Domestic Solar PV Quotes 2022 - No PM requests - See Mod note post #1

I would love the opinion of the boards community.

The thread is for domestic quotes but if its ok I would like to share the quote for a larger system for a farm. Installing on a farm roof should be a lot easier than a domestic house as you can just bolt the mounting through the roof into the timber. The design of our roof will also mean I dont think scaffolding will be necessary.

94 panels, array of 30Kwp, panels are Solarwatt Glass-Glass. Inverter is Fronius. Battery is Solarwatt or BYD

Excluding VAT and grant: €41,500 (Including VAT: €47,102)

EDDI is an extra: €725 (Including VAT €823)

10Kwh battery: €9,000 (Including VAT €10,215)

or 20Kwh battery: €13,750 (Including VAT €15,606)

My questions are:

-What do you think of the above quote?

-How do I compare installers? I know nothing about any of them, when I google them there are not many reviews, I have heard that there are cowboys working in the industry. Can I name companies here to see if anyone knows them?

-How do I compare panels? they are all different so hard to compare like with like, the above company claim that their panels are the best as they are backed with glass instead of foil so are more resistant to ammonia emissions (ammonia might be an issue as they will be on a farm), but panels from other companies also claim to be resistant to ammonia so how do I compare panels in general?

Off-hand observation, 10kwhr battery @ 80% equals 8kwhr at night rate of 10cents means that you save money when using 8kwhr during the day at 50cents. Now using ONLY 10kwhr per day this means a saving of €3.20 per day/over €1000 per annum by load shifting 8kw per night. Then factor in PV production saved to battery, between April and October (not needing to pay for nightly charge) and savings multiply . Have I got this right?

Woo hoo, all those honours maths classes were right. Now if you figure the EV Night rates into the equation, and the falling electric rates (PINERGY today, AND they INCREASED FIT Rates, means every other supplier MUST fall as well, and INCREASE FIT), then signing up for a yearly rate, at this time, is questionable. Tell me I am wrong?

For me, I would prefer to get the battery, if I can afford it when installing. It's not just the saving during night rate (e.g. difference between day rate and night rate when charging the battery from the grid - approx. 20c per unit difference on most tariffs), which would be mostly during winter. But also, the potential additional savings during the day when the battery is being charged from PV to be used at home rather than exporting back to the grid (typically 40c+ per unit for day rate, these days).

Yes, the battery will take longer to pay for itself, but there are benefits to having one. Everyone's case may be different, but that's my thinking for my planned scenario.

Hi all,

I received this quote. Does it look reasonable?

If anyone could pm me with the name of a supplier who might be able to offer better value I'd appreciate it.

Thanks.

9 X 420 JINKO TIGER PANELS N TYPE

1 X SOlIS 6KW HYBRID INVERTER (Future proofed to 8.2KW)

1 X WIFI STICK

1 X VAN DER WALK ROOFING SYSTEM

1 X EDDI WATER HEATER

1 PROJOY SHUNT SWITCH 

1 X ENERGY METER

ALL ASOCIATED FUSES AND ISOLATORS 

HAND OVER PACK 

COMMISOINING AND TESTING. 

5KW BATTERY (DYNESS OR SOLUNA)

COST: €12,400 incl VAT (Grant to be deducted from this)

hmm, for that kwp, maybe push them to include the BER and grant application.

Will you qualify for this https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/schemes/farmers-to-get-60pc-grant-aid-for-solar-panels-to-power-homes-and-farm-42354614.html

I assume that price of €9400 is post grant reduction? It's a bit pricey (not terrible, but on the pricey side). Have you looked in the installation details spreadsheet? Get some installers from there?

I'd also question if you need an Eddi. I have one and I like it, but I bought it at a different time.....long before FIT etc was on the landscape. Nowadays it'll probably never make you back the money you pay for it, and you would be better off without one. That said, I like mine and since it's a sunk cost, I like the flexibility it gives, but it's worth calling out that it will probably not pay for itself.

As bullit says, the Eddi is 'nice to have'. You won't have hot water from the Eddi for months of the year. From Oct ish to around now, or longer on a smaller system. Just not enough sun. Others use the immersion on a timer on cheap night rate - that still gives on demand hot water once the tank is well insulated to hold the heat. No cost difference as night rate (if you have it) is close to FIT. So if you exported (instead of Eddi) and used the immersion to heat, you're no worse off cost wise.

Personally I'd rather the solar goes into an electric rad in winter than a hot water tank. That better suits our house. But fully get the need for hot water and suits a busy house. In summer the Eddi will give heats of hot water.

Backup operation is permitted so long as the below conditions are met;

- The backup supply from the PV and battery energy storage system must be on the load side of the ESB meter and cannot feed any other premises.

- The requirements of I.S. 10101 must be met, particularly relating to the requirements of ‘standby supply’ and break-before-make changeover switch, and the requirements for neutral treatment in island mode and impacts on protection operation.

- There can be no circumstances where the PV and battery system will feed energy into the grid during backup operation.

- Ensure that, by design, loss of mains (LOM) protection is not compromised. This could be either by relocating LOM to ESBN-Customer interface or by interlocking LOM changeover switch.

Section 5.4.5 of Building Regulation TGD B - Fire Safety (2017) states that “where Photovoltaic (P.V.) panels are provided on buildings, provision should be made for the isolation of the panel array externally and in accordance with ET101, 2008” which has been replaced by I.S. 10101.

 For all live conductors where a risk of electric shock is involved

 Must act as directly as possible on the appropriate supply conductors

 Accessible, readily identifiable and convenient for intended use

my system is setup in a way that most installers would not be comfortable doing as they have not done sufficient investigations into the regulations and they just want to play it safe and stick to what they know.

in my case if the grid fails; I have 5 circuits (up lights / down lights / boiler / internet & comms / kitchen sockets ) all can be powered by both the battery and the PV panels if it’s light outside.

my DC isolation switches are accessible externally in their own dedicated cabinet;

Hi folks, we just recently got solar installed. Had a couple of issues on installation. They arrived 2 panels short of what we ordered, and as far as I can tell, one of the panels got damaged putting it up. It so sooo windy on the day that I had to help with handing the panels up as they were flying all over the place. I actually rang the day before, and morning off installation to warn them that I felt it was too windy for the installation. We live in a very windy exposed location. The rails are long enough for the remaining panels and they are due to come back at some stage with the other panels and to check the one I think is damaged. Which brings me to one of my questions, as you can see from pic, the wires are all sitting on the roof. At the time I asked would they be tied up and I was told yes. I was too busy helping hand up panels to keep an eye on installation. As we are in a very windy location, my thoughts are that it's not a good idea to have the wires on the roof where they can rub around in the wind???

I also found out after, that they gave me a 5.1 CFE battery instead of the 4.8 Dyness that I ordered. It was in a case so I didn't notice until after they left. The salesman has assured me that they are the same quality/price. This is really not my area of expertise so haven't been able to find out/verify if they are similar? Quality? Price?

Any advice on the above would be much appreciated?

Thanks!

They should have clipped / secured the cables while installing; they are going to have to take them back off now. Here are the regs from the SEAI installers code of practice:

“DC cables must be suitable secured when routed from the PV module array across the roof area to the entry point to the building. Cables must not be exposed to excessive movement from wind or any other mechanical stress due to their installation.”

Link: https://www.seai.ie/publications/SPV-Code-of-Practice.pdf

if SEAI inspect this they most probably would request the cables to be clipped before they pay out the grant.

if you have the stuff about the battery in writing it’s up to you if you want to push them but the costs are:

Dyness 4.8kWh LFP Battery A48100: 1650 ex vat

CFE 5.12kWh Lithium Battery: 1500 ex vat

so you would be within your rights to request a reduction in price; but maybe they weren’t specific about the battery in the quote. If I have time later I’ll look at the spec sheets for both and see if one is somehow better / worse than the other. Looks like the Dyness comes in a nicer case which is wall mountable.

If your getting the grant then the SEAI require a new BER, ridiculous but that's the way it is.

Thank you, installers do not seem eager to give competitive quotes for my requirements which I am surprised at as it seems straight forward compared to residential. I have a number of quotes and that was the best (jointly with another company), some of them are off the wall from what I would have expected based on the davidhunt.ie/solar/

Eddi only works out of the box with resistance loads like immersions. But you can also get a relay board that would allow you to do what your suggesting; but I’d say once you start running that system you would be better off letting it run to completion.

can you break down your that 183kwh for me. I’d like to crunch some numbers for you. What’s the load of that ice machine? How long does it run? What’s the load like when your milking?