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What's the point?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 28,955 ✭✭✭✭Quazzie


    3 new mods.

    I didn't go though the whole of AH, but I'm of the impression that most of the closures are by one particular mod. Surely that shows that it's not moderation of AH that's the problem just the moderation of one particular mod, who is on a mission, that is.


    In the Woke thread the Mod in question effectively rage-quit from that thread, calling someone ignorant in the process just two days before being made a mod, so it's clear as day that there is personal bias from that mod regarding that thread. So after rage-quitting the thread, and being called out for it, one of their first actions after becoming a mod was to come back and close the thread. It's effectively the equivalent of not being able to play yourself, so you come back and take your ball and go home.


    Effective moderation of any forum, especially AH, shouldn't be allowed to be based on personal beliefs, and should be impartial, and free of bias. That's definitely not what is happening now. If the mod in question can't do that, then they should do the descent thing and step aside.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,717 ✭✭✭YFlyer


    Agree. AH modding does not seem to be for him.

    We don't want him on the rocking chair.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,909 ✭✭✭Princess Calla


    Why are you starting at the beginning? That usually only happens when a cmod or admin is coming in cold during a dispute resolution.

    You were an active contributor to the thread so surely you know the content? Also I don't understand why anyone would contribute to a thread they found "as much craic as a funeral" .....though a fair few funerals I've been to were great craic..bitta food, shared memories and a sing song.

    Existing mods were already active in the thread , giving directional steers where necessary.

    I'll be honest and say I only dipped in and out of the thread as anything with "woke" just makes me eye roll, so not my cup of tea.

    In saying that the last few pages were mostly about Fawlty towers, again I'll be honest and say I don't get the gammon reference, someone said it was a racist comment ...if that's the case ban the poster for making a racist comment, seems fairly straightforward.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,909 ✭✭✭Princess Calla


    Yeah I don't know what their end game was/is.

    Either they were doing the "p1ss on everything" to mark their territory, or they actually didn't want to be a mod and went down a self sabotage route.

    Either way I think respect has been lost.

    I think silence of other mods is speaking volumes.





  • If you think it was some personal “I’m out to get you” re the woke thread, I mean, feel that way if you like. I’d say it’s a touch of an overreaction but that’s just me.



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  • Honestly this whole thread has in my opinion descended long ago into farce. Some 150 comments and the majority are putting (mainly me) mods down for every decision they make you don’t like.

    theory crafting the exact reasons I personally want your thread shut down as if the bloody thing isn’t a catastrophic disaster at this stage.

    I swear and the same people wonder why some forums don’t have mods anymore.. you guys had a few threads closed for a bit. My mistakes, I owned to it. But I see that doing so has given this notion I guess that if you shout at a mod loud enough you can have your own way?

    I don’t even know. All I’d say is have a look at yourselves and then ask why people don’t want to be mods around here. All of this over a few threads being closed (which most were reopened..)

    The Woke thread is closed until all mods have their say. End of story.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,047 ✭✭✭✭Leg End Reject


    It wasn't "closing a few threads by mistake". You came straight out closing threads with spurious reasons and rude closing posts, your own responses in the woke thread were far from civil and you then rage quit when another mod pulled you up, then you went and closed that. Then there's the unnecessary bold mod posts you've added to other threads.

    You closed it, so hiding behind the other mods doesn't cut it. I don't complain about mods, but while you might say it's no wonder no one wants to me a mod, the reality is that some are only too delighted, albeit for the wrong reasons.





  • I’m not hiding behind anything. I’m telling you why it’s still closed.

    I’ve finished my review. I am awaiting further input before going any further.

    And with that I’m leaving it here.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,047 ✭✭✭✭Leg End Reject


    It is being actively reviewed now?

    It's a long running thread and you closed it, can you not open it back up while it's being reviewed?



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,909 ✭✭✭Princess Calla


    As I said I've no skin in the game regarding the woke thread......it's not my cup of tea.

    The optics don't look great when a poster rage quits a thread and then closes it.....it's the equivalent of taking your ball home when you're losing the match.

    But I do agree with you that there has been an over reaction. However I don't think that overreaction is by me!



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  • insofar as I’ve asked the other mods for their input. So far I have received one response, but it was the weekend so I’m not going to put any pressure on anyone.

    That seems fair enough considering it may take some time for the rest of the team to get back to me.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,130 ✭✭✭Hodors Appletart


    Ramona Lively Pension, you should have been nowhere near modding, never mind closing that thread - one in which you had been involved with prior to becoming a mod, and had essentially left in a fit of pique, even calling someone ignorant. The fact that you are now doubling down and leaving it closed "end of story" is fairly indicative of you, and your modding style into the future.

    You are not in a position to impartially determine the closure or moderation on that thread - you absolutely should have left it to someone else.

    You don't get to editorialise the content on the forum you moderate, you get to moderate the forum in accordance with the charter - if you are going to re-interpret the charter then it's only fair that you make people aware of the new interpretation before riding roughshod all over a long-established, long-running thread that no other moderator took issue with previous to your new regime.

    You certainly don't get to decide that threads in which people are actively participating, and finding value in contributing to, don't meet your arbitrary line of "merit" for remaining open.

    You are also, for whatever reason taking this thread, and the criticisms therein, quite personally - something you will need to stop doing and grow a thicker skin. You've agreed to become a mod of After Hours, people are going to question decisions you make, almost every day. Make peace with that, and stop getting all defensive all the time.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,047 ✭✭✭✭Leg End Reject


    So, another example of you deciding a thread has no merit and now you're waiting for others to back you up.

    What was it that you deemed to be problematic with that thread?





  • Right I don’t really like this notion I “rage quit” the thread. I was not bothered to continue the back and forth because it was as clear as day we were never going to agree with each other. (The poster and I) so I left it there.

    Look, I’d completely agree too if right after I closed the thread. But let me promise you I’d forgotten entirely I ever posted there until it was reminded to me yesterday! 😂

    I think it’s completely unfair to accuse me of closing a thread because I had a disagreement about a discussion from like a week ago?

    The fact is there’s background information I have available to me including reports from the thread that influenced the decision to have a deeper look into the thread. It’s not reports from one person and they’re not isolated.

    I appreciate its pissed on some peoples cornflakes, moderation will do that, but I’m not going to be accused of disingenuous behaviour when I’m simply acting on reports and performing due diligence.

    I’ve said it as many times that no matter what modding is pissing off someone either the ones who want action or the ones who don’t. No one’s going to be happy all the time, you’re welcome to vent that frustration, I suppose, but it’s completely unfair to start theorising that I’m out to get your threads or I’m abusing mod power just to close down threads I disagree with because someone said something in it I don’t like.

    In fact when it was evident to me that the closure of some threads was abjectly unfair I reversed the decision rather swiftly, in my opinion, I didn’t double down on a poor stance and deflect all criticism.

    That said I will not step back from my position on this thread in particular (wokeism). It’s caused me no end of headache the past week or so due to reports being filed regularly and I take all of them seriously and give them fair time and thought.

    It got to the point where enough reports came in that I decided that the thread warranted careful review. The easiest way to do that is temporarily close it. I felt as well that a thread running as long as this one (it’s nearly at or over 10k posts already) deserved if nothing else a very careful review of the contents and suitability for the forum before making anymore decisions.

    That’s about all I have to say on the subject entirely. If you all want to believe I’m just out to get your thread, okay then. I’ve done my best to explain why that’s just not the case but I can’t spend all my time here either.

    So you will either believe me that I really haven’t got that much vinegar in me a thread being slightly distasteful to me in some regards means I’m out to get it or you’ll think I’m a shite mod who’s just soaking your favourite cereal in boiled piss. Suit yourself at this stage, honestly.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,047 ✭✭✭✭Leg End Reject


    The woke thread always generated reports yet it stayed open.

    The pretending you forgot about your own posts there and references to pissing on people's cornflakes are pathetic.





  • If you think I’m pretending I forgot that’s fine. I have posted in a lot of threads, I don’t remember all of them especially when I’m not very active.

    Like I said I’ve nothing else to add here.



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,757 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack



    a long-established, long-running thread that no other moderator took issue with previous to your new regime.


    Well that’s patently not true. From the opening post -


    Folks this thread has strayed very very far away from its origins as a slightly more lightheared take on 'wokeism'. We need to return to that tone and move away from the more serious discussion that honestly belongs in Current Affairs / IMHO.

    The mods are going to have to start removing posts and, if necessary, actioning users if the above is not adhered to. We realise the thread has moved away from that lighthearted tone in recent times, so this may be considered a bit of a change in direction - but its one that is necessary to realistically and justifyably keep this thread in AH and open.

    TL;DR Let us all try our best to keep the thread lighthearted. Thanks.


    That mod instruction and numerous mod instructions like it, in the last few weeks particularly, and going back months before that, are littered throughout the thread. How many requests to keep it lighthearted have to be made every time things got out of hand? Dozens, and eventually a thread is just more trouble than it’s worth when posters just continue on as they were like mod instructions were never issued.

    This thread is beginning to look more like a witch-hunt and less like actual feedback about AH.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,130 ✭✭✭Hodors Appletart


    absolutely zero self awareness there, and really, "boiled piss", "piss on cornflakes". Nice.

    Also, it's pretty incredible to suggest that you conveniently "forgot" posting in that thread just before you became a mod, and then went and summarily shut it down as soon as you got the power to do that. You also fail to address, yet again, that you were more than in disagreement with another poster in there, you named them ignorant. It is not unfair to question this, and your motives for cloning the thread.

    What you are doing is taking your new mod powers, shutting down a thread you don't like, have participated in in the past, and are now taking a forensic view of it, when it's been open and presumably mods who were there before took no issue with the content - the content you are now going to "carefully review" - how far back are you reviewing? what are the expected outcomes? warnings, cards, bans - from posts and posters how far in the past? Just leave the thread closed because it's too much of a headache for you, when it wasn't a headache for any other mods modding there before you appeared with your new powers?



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,909 ✭✭✭Princess Calla


    Why is a "not very active" poster given the role of a mod?

    While quality over quantity should definitely be paramount, why give the role of mod of a very busy forum to a poster by their own admission is "not very active "



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,130 ✭✭✭Hodors Appletart


    cool cool cool, pick one line from my post and dismiss everything else as a witch-hunt


    cool cool cool

    easy to know which side of your own particular slice of brennans is buttered anyway



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,772 ✭✭✭Scotty #


    Sorry Ramona Lively Pension, I did not start this thread as any kind of feedback or attack on you. I have no previous knowledge of you and I was not aware you were a new mod. I've never opened the 'woke' thread. 

    My feedback was simply questioning the motive behind closing threads mods don't deem worthy. I've been here a long time and haven't really noticed this happen before. I think it's a bad idea and was merely expressing my thoughts on it via the Feedback forum.

    I want Boards.ie to survive. I've enjoyed using it for many many years. When I first joined it was almost exclusively to use the Poker forum. At the time the Poker forum was one of the busiest on Boards with a huge community and many of us became friends in real life though our encounters at poker tournaments. Then there was an argument with Mods, I don't remember the details, I wasn't involved, but the forum collapsed literally over night. It went from hundreds of posts per day to 0. Just like that. 

    My point is, and I'm not taking about you, I'm talking about Boards.ie as a whole, is that policy can very quickly destroy a forum. Of course it shouldn't be the case that anything goes but if a thread is harmless, regardless of how silly or pointless it is, it should in my opinion, be allowed take it's natural course.





  • I love how portions of my response are being picked at to make some sort of smoking gun..

    Maybe I need to spell it out for you so it’s perfectly clear: I didn’t post very much in THAT thread, it was entirely forgettable to me, I post in a good number of threads and if I was offered €1m I couldn’t recite them all to you.

    Look, I can’t be bothered wasting anymore time here, you are on a witch hunt at this stage clearly, have fun with it ig.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Jesus that's appalling behaviour around the woke thread. 😳

    Just closing a previously long running, very active thread because of personally not liking it, and now refusing to reopen it... wtf?!



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 23,453 CMod ✭✭✭✭Ten of Swords


    I can see this thread has grown legs over the weekend and is right now treading a fine line between providing constructive feedback on forum moderation and having a dig at Ramona Lively Pension, which isn't fair.

    From my reading of this, and other threads, Ramona Lively Pension has been very receptive to feedback so far.

    He has acknowledged the issues raised, such as closing threads abruptly and abrupt mod notes on threads, and said he will do better in future. I'm not sure what more can be expected of him right now.

    He is a brand new mod, in the role 2 weeks. So far the most active ie. visible of our new mods and he has also proactively engaged in all of the recent feedback threads concerning him, taking criticism on board and trying to explain the reasoning behind some of the actions taken.

    Behind the scenes he is also actively engaging with the mod and cmod teams and also making the effort to ask questions and learn how and why we do things.

    He has my confidence as a mod and he has openly admitted that he hasn't got everything right so far.



    Re the woke thread, it is by far the most reported thread in AH. There are multiple reports about it every Single day. It needed a fresh pair of eyes to do a review as it's definitely lost its lighthearted nature along the way.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,184 ✭✭✭Jack Daw


    And then they wonder why the site is getting so little traffic.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,130 ✭✭✭Hodors Appletart


    haha, never change boards.ie, never change



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 7,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭cdeb


    Funnily enough, the same mod in that thread was unable to engage in any constructive debate around a recent topic (content warnings on books), instead ignoring points other posters made, claiming offence, and then refusing the engage with posters. I can see the latter approach on here as well, unfortunately.


    If you can't engage in debate around a topic, I don't really see how you can be a moderator on said debate.


    I'll also give a +1 to the idea that it makes no sense to close silly threads in AH because the mod doesn't deem them worthy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 51,921 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    If the mods think you are not on their side of the argument/debate then they will warn you for 'trolling'. Even if you are not trolling. I think some of them are not the bosses at home and are trying to make up for it with a power trip on here.



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,751 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    The fresh pair of eyes, is a previously active and overtly biased new mod. Further to that, they have been at the very least disingenuous regarding their participation in the woke thread.

    Why should any review of that thread go back any further than when their own participation ended? An example, if you read the below from Ramona Lively Pension, it would appear that they'd never read the thread, let alone contributed to it.

    I’ve read 10 pages of that thread so far and it’s about as much craic as a funeral.

    Almost as if it's brand new to them, which is odd considering in their pre-mod days, they were quite active on it.

    On page 2 of this thread, I asked Ramona Lively Pension a question which was avoided but to which the answer is now patently clear. Did they take advice from other mods before closing the thread?

    As given their previous stance as being an arbiter of "merit" one would hope that their mea culpa would have been tempered by the awareness that as a new mod, already questioned on their trigger speed? They'd at least spit ball their next big call before throwing petrol on the embers of their already acknowledged errors?

    As barring something in need of immediate action? That's a fair assumption isn't it?

    But no, they clearly haven't and now the weekend is over the Cmods and admins are going to formulate a retconned response?

    Or as I would hope, and in fairness as I know from prior dealings with you. Take an objective look at what's happened and in particular the timeline and participation of Ramona Lively Pension in the woke thread.

    The claim that they couldn't remember posting in a thread they were active in?

    Look, I’d completely agree too if right after I closed the thread. But let me promise you I’d forgotten entirely I ever posted there until it was reminded to me yesterday! 😂

    One would assume then that any thread issue prior to Ramona Lively Pension's last contribution in the woke thread of all of 6 days ago, which they'd completely forgotten

    Inability to deal with a trauma?

    I’m bowing out. I wouldn’t waste another second speaking to someone who is that ignorant.

    Peace.

    Is outside the scope of Ramona Lively Pension's and indeed now the mod teams review? Or is it going to be a retrospective realignment of thread action or inactions with the new sheriff in town?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,947 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    You raised a very valid point yesterday when it was stated that one person was reporting posts.

    It was about people who read threads, but don't actually post, but take the time to report posts instead of refuting them on Boards.

    I think this thread here indicates why they would do that.

    So a mod has now stated there are numerous reports, daily, about that thread from different people. You have also shown that this thread has warnings from the outset. There are also posts deleted daily. This makes more sense that one person trolling.

    This thread does not read like feedback, it reads like a Court Case cross examination. It does not read very well or healthy.

    I hope Ramona Lively Pension is getting the support they deserve from their own team.



This discussion has been closed.
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