all down to the heat pump, house is A3 rated and thermostats are set the same as yours

    (at least when I can stop my wife messing with them 😂)

    Reckon in terms of energy it's cheaper, problem is that electricity during the day is really expensive

    Can't wait for my solar panels and battery to be installed so I can shift some of that over to night rates. It'll be end of February for installation though so weather will be warming up anyway

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users Posts: 65,405 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    A pretty efficient mid range GPU like a 5700XT costs €0.24 per day in electricity at €0.08c / kWh and makes €0.21 in coin. This GPU uses about 125W, so I would need to run 16 of them to produce 2kW of heat (I don't have that many, but just as an example)

    That's a bit simplistic as I do pay €0.08c for my night rate electricity and the rigs run only on night rate or on battery, which is a bit more expensive because of charge / discharge losses. But even in winter this is roughly offset by some solar PV

    Interesting to compare it with someone like yourself with no PV / batteries, so you pay say €0.08 night and €0.28 day, then say your COP is 4 and we both need 48kWh per day for spread out over the entire 24h for constant heating (just as a simple example)

    This costs you (9 hours of night rate * 2kW * €0.08 + 15 hours of day rate * 2kW * €0.28 ) divided by COP of 4 = €2.46 per day

    This costs me 24 hours of night rate * 0.08 * 2kW minus 16 GPUs revenue of €0.21 per GPU = €3.84 in cost minus €3.36 in coin is €0.48 per day

    COP of well over 20 😁😁



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,213 ✭✭✭Ubbquittious



    I don't know what to make of this. Lots of speculation as to why micro hydro might be bad and damage the environment but nothing concrete, yet they wish to persist in promoting the idea that it's bad. This probably stems from a much greater "all human activity = bad" school of thought or else "damn those feckers living in the hills with their free power while we pay 66c/kw". The focus appears to be on coming up with any reason as to why it might be bad and using that reason in isolation not to build, not if it's an improvement on burning coal.

    Must be sickening for those involved in building these micro hydro plants. You try to do everything right and you still have desk jockeys from a far away place trying to impede your progress



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,529 ✭✭✭bullit_dodger


    If it's damming up valleys and flooding them, displacing people to move <elsewhere> that's got some fairly negative drawbacks, not least the methane that's going to be produced from the soil which is now underwater.

    On the other hand, like you Ubbquittious, I'm struggling to see the negative side of someone doing a part run off on a stream, and then adding the water back into the same river, a few hundred meters downstream after taking the potential energy out of it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,394 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    Yeah unfortunately damming a river can be detrimental to people downriver, so there can be pretty fraught negotiations when it comes to building one


    Look at the Aral sea (or rather the desert where it was) or the water wars in California.

    On a side note, I love Americans. If the city of LA turns out to be stealing their lake then instead of protesting or taking them to court they just bought some dynamite from the local shop and blew up the aqueduct

    But in general it seems like smaller hydro projects are probably less of an impact to the environment than massive dams like Three Gorges which displace entire villages

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



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  • Registered Users Posts: 65,405 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    @ELM327 - have a look at this before you start ordering a way overpriced Victron multiplus 48V

    tl;dr the Victron took his whole off grid house out, total blackout, for no valid / apparent reason. I'd rather an inverter that does as it's told, that said, many inverters are disobedient bastards 🤣






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