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Enoch Burke turns up to school again despite sacking - read OP before posting

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  • Oh lord above the delusion from Burke is striking

    Speaking to reporters outside the school yesterday, he continued to insist he was being fined for his religion.

    “We’re at a time in this country where people are at their wit’s end,” he said.

    “With the cost of everything as we know; with the cost of fuel, with the cost of putting bread on the table, clothes on children’s backs.

    “Grocery bills have gone up and Brian O’Moore, a Judge of the High Court, has sat down and said to himself that, not only will you have pay for all those things, but you now have to pay for your religious beliefs.

    but wait.. with the cost of fuel, with the cost of putting bread on the table, clothes on children’s backs.

    not only will you have pay for all those things, but you now have to pay for your religious beliefs.

    Poor Enoch is so far gone he thinks he has a car to fuel and children to feed and clothe. Poor crater.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,235 ✭✭✭paul71




  • Registered Users Posts: 40,006 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Both not based on normal rationale and logical thought. But more a state of mind a belief and a feeling. But there can only be one winner in this scenario. Either Burke will feel oppressed/wronged. Or the trans student will feel oppressed or wronged

    On what basis did you come to the conclusion that the "trans student" is being illogical and not functioning with "normal rationale"?

    Do you know the student?



  • Registered Users Posts: 343 ✭✭PaoloGotti


    Sorry, didn’t read entire thread. Admittedly I don’t frequent the site.

    I agree with you that Enoch is like a child throwing a tantrum.





  • sorry did you say suffering going through puberty and homosexuality in the same sentence?

    are you trying to imply that therefore like puberty being gay/lesbian/trans is going to fizzle out eventually or?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,016 ✭✭✭Ashbourne hoop


    You're labelling this as two equal sides, when it really isn't. The child who wants to transition/is transitioning has science on their side. It may be seen as quite a recent phenomenon but it really isn't. On the other side is Burke who wants to counteract the science based on his religious beliefs. Not even close to being the same in my opinion.

    Anyway it's moved way beyond that now. He could have easily ignored the child and still held his beliefs, but he threw a wobbly and all the following consequences are a result of that wobbly, not his transgender beliefs.



  • Registered Users Posts: 343 ✭✭PaoloGotti


    Because it starts with the simple argument of “sure we use them sometimes anyway” (I used it to refer generally to both sexes of children). Next it’s more importing of more Americanisms like zer/Zeus/cis whatever.



  • Registered Users Posts: 258 ✭✭boardlady


    I read this article this morning and I was shocked. Talk about muddying the waters. There is a huge amount of confusion out there about what exactly it is that sent Mr Burke to prison and led to his dismissal. The law, and the courts, are quite clear. Opinion pieces like this are simply that, opinions, but this one is also factually incorrect.



  • Registered Users Posts: 258 ✭✭boardlady


    Even Enoch himself is now unclear as to why he was sent to prison and lost his job ... ffs



  • Registered Users Posts: 470 ✭✭archermoo


    The science on genders. You are on here, so presumably you have an internet connection. The current accepted science is that gender is a spectrum, and what society thinks of as "male" and "female" are simply high points on the graph.

    And yes, the "suicide card". As hard as it might be to imagine some of us actually do care about children who feel so misunderstood and who feel such a lack of acceptance that the only way out that they can see is in killing themselves. And yes, I really do think that children know what it feels like to be who they are.

    Even if you were right, and you aren't, if accepting that a child knows who they are improves the chance that they will survive what is the downside of that? Is the idea that there are people that you don't understand so hurtful to you that you'd rather they be dead than accepted?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,130 ✭✭✭lmao10


    You seem to be misreading the impact of the closure of the Tavistock


    "If you had the unfortunate experience of reading misleading news headlines that “Tavistock is being shut down”, you might have felt fearful for the future gender-related healthcare for young people. So we are here to help try to break down the announcement, and reassure you that this might be, overall, quite good news! 

    What’s happened?

    On Thursday 28 July, NHS England announced that the current sole provider of gender identity health services for children and young people in England, NHS Tavistock and Portman’s Gender Identity Development Service (known by many simply as the Tavistock or GIDS), will be replaced in Spring 2023 by two regional centres – one in London, and another in the North West.

    This news follows recommendations from Dr. Cass’ independent review of these services, which recognised – as we have for decades – that the current GIDS service is not up to scratch to cope with growing demand, and there is a need for better all-round care.

    Once these two “Early Adopter” centres are up and running, the plan is for NHS England to expand the sites across the country, suggesting up to eight in total."



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,774 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    Just a reminder for all you squealers in here. 🤣





  • Registered Users Posts: 9,169 ✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    Is he back today?

    Iona will probably pay the fine.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth House?



  • Registered Users Posts: 343 ✭✭PaoloGotti


    No. A child can be born homosexual. This is a very strange feeling for them when they start to realise it. This is undoubtedly a period of suffering for many. It is real. It is not a delusion. They are genuinely attracted sexually to the same sex.

    Unfortunately, adults have created a form of gay conversion by allowing some children play a trump card and explain away their homosexuality by allowing them to be the opposite sex.

    This is just one form of child trans phenomenon. Others are caused by body dysmorphia (I hate my body therefore I want to change it)



  • Registered Users Posts: 258 ✭✭boardlady


    Other schools are respecting the use of different pronouns. And while LGBT is not being 'taught' as such, it is widely covered in classes such social and personal and civics (or whatever they call it now)



  • Registered Users Posts: 343 ✭✭PaoloGotti


    Wow. The science on genders says it’s a spectrum. Wow. Anyway..

    Re: a child knowing who they are and accepting that? They are intellectually incapable of making such decisions. That’s why society doesn’t allow them to vote, drink, drive etc. They haven’t a fcuking clue about anything. Protecting them is to not listen to them when they are clearly wrong. Parents have known this for thousands of years.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,690 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    I am just being honest. Personally I believe both sides of the argument are irrational. But given both want to push their beliefs on others there is no real solution. Both are obviously strident in their beliefs.

    And no doubt from Burkes point of view he has God on his side. Plus feels let down by his former employers as the school is supposed to have a Christian Ethos.

    However the school is put in the situation where it has to protect the student. And because of the creation of Transgenderism identity has to back the child.

    As no doubt there are medical studies that say to do otherwise would be damaging mentally to the child/student.

    But as you say there is no return for Burke now. Thankfully there has been no physical violence. But at this stage the emotional stress on all sides must be reaching tipping point inside and outside the school.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,939 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Media should actually start asking him questions, rather than letting him make speeches.

    I'd love to see his response when asked about the actual impact on students of his histrionics, or why he thinks he's special?



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,950 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    Gender is an identity, biological sex is a fact. A woman cannot be a man with a piece of paper, and a man cannot be a woman with a piece of paper either. Scientific fact.



  • Registered Users Posts: 470 ✭✭archermoo


    Yes, it does. But then again if you actually knew anything about the science you would have already known that.

    As to the rest of it, you're the one that has shown that they don't have a fcuking clue about anything. I don't see any point in continuing to discuss the matter. Your mind is obviously closed.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,130 ✭✭✭lmao10


    Do you think you would ever have wanted to transition if you were raised in an environment where it was available as an option?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I’d actually love to meet the Burkes



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,006 ✭✭✭✭Boggles



    I am just being honest. Personally I believe both sides of the argument are irrational But given both want to push their beliefs on others there is no real solution. Both are obviously strident in their beliefs.

    Again, do you know the student?

    Plus feels let down by his former employers as the school is supposed to have a Christian Ethos

    Respect, kindness, acceptance, things like that?



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,454 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    So , he's turned up again today.

    Is this a "last hurrah" before he goes before the Judge later in the morning to purge his contempt or is it a signal that he plans to continue to pretend that none of this is real and he is absolutely correct?

    It's pretty obvious it will be the latter as his delusions seem unshakable.

    This whole "Sovereign Citizen" thing where he believes that the rules and laws of the country he lives in simply do not apply to him is the source of all of his issues.

    He's not actually "making a case" for anything , he simply keeps saying "None of this is valid , none of this is real".

    If he actually tried to make a case using the systems/processes available ,the conversation could have been about Religious freedom or indeed Trans rights which might actually have been useful exercise in clarification , but instead we just have a daily circus about a pathetic delusional nut-bag refusing to recognise the existence of reality.



  • Registered Users Posts: 343 ✭✭PaoloGotti


    Ok let’s do the science one.

    My scientific knowledge, in summary;

    Humans are animals, specifically mammals. To reproduce, a male and female of our species comes together.

    Can you summarise your science and explain how reproduction occurs?



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,939 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko




  • Registered Users Posts: 343 ✭✭PaoloGotti


    No, I would have loved to get my teeth straightened if that was an option though.



  • Registered Users Posts: 343 ✭✭PaoloGotti


    Do you mean make physical changes? Depends on the law of the land. Some would need to wait until then to make changes to their bodies because their parents wouldn’t allow it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,939 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    The real solution is that teachers comply with school policies, whether they personally agree with them or not, as thousands of non-religious teachers have done for the last fifty years. If Burke doesn't want to comply with school policies, he has no place in the school.

    There is no 'creation of transgenderism identity'. Schools, employers and others are starting to recognise that trans people exist, and they deserve to be treated with respect and dignity, just like everyone else.



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