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Sick of this country

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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,386 ✭✭✭tinytobe


    And still some are claiming Ireland is a rich country now. Well, rich countries look different to me.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,595 ✭✭✭quokula


    Ireland is a rich country by any possible objective measure.

    Are you suggesting the mere existence of older, cheaper smaller properties that aren’t up to today’s standards somehow changes that? Do “different looking” rich countries instantly demolish older properties rather than previous owners putting them up for sale giving buyers the opportunity to renovate?



  • Registered Users Posts: 793 ✭✭✭Juran


    I've posted this on another thread. We live on a small nice private estate, built in 1999/2000. The council bought around 8 houses here over the years. 3 of the houses (3 bed semi).are occupied by single women, who moved in when their kids were young, around 2005 to 2010. Presume they were on the housing list as single parents. Kids have grown up and fled the nest. So 3 council owned houses, each with a single person living in them. I presume they each have this house now for life ? This is just one example, must be thosands like this across the country.

    The council dont have 3x single bed apartments to move them into, and if they had, I dont know if the local.councils are monitoring and managing their housing stock to rotate / move tenents around to match housing needs.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85




  • Registered Users Posts: 9,762 ✭✭✭hynesie08


    Maybe we could pay our doctors what Australia does if we also left them 300k in debt before they can start working.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,386 ✭✭✭tinytobe


    I think you're very wrong on this. Unless you're comparing with famine Ireland, only then I'd agree.

    Only in Ireland I've seen senior citizens organizing a bus to go to another country, Northern Ireland, to get cataract surgery.

    In rich countries this is unheard of.




  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,467 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Looking at the issue number one, which is housing, Ireland can hardly be described as a "rich country".

    I've queued for rental property in Switzerland multiple times. It can be exceptionally hard to find anything. Does that make it not a rich country?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    I believe I read about a plan for this in the media recently. Makes total sense... in fact, going forward , they should stop purchasing anything other than 3 or 4 beds. Free luxury accommodation in new builds is still a bad deal for the taxpayer...



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,840 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    What you are proposing is tenement accomodation dressed up for the 21st century.

    Making middle aged people share sitting room, kitchen and toilets with strangers not to mention their co-livers guests is a total non starter.

    Any accomodation provided should be "own door".

    That's not to say that if two members of a family or two friends want to share a tenancy that it would be ruled out.



  • Registered Users Posts: 41 DrivingMrDaisy


    Some of the posters making comments like "see you later" or "don't let the door hit you on the arse on the way out" that's fair enough but don't be moaning and complaining when you are sitting on a plastic chair in A&E for 37hrs straight or when your house get's broken into and the Gardai don't respond for 15hrs like happened to a family member of mine this last couple of years. That family member packed up and left last November and now live in Canada with their wife and three kids as they'd reached their limit with Ireland's broken society.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,127 ✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    Ah come on now. Our political system in absolutely corrupt. That is proven by FF and FG every single month. Don't be so naive.

    FG brought out their New Politics document in 2011 and promised to put a stop to cronyism and corruption.

    Since 2011 we had;

    Dara Murphy FG (Expense Fraud)

    Alan Farrell FG (Insurance Fraud and Expense Fraud - Fine Gael TDs Maria Bailey and Alan Farrell had to refund Oireachtas expenses – The Irish Times)

    Maria Bailey (Attempted Insurance Fraud and Expense Fraud)

    Josepha Madigan FG (see above)

    Michelle Mulherins FG (Expense fraud)

    Simon Coveney FG (Crony appointment to reward Zappone)

    Leo Varadkar FG (Leaking confidential documents)

    Hugh McElvaney FG (Planning corruption - show me the money! RTE Investigates found plenty of councillors like him! - Reform promised, yeah right)

    Helen McEntee FG (Tayto donations)

    Robert Troy FF (Corruption)

    Damien English FG (Corruption)

    Joe Queenan FF (Planning corruption)

    RTÉ Investigates - Standards in Public Office (rte.ie)

    This is what we know about. SIPO has no power (deliberately so) which means many TDs are getting away with it.

    Where is the reform?? It will never happen while FFG power swap continues.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth House?



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,811 ✭✭✭joe40


    I think a lot of the medical graduates will return to Ireland. The medical degree and intern year is really only the start of medical training. But I do see your point, it could be looked at.

    Plenty more years needed for specialist training including GP training.

    University funding is an issue though. My daughter is in first year medicine but a large number on her course are foreign students including America and Canada, obviously paying much higher fees.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,386 ✭✭✭tinytobe


    In some places in Switzerland you have that. But the standard of housing is way higher as well. Also different infrastructure in the country, motorways, trains, etc.... Big train station at Kloten airport, something one can only wish for in Dublin.

    Some things in Ireland are simply broken, possibly not beyond repair, but repair would take a very long time.

    One issue is the mentality dealing with all the shortcomings. It's always "it's happening in other countries or other cities as well", with the undertone "we're not alone with this" and in the end, "we're a rich country now".

    All of these statements are lied, or attitudes underpinning these lies.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,467 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    But the standard of housing is way higher as well

    Based on what? They have much better density in their housing I will grant you, but anyone blaming our lack of density in housing on the govt is having a laugh as it is deeply unpopular with the population.

    These statements are not all lies, and they are brought up to country the utterly idiotic negative exceptionalism about "only in Ireland" that is brought out time and time again.

    The issues with housing are common across Europe - in some places worse than others - and are almost entirely due to aging populations, low density housing and nimbyism - none of which are in fact easy to fix.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    " the taxpayer" we've established, most pay Fcuk all tax. Parents who kids become doctors are the kind of taxpayers paying in well over the odds. They've funded their kids medical degree..



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    Totally agree. A nation of excuse makers and ffg apologists really explains why nothing changes... there may be issues in other countries in areas like housing. Its easy to use a blanket term like housing crisis. Well if they are having crisis, we are a catastrophe...



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,386 ✭✭✭tinytobe


    This scenario that middle aged people are sharing sitting room, kitchen and toilets with strangers is the reality for various EU citizens working in one of the American multinationals in Dublin.

    They earn a bit of money, improve their English and move on, due to the housing issue. This makes Dublin a bit of a transient place. The American multinationals don't care much, as long as they benefit from the low corporation tax it's fine with them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85




  • Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    Sorry?

    I don't know how you deduce that I throw my nose up at anyone who leaves Ireland. In my earlier posts I described how government policies have led to shortages in our health and education systems. They're all leaving because the quality of life in the Irish health service is a so sh*t that they are going elsewhere. I have absolutely no problem with that and it should serve as a wake-up call.

    However, for whatever reason, the government sits on their hands.

    I don't know where you thought I throw my nose up at anyone that leaves here for a better life, because there is absolutely zero evidence for it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,840 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    The fact that some people are forced to live in sub standard accomodation does not mean that we should build in that approach in our public housing.

    Build more, build better.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,264 ✭✭✭Cody montana


    People moving to Australia is not a new thing.

    There was a mass exodus 15 years ago too.

    Most of my family and friend went there at some stage.

    Australia is ridiculously expensive these days.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,386 ✭✭✭tinytobe


    It's possible that Australia can be seen as ridiculously expensive.

    But what is Ireland? The "rip off republic" does ring a bell as well, doesn't it.

    If a negative change is forced upon you, you can also take things into your hands hand make a change, move somewhere different.

    Yes, there are and will be challenges, for better and for worse, but in the end it's you who is driving that change, not something which is forced upon you.



  • Registered Users Posts: 41 DrivingMrDaisy


    Who do you think is likely to fix their health care system first.


    Well?



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,264 ✭✭✭Cody montana


    Hey, I love Ireland and i love Australia.

    But Ireland will always be home.

    I am just saying the grass isn’t always greener on the other side.



  • Registered Users Posts: 124 ✭✭Back Home




  • Registered Users Posts: 14,840 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    Not going to work.

    Nobody would be foolish enough to give up their tenancy and move into a house share.

    Build it and they will come is a well known phrase.

    In this instance offer people properly designed and sited options and they will move in.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,317 ✭✭✭arctictree


    I never understood this. Why can't Irish people pay the huge fees if their parents can afford to?



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,183 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    I lived abroad for 6 years.

    It was in Boston, which for the most part is not disimilar to the Dublin I had left.

    The city is about the same size, and the state itself even though with a bigger population and population density was not unlike Ireland, it had argicultural areas, tourist areas, regional big towns and cities etc.

    And as American goes it's not a million miles off Ireland politics wise, centre right, with more social support than some states and a large capital and current subsides for things like transport infrastructure.

    But I noticed when I came back that all the things people complained about in Massachusetts were the same things as people in Ireland complained about.

    The traffic, the quality of the roads, tolls, the cost of commuting by train or bus, tax, how tax was spent, who deserved what supports, who didn't deserve what supports, the performance of government, the cost of housing etc

    I feel that if the OP moves to Australia, after a number of years they will find themselves complaining about the very same things they complain about in Ireland.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 14,840 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    We started out this conversation looking for a solution to women in their forties in social housing who had reared their families and were in standard 3 bed semis on their own.

    Trying to force shared housing on this demographic will not work.

    They have tenancies and won't give them up unless an attractive alternative is offered.

    I have already said that family or friend groups who want to share may be accommodated but this would also be subject to supply.

    Social housing should not follow the private rental sector in a race to the bottom.



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