Irish Property Market chat II - *read mod note post #1 before posting*

Rubbish if the link to gold was not broken we all still be going around in bikes

Was at a viewing earlier in the week, at lunchtime, and there was 8 other people there. The asking price is about 20k less than asking prices for similar places in the area. It still hasn’t received one bid.

Was at another viewing this week and the property went sale agreed last summer for 8% over asking. Sale fell through and it’s been back on the market for weeks now. Highest bid now is 5% under asking, bidder seemingly maxed out, and completely stalled. Agent said they’re very eager to sell and want as close to the asking price as they can get.

Another in the same area is definitely undervalued, beautiful place, agent started advertising it just before Christmas, not viewing, to build interest. It’s stuck 1.5% over asking and expecting it’ll sell at that from what the agents said.

Different markets gain different interests I guess.

this was 1.1mm ask. Just bought 950k earlier this year.

sold for 100k under ask!

right now, they could easily the ask given the stampede at other viewings.

This is since mid January.

everything was dead here too in December

this is central Dublin 2/4/6/8

No, certainly no “stampedes” with us either. Actually it’s been the opposite!!

We viewed a house before xmas and made an offer less than asking and got a call last week from the agent saying are we still willing to buy it! We have our eye on another one now so i said no and got chatting to her and she said everything is VERY quiet since Christmas and things haven’t got moving at all since.

The other house we have our eye on doesn’t do Saturday viewings but i said it’s the only day im available and guess what, she rang back and offered me 2pm next Saturday!

And there are no bids on it.

This is NOT the sort of experiences we were having last year, it’s certainly calmed down considerably.

Exactly this here too. South Dublin. Did have 8 others at a lunchtime viewing during the week, there was a steady enough stream at a viewing I was at last Saturday lunchtime and a friend viewed a place nearby last Saturday morning said there was a good few people there.

At another the other evening after work and there was just 1 other person. Agent said it has really quietened down since the end of last year.

These big groups don’t seem to be converting into lots of offers.

One hasn’t got any offers, others are under asking, one is over asking a little but it is definitely undervalued. No sign of people starting bidding wars at these viewings.

We're sale agreed now but before and after Christmas there were plenty at any viewing we went to. Generally 4-5 couples in the house at the same time, no idea of numbers there before or after.

We had no major interest in any bar the one we're sale agreed on so it's hard to say what bids are coming in but there were 4 bidding on ours,. including us. We won out at about 5% over asking, it was literally the max we were willing to pay for the property so we're delighted.

I don't know what the future holds but forking out €20k a year in rent is killing me, and I'm not getting any younger!

It's not the business that's inefficient it's the process.

Housing is an economicly strategic asset, its in a governments/nations interest that supply and demand is balanced. The nation was able to borrow at 0% rates over the last 8 years. We're they to lend at circa 2% to small builders in a heavily undersupplied market they could help increase supply and make a profit while doing so.

I recall posting a finance house quoting 7% for a developer where all the units were contracted to the state ie 0 or negligible risk.

Compliance with standards is expensive, uninsured, self regulated, ineffective and a barrier to entry for small builders while up the road in Northern Ireland there compliance system is the complete opposite to the South's traits.

Investment funds pay no tax, have the state as a large customer effectively underwriting there business. They can easily circumvent rent controls. A small builder cannot compete against such privilege

No. Going on about investment funds is wholly irrelevant.

You mention barriers for small builders and then claim that they aren't inefficient as a business. That is contradictory. There is no justification for small builders to be given subsidies in the form of low interest loans. Larger builders can raise money no problem. If you want to go out on your own and be your own boss then learn to manage the business.

Your apocryphal story would beg the question as to why the State is entering into contracts where it is guaranteeing payment for a fixed price with an entity that apparently doesn't even have funding in place to deliver it. The State shouldn't be wasting time on such amateurs.

IT article on how IR's going up in Sweden hit the market hard there.

https://www.irishtimes.com/property/interiors/2023/01/28/could-swedish-housing-market-hold-lessons-for-ireland/

When I see US spelling, it always raises a warning sign in my mind. The poster you are replying to may be coming to the debate from a different cultural mindset.

So if investment funds were taxed, that would solve your builders difficulty with paying 7% interest? (Which would not be considered to be a high rate historically)

And yes, given those builders funds at below market rates would indeed be a subsidy. Would you personally be interested maybe to loan those builders money at say 2%? It would be more than you can get in the Bank. Or 3% or 4% even. Given that you consider it to be risk free.

(You do know that tax is paid when money is paid from those funds to the shareholders/members - right? It is taxed at that point as their income. But as I said it is irrelevant. In the same way that giving out about Ukrainian refugees would be irrelevant to the 7% interest rate.)

And perhaps the State could bring down the price of your weekly shopping by giving interest free loans to anyone who wants to open up a small independent corner shop?

You are at least admitting that larger builders would have economies of scale. So I am surprised you can't see the contradiction between that and then saying the smaller builders are not less efficient.

You still haven't explained the relevance of the investment fund. Or explained the connection. Can you tell us what tax rate on the investment funds would lead to your builders being able to afford the 7% loan? What if we taxed investment funds at 50%? Could the builders then afford maybe 10% interest rate on the loans? I don't see any connection between them so it would be great if you could explain it to us

another one with multiple bidders straight away. Had viewing noon Saturday 28th.

3 offers above ask. Will go higher obviously as just listed. Common theme in Dublin since mid January in Dublin coty and scd.