Roderic O’G: Transgender issues added to primary curriculum

This is madness at primary and arguably at all in a school setting - these same fanatics are the ones who say we need to take religion out of school and stop using school for religious instruction (which is fine) but then we replace it with this?

A vacuum will be filled by something.

Many of us were very naive when we agreed with them and said that it shouldn't happen as it's indoctrination. We thought that they wanted religion removed out of an anti indoctrination principle, when it reality it was the hatred of the Church and the power that the Church had. It literally had nothing to do with being against indoctrination, and everything to do with them having the power to do their own indoctrination.

I think people are on edge about transgender issues because of how difficult it has become to discuss them without being labeled a transphobe.

In particular the discussion last year that took place around female only spaces and redefining expectant mothers as pregnant people and calling women who objected to these things TERFS was a watershed moment in the discussion of trans issues in Ireland.

Ireland is a very tolerant and progressive country on the whole so with that in mind it is telling that even in modern tolerant Ireland the over zeolous approach to pushing trans issues at the expense of everyone else in society is being met with opposition.

No rational person is pushing an anti trans agenda, but there is a point where things like trans education in primary school just feels hollow and tokenistic.

Exactly. Transgender is not a complicated subject. Kids understand it, for some reason posters here dont.

Transgender is something that exists in the real-world. There is no reason to hide it from kids.

Gender Ideologues shouldnt be indoctrinating our children. Any resources available for primary school are made on advice or in consultation with the trans activist groups in Ireland all of whom promote the affirmative model of care. That involves following the childs lead and affirming them because the child knows who they are - it happens as follows - 1. social transition 2. puberty blockers 3. cross sex hormones and whatever surgery when they are of age. If between 80 and 90% of children desist following puberty why on earth are we following that model of care?

The only study from tavistock (they failed to study or follow up with every patient in an experimental treatment) that was eventually released following a court injuction saying it was in the public interest tells us that over 98% of children who start pubery blockers go onto receive cross sex hormones.

Social transition that happens in primary school is the first step on a medical pathway for the rest of their lives. If an adult affirms a childs mistaken beleif then its a seed that grows, the pathway back from that becomes harder if a child is socially transitioned early in childhood. Children are not short adults their brains are not developed enought to understand the implications of what they feel and their feelings change they have no reference point for feeling they are born in the body of the opposite sex. The only refernece they have is gender sterotypes liking dolls if they ar e boys and wanting short hair cuts if girls etc.

All Adults have to provide safeguarding for kids. Every parent in Ireland should have a say in what is being taught to their child and its not unreasnable armed with the full information and evidence of the absolute wanton disregard that this ideolgy has for children that parents would not want it taught in thier schools.- if I was a parent in Ireland the last place I would seek advice is the trans charities of Ireland.

Enoch Burke is the person to write the curriculum/teaching strategy for this.

Insults apart - would you be capable of answering the questions I posed?

If you can't, just say so. Lack of knowledge or ability is not a cause of shame, although pure ignorance may well be.

As you haven't referenced any specific post of mine here, I'm not sure why you mention me here, but I'll take a guess that it's due to a post where I asked you what knowledge you thought was needed/appropriate for children in answer to some opinions of yours.

So why don't you respond with further opinions. They don't have to be specific, just generally "kids in the first cycle of primary school could be told X, in the second cycle Y" etc. In your opinion - I'm not asking you to be terribly specific, a few generalities would do.

As for a "trans woman" being a woman - I'm not aware that the science has done anything there.

In first place - a boy's body conditions a certain number of things, and a girl's conditions certain others. Their life experience is different as a result, despite much overlap. Puberty then adds other factors which further conditions bodies and minds.

Of course a "trans woman" may feel they are a woman, but they cannot be sure, as they have not had the full female experience from birth. Inevitably they will lack certain experiences that a biological woman has had. They will not know with certainty how closely they share a woman's lived experience. Consider such things as menstruation; how unnerving walking home at night can be; men pushing unwanted attention on a woman; not taking shortcuts through laneways even in daylight ("You've a fine pair on you darlin'. I'd like to f**k you till they fall off"). Guys waggling their junk at you, even in what they imagine to be a jokey way - have you lived all of these experiences? And that's without getting into actual physical unpleasantness or worse.

The x and y chromosomes have the overarching solid ground. A man cannot become a woman or vice versa because of this. They can assume or identify as one or the other, but that's it. Sex determines what and who you are, not gender which is an identity and state of mind only, no matter how much a trans person pretends to actually BE of another sex.

Fantasy Island. Respect for such people is all that should be encouraged in schools, nothing else.

If only equal weight was given to other more pressing issues in schools such as investing in them. I think it is a distraction mechanism. Look - over there, it's a man who identifies as a woman with all his bits intact, but no matter, s/he is a woman. How many trans are there here? Oh one or two.

Where did the trans power and indoctrination of the media and politics come from? Just look at Scotland, and what their parliament is planning in relation to trans. It is unreal. Women don't get a say at all. So transwomen will have rights, at the expense of women's rights. Sounds like a plan!

Would have been the post at the rop. I'm sure you know what "basics" means. If you want specific answers, you'll need to talk to an educational pyschologist wit experience in the specific field (and no, I don't need to be one to comment).

If someone thinks Irish should be taught in schools, they don't need to have to actually speak irish or be able to provide ideas based on specific linguistic formats and education theories, do they?

If you're going to ignore the points made, what difference does it make?

I did read you post. You are said he is not advocating endocrine intervention.

Question 1 is very relevant its the affirmative care model advocated by belong to and tenei both trans advocacy groups in ireland, its what a parent who contacts them will be advised to do,

At what age do you think a child has the capacity to decide they have been born in the wrong body and then had the capacity to understand the implications of social transition?

Question 3 is bizarre its also true if you had told people 20 years ago that off label damaging drugs would suppress the puberty of a healthy child before they received cross sex hormones and had healthy body parts mutilated by doctors to change their bodies to match their "brains" you'd have thought it was a science fiction movie, thankfully most people are waking up to this madness its unfortunate that so many children will have been damaged by people in authority.

I can't see any way to teach "gender identity" to young children that would not:

1. Confuse them
2. Teach sex-based stereotypes as good and normal
3. Risk making feminine/neuroatypical boys and masculine/neuroatypical girls feel that they're somehow obligated to be transgender

In any case, I don't want my children taught from the activist's bible of absolute affirmation. It's not reflective of either societal or broad expert opinion.

I didn't say social transition puberty blockers and cross sex Hormones are on the syllabus I said they are relevant because for an informed decision to be made then the child must understand what the implications of following the gender affirming care model are, at what age do you think a child has the capacity to make and informed decision like that?

Of course the questions are relevant you can't introduce an ideology and then not be prepared to inform the children about the mechanics of it.. why wouldn't you tell them about puberty blockers??

The most vulnerable children to this ideology are children on the spectrum mamy of whom are obsessive in their thoughts when an idea is introduced it takes root and is obsessed over again and again, more often than not its social media that allows that obsession to grow.

You are talking about introducing gender ideology which has no measurable scientific basis into primary schools, you are introducing the idea as a person in authority as a person children look up to and trust that boys and girls can change their sex, you the adult are saying to a child who's brain has not fully developed and lacks critical thinking that a boy can become a girl the implications of rolling that out across the curriculum are unknown the only thing we can do is look to evidence where similar has been done - USA where gender pediatric clinics have sprouted up around the country and social contagion is "transing " kids up and down the country.

The nothing to see here move along attitude can no longer be denied with the number of young adults detransitioning.