Referendum on Gender Equality (THREADBANS IN OP)

Interesting they want to pepper the constitution with the word 'gender' . In fact is gender even mentioned in it at the moment? I also think there is some dangerous in removing the word mother from the constitution.

Is a referendum on this necessary or can the constitution be changed without a referendum?

The constitution can only be changed by referendum.

Is this just another in a long line of social justice referendums (where the government can't lose) to distract us from the important issues of the day?

The question presupposes that justice is not an important issue. I don't think you'll get many takers for that position. And the notion that the whole thing is confected by the Government as a distraction from something else is undermined by the fact that this isn't ultimately a Government initiative - it's a recommendation of the citizen's assembly to which the Government is responding.

What does this gender equality referendum mean in practical terms?

Too soon to say with any confidence — we haven't seen the wording of the proposed amendment to the Constitution. An Oireachtas committee has suggested some draft wording, but we don't know yet if the Government will accept any of those recommendations.

What we do know, at least, is that the Citizen's Assembly recommended deletion of the existing wording in Art 42.2 that referred to the importance of a woman's "life within the home" and its replacement with wording "that is not gender specific and obliges the State to take reasonable measures to support care within the home and wider community". So maybe expect something like that?

Does it work both ways - as in, if it is to ensure equal rights for women, does it also mean equal responsibility, and that there is no favouritism in the family court between fathers and mothers?

See above — we're going to have to wait and see. But the constitutional provisions that are most relevant to the issue you raise are not the provisions about equal status, but the provisions about marriage and the family.

What a waste of time and money.

I have to say, I see nothing wrong with this current text: "All citizens shall, as human persons, be held equal before the law".

Maybe if it referred specifically to "men and women" I could at least begin to see where they're coming from. But bringing any sort of specifics into it brings no added value.

It'll be an interesting referendum in a way. I'm curious to see how many people feel as strongly in private about these transgender issues as they do in public. I've seen a lot of masks slip over the past few years. It could be a way for people to tell the government that enough is enough with this.

I dont know what any of that has to do with the proposed referendum

From https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/politics/arid-41087869.html

The Citizens' Assembly recommended that Article 40.1 of the Constitution should be amended to refer explicitly to gender equality and non-discrimination.

The group also found that the Constitution should be changed to protect all family life and should not be limited to the marital family.

'Women in the home'

It recommends that Article 41.2, which refers to women in the home, should be deleted and replaced with language that is not gender-specific and obliges the State to take reasonable measures to support care within the home and wider community.

In 40.1, I expect it refers to lines like 'No citizen shall be deprived of his personal liberty save in accordance with law' and '...and after giving the person in whose custody he is detained an opportunity' being reworded with 'their' and 'they are' and so on.

In Article 41.2, theese are the likely sections to be examined:

2     1° In particular, the State recognises that by her life within the home, woman gives to the State a support without which the common good cannot be achieved.

2° The State shall, therefore, endeavour to ensure that mothers shall not be obliged by economic necessity to engage in labour to the neglect of their duties in the home.

3     1° The State pledges itself to guard with special care the institution of Marriage, on which the Family is founded, and to protect it against attack.

I don't see any issue with the idea that those 3 points should be deleted/edited in 2023, but of course it depends on what the new wording (if any) is.

So how much is this sop to the leftie wokies going to cost I wonder.

Here is some good insight into the issue.

Thw woke strawman tediously makes another appearance on Boards

given how vague and fluffly that is then, why not simply get rid of the entire provision rahter than attempt to amend it?

Oh no, I'm gutted to learn they don't meet with your approval.

I'm not afraid at all, I'm quite happy to leave it the way it is and FYI it was you that engaged with me in the first place.

What part of "I'm quite happy to leave it as it is" were you finding it hard to understand?

But I'll make it easy for you, no I don't.

I'll be voting yes before anyone comments to say I'm afraid of anything like they did with the last poster who brought up money. I would question the wisdom of holding a separate referendum in November from a cost point of view instead of holding it in tandem with the 2024 local elections.

Seems like real soft-ball stuff; "we will forever be remembered as the government that enshrined gender equality in our nation's constitution", etc. despite it making very little difference to anyone's lives

So, it would make sense to simplify things maybe as the poster said "simply get rid of the entire provision rather than attempt to amend it"?

And what woman feels that are unable to go to work because of this?

None.