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Cold Case Review of Sophie Tuscan du Plantier murder to proceed. **Threadbans in OP**

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  • Registered Users Posts: 931 ✭✭✭flanna01


    Hard to pinpoint an exact reasoning to this murder.

    The level of violence was totally off the scale, like 20 to 30 blows to the head with a concrete block.... That's some going...

    To me, it rules out a random attack... The murderer was driven by sheer rage / temper.

    To harbour such a disdain for somebody, indicates that the murderer has had dealings with Sophie before (in my opinion).

    And the old chestnuts Love & Money come to mind.....

    I can't subscribe to the hired hit theory... Surely it would have been so much easier to throw the hooer off the cliffs?? The method of the killing was bound to encourage mass media reporting... Not what a reluctant Husband would want...

    Love and a bit of slap & tickle.... Now, that can hurt a man's feelings??

    There was a lot of 'suspects' in Sophie's circle of acquaintances... She was a bit of a flirt. Still find it strange that she came over to Ireland in the middle of winter just to check on the heating...???

    *This is probably why Bailey was such a hot topic back in the day, and pretty much still is today.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,957 ✭✭✭kirk.


    Not buying that

    I think the attacker had some misplaced romantic aspirations and called to the house late at nite under the influence



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,957 ✭✭✭kirk.




  • Registered Users Posts: 30,103 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    There have been cases in the States, random attacks, hitch hikers picked up, and that's the level of violence inflicted.

    Or, it could be Sophie did something that the attacker perceived as an insult, and went into a rage.

    It doesn't have to be someone previously known.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,752 ✭✭✭✭EmmetSpiceland


    Going across the road to take a block from an out building doesn’t seem like the action of someone unfamiliar with the area.

    I didn’t realise that was the case at all. Only ever heard that the murderer ‘picked up a block’, implying there was one at the scene.

    “It is not blood that makes you Irish but a willingness to be part of the Irish nation” - Thomas Davis



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,075 ✭✭✭tibruit


    "20 to 30 blows to the head with a concrete block"

    Nonsense. There may have been only one blow from the block.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,075 ✭✭✭tibruit


    I don`t think it has been established where the block was on the night of the murder. I also don`t think it makes any difference. Sophie was probably incapacitated on the ground by the time the killer used the block.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,752 ✭✭✭✭EmmetSpiceland


    Ah, fair enough. I had assumed it was one that would have been used to keep the gate open, when required.

    “It is not blood that makes you Irish but a willingness to be part of the Irish nation” - Thomas Davis



  • Registered Users Posts: 30,103 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    I was responding to the general point about the level of violence implying previous personal contact. It doesn't.

    With regard to the block, we don't know for sure if the block was still part of the structure prior to the murder. I had assumed it was used to prop the gate open, but this is uncertain.

    Could the person have been at the out building before the attack, if the position allowed them to observe the property?

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,957 ✭✭✭kirk.


    I'm still sticking with the theory that this is someone who called to the house with romantic or sexual intent and was rebuffed

    I believe this is the garda theory and the most likely scenario

    Some of the other random scenarios are a lot less likely imo



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  • Registered Users Posts: 30,103 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    It could have gone down that way.

    But that angle seems less likely to me if it was a dawn/morning attack.

    And there are many murders where it is one of the typically less likely scenarios... in an 80-20 world this could be a 20.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,715 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    The gate didn’t need propping open,

    It was held open by the sheep wire along the bottom, and why would anyone lift the roof from the pumphouse for a block when the whole area is full of rocks and loose blocks?



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,715 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    "I believe this is the garda theory and the most likely scenario"

    And I believe the the most likely scenario is the simplest and most obvious.

    Not a hitman from France, or a jealous French lover, or some drugs cartel, or some Persona Non Grata, oddball English bollix after his hole.

    Instead, it's there in the locality, staring you in the face, the age old Irish thing about property, blow-ins, rights of way, and maybe even misogyny.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,075 ✭✭✭tibruit


    A bit of greenery under the roof might suggest that the block had been out of place for some time.



  • Registered Users Posts: 30,103 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    So why would the murderer go to the bother of fetching it from the pump house if the area is full of loose blocks? Makes it even stranger as a move.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    In fact I don't think her attacker came there specifically to engage with Sophie, but for some mundane reason like maintenance or looking after animals or delivery,

    I do not believe that. If that were so the garda would have no trouble finding out who did maintenance or looked after cattle



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,957 ✭✭✭kirk.


    Could you be a little more specific , that's a very garbled explanation

    Ar u saying its the neighbor



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,715 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    The cavity block offered a way of wielding a heavy weapon with inbuilt hand holds, whereas a solid stone or block did not. A 20 kilo cavity block is much easier to handle than a solid block or irregular shaped stone.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    and why would anyone lift the roof from the pumphouse for a block when the whole area is full of rocks and loose blocks?

    there is no real evidence they did.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    i agree

    Sophie Toscan du Plantier was not raped or sexually assaulted, Dr Harbison writes. When I interviewed Daniel Toscan du Plantier in 1999 (he died in 2003), he speculated on the motive of his wife's killer. "I can imagine it well," he said. "She could be extremely cutting. She faced someone who was probably drunk, and he made a pass at her and she rejected him in an insulting way and he went crazy. It was like her to go outside to talk to him; she wasn't afraid of anything."

    "It was like her to go outside to talk to him; she wasn't afraid of anything."

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/a-brutal-death-in-black-and-white-1.922863



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  • Registered Users Posts: 30,103 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    If the handling was the issue - then if they removed it from the pump house they would have to carry it the distance back.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,715 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    The top course of blocks was loose laid with gaps left for ventilation, ivy and other climbers would quickly find their way in under that roof.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,957 ✭✭✭kirk.


    Chances are

    Attractive foreign woman arrives at remote location for a brief period.Beaten to death with a block.

    Dispute over land or right of way ?

    Don't think so



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,035 ✭✭✭Rows Grower


    How does sheep wire keep a farm gate on a steep slope open? Asking for the dozens of sheep farmers I know.

    How would Sophie know that someone down the lane was someone she knew?

    Do you actually take the waffle you write seriously and think other people are impressed?

    "Very soon we are going to Mars. You wouldn't have been going to Mars if my opponent won, that I can tell you. You wouldn't even be thinking about it."

    Donald Trump, March 13th 2018.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,715 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    That's as specific as I can be, like everyone here I'm speculating.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,715 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    A cavity block is easier to handle, which was why the attacker chose it, also because you don't have to get your hands under it like you would a solid block or stone made it an ideal weapon. Carrying it back down would not be a problem for most people, including females.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,715 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    "How does sheep wire keep a farm gate on a steep slope open? Asking for the dozens of sheep farmers I know"

    Do your sheep farmer friends hang their gates upright? Seriously though look at the photo, the gate remains open with no block or stone to hold it open.

    "How would Sophie know that someone down the lane was someone she knew?"

    I'm saying it was probably someone she knew to cause her to put on her outdoor boots and leave the house.

    If it was someone she didn't know she may well have gone out anyway, I don't know.

    If you think it's waffle, why question it?



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,035 ✭✭✭Rows Grower



    Unlike you, I, along with the dozens of sheep farmers I know am perfectly aware why there is sheep wire attached to the end of that gate and suffice to say its purpose is not to keep the gate open. I strongly suspect the people that have investigated this murder scene are also aware of this. I'd bet money on it actually.

    If you are going to post waffle on a public discussion forum be prepared to be called out on it. If you can argue that it's not waffle by all means do. If you can't understand why waffle is questioned then I would suggest you just make notes in your own head, diary or notebook and act out your courtroom scenes in privacy.

    "Very soon we are going to Mars. You wouldn't have been going to Mars if my opponent won, that I can tell you. You wouldn't even be thinking about it."

    Donald Trump, March 13th 2018.



  • Registered Users Posts: 931 ✭✭✭flanna01



    Realistically, every single theory posted on here is nothing more than speculation & conjecture.

    Bailey ticks a lot of boxes. Did he do it? I don't think so... On the balance of probability, he's quite a bit down the pecking order.

    Bailey is media whore, he loves the limelight... If he knew Sophie, he would be shouting it from the rooftops.

    Apart from a professional hitman, I cannot believe any mortal soul could could murder another human being in such a barbaric fashion, and continue about their business the following days and weeks, and not show any signs of mental turmoil...

    And lets face it, if this was a professional hit, you can be assured his customer would have shot the idiot when he returned.

    Someone a few posts back insinuated that Alfie should be on the list too.... I have no objections about that.. Didn't he have his hand bandaged up on the morning of the murder?? Said it was a dog bite, but had no dogs??

    I would suggest that most of the 'waffle' posted on here makes sense.. It's the closed minds that can't process it.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,957 ✭✭✭kirk.


    Without going back reviewing pictures

    What's this reason for sheep wire you're referring to then or what's that all about ?

    This theory about dispute over land or right of way seems fanciful, gardai would have a narrow range of suspects for that , if it was likely



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