€1,350/cow payment to cut suckler numbers

No it's for existing suckler farmers only I would imagine. Usually they use an average of the last three year or something similar. As Well I imagine it will only be on cows calved down.

Why do you assume a dairy cow is twice the emissions of a suckler out of interest?

The nitrates has a suckler plus a calf up to 1 Yr old at 85 + 24=109. Highest band of dairy cow at 106.

Last question is fair enough. My cows are middle band so 92 kg/N. Add calf to yearling at 24 more so 116kg/N in total. That's 7 kg/N more than a suckler and calf. I don't see where the doubling is coming from.

That friesian bullock is still no less efficient given that Mammy has to be carried around for a year to facilitate the suckler progeny. 24kg+57kg+42kg for the 30 months for friesian. That's 123kg/N. Mammy has paddled her own canoe and has sold €4000 of milk in the calfs 1st year of life. Two industries are supported, both a huge beef and a huge dairy processing industry, that's why I am not adding in the 92 for the cow.

The suckler progeny figures are 85 + 24 + 57= 176kg/N. That's at 24 month slaughter. They are N figures I know and it's all I really have as a barometer as the methane figures vary wildly.

I am not saying get rid of sucklers, they have their place. I don't think that place is up at numbers of 900,000 of them.

You forgot to factor that 0.8 calves weaned per suckler cow carried. So multiply the 116 by 1.25 and tou get 144kgs/unit for 12 months.

As well factor in the tendancy now for some in the suckler game to have heifers nearly 36 months at calving much less prevalent in Dairy. Suckler farmers are more inclined to give a cow a second chance. Even if this happens in dairy the cow can be milked through to the following summer. Finally the myth of U24 months, There is a tendancy by some suckler farmers to register calves a few day late after finding them in the rushes. This is not a factor in dairy where if anything some lads are registering a few days early to get them off the farm sooner

Its immaterial where these practices are nuts or not, the simple fact is there prevalence in the suckler herd. Its virtually impossible to wipe out trends like these. Especially as the specialist breeders who sell heifers for substantial sums seem to carry on this practice

Scanning has its place and from what I can see most suckler farmers carry it on. However if the give a cow that lost a calf a second chance they are as likely to give an empty cow a second chance

Suckler bred calving down by 24,000 ytd, dairy calving up by almost 27,000.

"While the number of suckler calves born this year has fallen and the number of dairy-bred calves born this year is growing, the overall number of calves born to date has remained relatively steady; the fall in suckler calvings is offsetting the rise in dairy calvings."

The father was saying a few weeks ago he seen in the Journal, that there would be a 5,000 subsidy for culling suckler cows.

I don't know where or when he seen the article, but 1350 seems a long way off 5,000.

Had noticed that too with some AAX and HEX heifers vs CH and LM suckler heifers of the same age. I’m now of the opinion of bigger cows been harder fed and 2% body weight is BS. Once our dry suckler bred stock come into the shed with a little condition it takes very little to keep them that way.

I cannot see a reduction, whether we like it or not. The problem with no suckler exit subsidity is that lads are hanging in for one.

It's 60-80% self financing as it will see a reduction in financing present suckler cow support schemes. I cannot see the objection it gives a choice to some suckler farmers they can cease running suckler cows and either go into other beef or sheep production.

Why should it worry people if other accept it as an option. You will carry a beef unit ( calf, yearling and a two year old ) where you carry a suckler unit.

And if you could buy an eight week old calf of there's for 100-400 euro depending on quality and breeding you could not go too far wrong

What a Fr eats is incredible and the uglier they are, the more they eat.

That said for a lot of lads, self included, they do the job often better than most.

TBH I wouldn't take that bet. I don't think the traditional farming sector realise how large the dairy expansion has been over the past few years. OH and I have witnessed it first hand as it grew - we are not dairy farmers but we do work with dairy farmers. Teagasc/DAFM/and various Government bodies have driven and supported production - they won't pull the plug nor will the banks/financial institutions.

OH and I have been flat out with ex parlour cull cows and our own feeder cull dairy cows to the factory for most of the year. I've previously posted earlier this year when same were getting €2+/kg live weight in marts.

Anyway, whether we like it or not, dairy bred and their beef cross bred calves will dominate our landscape into the future. However I hope the majority of suckler farmers will sit tight, hold hard and continue to produce quality continental and traditional bred cattle.