Anybody letting a flat to Ukrainian’s via state or Red Cross?

Rent it out cash... why should you take half the market rate and lose half that income again..

Over 11000 Irish registered as homeless... Charity begins at home.

I wouldn't if I was you. They are difficult people, always complainers and from the adds I see on various groups where they look for a place to rent, they mention the 800 eur like they do you a favour that state will pay you 800 quid for them. They forget who pays this 800 quid : us the taxpayer. People who get freebies like this are entitled and have no respect for your place, demanding!

My 2c

You don't rent to the Ukranians. You give them a licence. As soon as the place is empty notify the RTB that the place is no longer let. You make whatever arrangement you want regarding utilities with the Ukranians. Because they are on a licence you can terminate when you want so they can't really give you grief. It is an excellent legal way to break the rent cap.

The €800 a month scheme is not a lease, it is a licence. They can be chucked out if needed.

You'll find it very hard to get them to leave. If they want to dig in you'll find very little help to have them removed.

I would know of a property in a local town that was let to one family and it has recently been discovered that they invited two more families to live there against the knowledge or permission of the owner.

Yes on Facebook. They are just standard groups for a particular area for example : Clontarf.

The 6 months only applies where someone has been a tenant for 6 months. Since they are not tenants the 6 months is irrelevant. The Residential Tenancies Act does not apply where no rent is paid. The €800 a month is not rent so there is no qualifying lease to bring the property under the Act.

That's a lot easier said than done even under the scheme. Do you think the Red Cross are going to help? Do you think the local TD will want to get involved? The RTB can't get involved.

What you are saying is one thing however the reality is very different.

I agree. The reality is you are stuck with them if you want them out, as violin will come out.....

Not true. Unless you give them tenancy, which would be stupid in the extreme.

Whats the difference between an allowance paid by the council for a Ukranian refugee and a housing assistance payment?

Both are paid to owners, both are for housing, both are allowances. The fact that one is tax-free is a revenue matter.

So from what you're saying, if an owner received only the HAP amount from the council, then the occupant is not paying rent and that dwelling should not be under the RTA rules?

You rock up to your property with five adults and seven kids in it and say oh I need my property back at the end of the month and the response is we've nowhere to go. What then? It's not your problem but it is as they won't leave. Do you physically throw them out? How? On your own? With a few mates?

I agree with you about the hotels but I assure you new accommodation is ready to move to.

No, I've done a bit of work on my rental got a new BER cert ( made sure just when up one grade ) and now you can rent

at market value.

The RTB can't get involved as they are not classed as tenants so how do you get your property back? Do you go to council /government /local TD /Red Cross /solicitor /court/sheriff /gardai or physical eviction with hopefully no assaults?

Friend of my husband knew this Ukrainian woman years ago and when the "war" broke offered kindly a room. 100% sure no pay at the start. She arrived with her daughter and her neighbour. He is kind.

This woman had no bother going to Ukraine 3 times last year to do her teeth... Hey no war for that.

Then she didn't send her daughter, 13 to school for few weeks cause she couldn't bother to get out of her bed and when the school summoned her in... Oops we can do these things in Ukraine but not in Ireland. Anyhow she blamed my husband friend because he is a smoker and smokes in a room off the kitchen. It is his house and he was too kind from the start.

Anyhow her case officer moved her off... Don't think that was her plan though. She even had her parents visiting his house.

This is only one story of many stories I heard from other people who were kind to give a room to Ukrainians.

I have my own sea swimming group and one riggled in trying to put a big sob story how her son doesn't Get on with her host son.... And she has to move and doesn't want to go to state accommodation....and wants certain area, etc... Big sob story...

Anyhow I personally heard few red flags stories from various people

The HAP is paid as a contribution to rent. It is taxable and has to be declared. It is limited by to the lower of market rent or the capped rent if applicable. If is only paid where a contract of tenancy under the RTA has been entered into. The €800 is a non taxable ex gratia payment as compensation for hosting occupants. It is not rent as it confers no rights in the property on the person paying it and it has no relationship to market rent.

The RTB can decide whether an arrangement is a lease or a licence but only in cases where rent is payable.

Whether the owner's income is taxable or not is a separate question, there are several tax-free schemes available.

As you say, the E800 is described as an 'allowance' and not rent. I can't see how the label or the amount of money paid determines anything, councils pay various amounts based on different criteria.

Whether the E800 is called an allowance, an ex-gratia payment, a hosting fee or something else, the money is paid to an owner of a private property for occupants who will have exclusive possession. TBH, I can't see the difference between that and other payments made by councils on behalf of occupants of a property, and in those other situations the occupants are not classified as licensees but as tenants who fall under the remit of the RTB. If I owned a property and allowed someone to live there rent free - say in a caretaker capacity - the RTB could still determine it was a tenancy.

I'm really curious as to how this can be classified as a license agreement when the owner doesn't live in the property.

Same in midlands, Ukrainian girl working with us on national minimum wage has her own room in a large 4 bed house on estate eats meals provided at work, she lives rent free but has to pay gas & electric which between 4 is roughly 40 each per month, she complained about it the cheek all the while her take home of 400+ per week and god knows what else from government + medical card automatically given, & friends of mine in a hotel in westmeath one Ukrainian woman was in Scotland before war started then came over here when she seen what we were offering. Our government are dumb ducks. The only refugees here are the rich ones that were able to afford to leave it's the poor that are stuck over there.

We are utter gobshites. We pay pay pay.... Yet imagine if all that money that these people get were put back into our health and education.

Ok CH but really my query wasn't about the taxation rules - no issue there - it was about classification of licensees and tenants, and why property owners providing self contained accomodation to Ukrainians have licensees but other occupants of self contained units are always tenants.

The offerahome.ie website says councils provide a template licence agreement to owners who sign up to the scheme but I couldn't find a copy online for information purposes as it appears you need to sign up before you can see what you are signing up to.

For anyone interested, these links have samples from the Welsh and UK government for hosts who share their own home - licence agreements - and a sample excluded tenancy agreement for self contained units.

Licence Agreement:

https://www.gov.wales/homes-ukraine-excluded-licence-agreement

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1064719/220330_FAQ_ExcludedLicencingAgreement_Final.odt

Excluded Tenancy Agreement:

https://www.gov.wales/homes-ukraine-excluded-tenancy-agreement

This UK solicitor's website also has a template and general advice for anyone interested.

https://www.duttongregory.co.uk/site/commercial/landlord-and-tenant/homes-for-ukraine/

Best of luck OP whatever you decide to do.