The current hospital / A&E crisis

...our educational system is effectively defunct in regards preparing participants for our needs, so its a very poor indicator for these needs....

yup, many younger participants are preparing to leave the sector, and/or leave the country, we ve rightfully fcuked this one up also....

Defunct in what way?

Speech and language therapists, now being asked to work 7 days a week in public hospitals.

They have always been Mon-Fri only and had their hours cut (restored) to pre-recession levels of 35 hours payable a week from 39 in Q3 of 2022.

The same number of SLTs expected to work 4 hours less a week each, it is no surprise they are now chronically understaffed.

This all comes at a time with the highest number of available SLT job postings suggesting uptake in the profession in Ireland is a worrying low.

Crazy short term thinking going on and now left with a situation where more SLTs will without doubt leave for private work or even emigrate to the UK/Australia.

Why are you expecting the education system to be responsible for preparing your children for adult life and the workplace? Surely the parents and the way in which our kids mature as they get older play a more significant part.

I didn’t expect the school to prepare my kids for adulthood/working, I expected the school to educate them and prepare them for state exams.

Back to the thread, nurses/Doctors etc spend a considerable amount of time in hospital departments during their training to prepare them for their working environment. Why you would think a school would be able to, or expected to prepare a future health professional for working in a hospital, is beyond comprehension.

Leaving aside healthcare, which no school can prepare you for, does any professional look back and think “well my teachers in school let me down by not preparing me for working in this office, or for my lack of maturity”? No. There are many other influencing factors including your parents, rate of maturity, personality, experience etc. Saying our educational system is to blame is passing the buck for bad policy by the Dept of Health and our ministers.

Our healthcare education system prepares graduates as for working in healthcare, but like every other profession, it is only part of their development, interns are for the most part still training when they begin work after graduation, the number of times senior nurses help Drs might surprise many. But they learn with experience, experience that can only come with working in a hospital. To say our education system didn’t prepare them for adulthood, or working in the hospital, is just dumb.

Do that and you will be reported by the patient Doctor in Waterford did that the a patient who did not need to be there - got his name in the media.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/munster/arid-40793256.html

How are health systems in other countries coping with winter illnes and hospital overcrowding. I know from news reports the NHS is under severe pressure but how are other European countries doing. Do they have similar issues?

That's rough, next time don't let them discharge you unless a care plan in place. My father has the same, he was semi state and the consultant in St james told him that it was his choice to go private or public it made no difference to him and he's get the same care. That was after I'd gotten him moved from the Beacon Private hospital to James for rehab after a similar illness to yours. I was told it was impossible to get him move to a public hospital and to send him to a nursing home. Unfortunately he was to far gone for that and died of complications. He'd been mis diagnosed by his GP and the hospital in Drogheda.

All Doctors have to do a 5 or 6 year medical degree and then complete a year as an intern. Then they go into speciaity training including GP training. A consultant will have to complete a minimum of 8 years speciality training maybe longer before they can apply for consultant posts. Durng this training period they are fairly well paid but takes a good while to get to consultant level.

Did you look at how many left those jobsand how many mkre people they have had to treat ie population growth, in those 3 years?

I don't disagree with your points.

We do need to look at other countries.. Nkt the UK it is a basket case for the last few years and most are leaving for Canada and Australia.

Nurses have better pay and conditions in both these countries. Smaller workloads set hours, more staff basically. Why because of better conditions. Doctors also, are never expected to work more than their rostered hours except voluntarily and for a lot of money.

Why should intelligent and socially motivated young people choose to go into some of the most difficult careers with no prospect of financial incentives and good working conditions where you can do your job well, including your paperwork and handover your patients safely within your rostered hours?

Not a lot to ask for is it, but for most unless working in a very quiet backwater it is only an occasional treat.

I along with many of my ex colleagues dreaded the phone ringing those days off over Christmas or New Year, if you were lucky enough to get it off.

Always a call to duty because of short staffing due to increased pressure or sick leave. Eirst of all bei g called in onChristmas Day or for New Years Eve night . I have often worked bits of both despite being rostered off originally, especially when my kids were older. But you get there and everyone is so glad to see you there and you forget while you are busy working.

And as for consultants.. Some are swinging the system only working minimum public hours and seeing private patients first, totally.

But others are amazing, clever people who work through the night when they have to, for any patient and teach everyone they come in contact with. They would have no problem making an excellent living in private practice only and some do. But the ones still working the Public/Private contract we are generally lucky to have and want them to stay. Some of the newer consultants in the Public only contract are ready to walk from those 300k contracts you are talking about and thats before Donnelly came out with his 7 day week scenario. They train for 10 to 14 years before they can even be considered for a consultant posts. They come to an Irish hospital from senior jobs abroad where they are given everything they need to do their jobs and are thriving, and within a couple of years here I have seen them ready to leave because of the long hours and constant stress and hassle from management and disillusionment

Totally demoralised and ground down with all their altruism thrown back in their faces.

I know many will look at their salaries and say fvck them, but if we do they can walk to any private facility or any other country so it is our health system that is the loser.

There is no way around it.. More staff and thus better conditions. And better management with LESS managers, too many useless clipboard people.

Politicians are getting how much money for very little return to the taxpayer?

Lets get real here.. Its the politicians taking the pvss!

We need to be looking at how much value a person gives the taxpayer, how valuable that role is in the current market and reward them accordingly and / or ensure they have the best conditions to do their jobs.

Yeah . Whose bright idea was that ?

Like having an SLT working 7 days will help in the current crisis? Will that ensure patients are discharged sooner ?

GPs do the same 6 years in uni , one year as an intern( junior hospital trainee doctor) , and can either apply to do GP rotation ( general medicine , working with GP and in community public health , midwifery and basic paediatrics) for the next few years when other non consultant hospital doctors ( nchd) are doing medical or surgical rotations to become medical or surgical registrars ( senior nchds ) .Following this they do more exams to get Membership for medicine or general practice , for Fellowship ,if a surgeon and gain more experience working in the area before they can or become eligible to have their own practice . 10 or 12 years at least . More for consultants . And then more doing research and writing up work ,usually while travelling working , and having families as would be in their 30s by then . But GPs are by definition general . Consultants are usually very highly trained and experienced and often have done research and are published in their field . Some GPs are very specialised in some areas too . They all do continuing professional development courses to keep their membership / fellowship,practice up to date .

Nurses, and other allied health professionals all do continuing professional development courses as well. Some are required but many are doing extra courses for their own professional development . Nurses who have years of experience and want to progress further but stay working clinically ie. with patients , can go further and become Clinical Nurse Specialists , or Advanced Nurse Practitioners. These nurses are qualified in their chosen field to lead nurse led clinics and within a defined area manage their own group of patients, with reference to a consultant as necessary.

I agree re the receptionist . They are doing as instructed guided by their GP employer , and are in effect triaging patients , when they know what they are doing. Ideally it should be the practice nurse doing this but they too are up to their eyes in work.