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Put them back in their box. The Scotland v Ireland build up thread.

2

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,644 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    I think he definitely had a good game against italy considering his lack of gametime and unfamiliarity with the position.

    Its just that ringrose is better

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,533 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    Aki was good but caught out in defence. Wouldn't be shocked to see him start at 12 on Sunday assuming Henshaw isn't quite ready. Would be v harsh on McCloskey though

    Otherwise the team picks itself really, only uncertainty is Kelleher vs Sheehan to start. I think Sheehan deserves it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,546 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Gerry Thornley has Furlong, JGP, Sexton and Ringrose all coming straight into the 15 with Henshaw on the bench.

    IRELAND (possible): Hugo Keegan (Leinster); Mack Hansen (Connacht), Garry Ringrose (Leinster), Bundee Aki (Connacht), James Lowe (Leinster); Johnny Sexton (Leinster, capt), Jamison Gibson-Park (Leinster); Andrew Porter (Leinster), Dan Sheehan (Leinster), Tadhg Furlong (Leinster); James Ryan (Leinster), Iain Henderson (Ulster); Peter O’Mahony (Munster), Josh van der Flier (Leinster), Caelan Doris (Leinster).


    Replacements: Rónan Kelleher (Leinster), David Kilcoyne (Munster)/Cian Healy (Leinster), Tom O’Toole (Ulster), Ryan Baird (Leinster), Jack Conan (Leinster), Conor Murray (Munster), Ross Byrne (Leinster), Robbie Henshaw (Leinster).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,305 ✭✭✭sprucemoose


    are they resilient though? id be interested to see the stats but in most of the bigger games its either been aki/ringrose or aki/henshaw, i think henshaw/ringrose is the best combination but its rare that theyve got to have a run of games together for ireland



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    James Tracey on off the ball recently was saying that he thinks Kelleher has the better set piece (he wasn't that direct but heavily implied it). Given Sheehan's ability in the loose, it makes more sense to spring him from the bench, when Scotland don't have their first choice props on the pitch.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,639 ✭✭✭ersatz


    According to chat GPT (this type of stuff is all its good for) they've started 15 games together, which is not that many considering they've both been in the team since 2016 (Henshaw longer). It's one reason Aki has so many caps.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,305 ✭✭✭sprucemoose


    interesting, thats not that much for the time period. its always seemed that one of them has been injured at any one time over the last while

    is that 15 games in the same team or 15 games in the centre together (just to be picky)? could be 14 with the england game in 2019



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,639 ✭✭✭ersatz


    Might include that England match where RH started at 15. Otherwise Im not sure.



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  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Kiera Miniature Bungalow


    Honestly you can't even trust it for this sort of thing. I asked it some stats about the Wales v Ireland game, it got them totally wrong, and when you correct it it just parrots the answers you give.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,305 ✭✭✭sprucemoose


    doesnt really matter anyway i was just curious, its not that many games either way



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,639 ✭✭✭ersatz


    Chomsky had a good piece in the NYT yesterday about the limits of this sort of statistical 'learning' stuff. If it doesn't get stats right it really is hopeless.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,639 ✭✭✭ersatz


    I guess more accurate statement would be that we've been lucky to have one or both of them for the vast majority of out games over a long stretch. Having neither against Italy was unnerving.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,644 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    Hes never far wrong, but hes not always fully right.

    Of all the picks i think JGP starting might not be right, I think maybe murray starts and jgp benches



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,618 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    Chatgpt has no data beyond 2021. It's not meant to be used for actual information, just to simulate what a person might say in a particular situation. So it will just basically 'make stuff up' based on a sentence prediction algorithm.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,770 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    On a tangent, Asimov wrote a short story about the unreliability of using a super computer/ AI for decision making





  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,644 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    I think id sooner a rog/sexton debate than hear anymore about chatbots



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    That reads like something a chatbot would say.

    We should get a chatbot to write the match thread for Ireland Scotland.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,644 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,154 ✭✭✭✭Neil3030


    Chomsky?

    Asimov?

    What fresh new matchthread hell is this?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,644 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers



    two newly imported Scottish wingers presumably



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,644 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers



    two newly imported Scottish wingers presumably



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,644 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers



    two newly imported Scottish wingers presumably



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,048 ✭✭✭Cosmo Kramer


    It was probably giving you the stats from the 2021 game. It's not designed to give current information, so don't use it for that!

    Ask it to write a poem about the 2018 Grand Slam win on the other hand, and it will spit out something like this in 5 seconds.


    Can you write a poem about the 2018 Grand Slam win that mentions some of the players involved?


    In a sea of green, they stood so tall,

    The Irish rugby team, ready to brawl,

    From the first game, they showed their skill,

    Their eyes on the prize, their hearts filled with will.


    Conor Murray, with a lightning pass,

    Johnny Sexton, with his magic class,

    Tadhg Furlong, with his powerful run,

    The Irish team, second to none.


    Rob Kearney, with his aerial grace,

    Jacob Stockdale, with his try-scoring pace,

    Keith Earls, with his nimble feet,

    The Irish team, simply elite.


    Peter O'Mahony, with his warrior heart,

    CJ Stander, with his relentless part,

    Rory Best, with his captain's pride,

    The Irish team, unstoppable in stride.


    Through rain and wind, they fought with zeal,

    Each game won, with power and appeal,

    Against each foe, they stood their ground,

    The grand slam win, finally found.


    And when the final whistle blew,

    The Irish team, they knew what they had to do,

    They raised their hands, they cheered and smiled,

    For they had won, with strength and style.


    The grand slam trophy, now theirs to keep,

    A moment in time, forever to reap,

    Of Ireland's rugby glory, of their triumph sweet,

    In 2018, they claimed the ultimate feat.



    We should probably just ask it to write a replacement for Ireland's Call...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,154 ✭✭✭✭Neil3030


    Read that in Gerry Thornley's voice...

    Then look up if his middle name starts with P....



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,154 ✭✭✭✭Neil3030




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Folks, let me tell you, I'm really looking forward to this Scotland v Ireland Six Nations game. It's going to be huge, huge, the best ever.

    You know, rugby is such an amazing sport. The strength, the agility, the competitiveness, it's what America is all about. And, these two teams, Scotland and Ireland, they're some of the best in the world. They're going to bring their A-game and it's going to be a battle, let me tell you.

    But, let's be clear, I've got my money on Scotland. They're a great team and they're going to come out on top. And, when they do, it's going to be a huge win for America, because we love our sports and we love our victories.

    So, I encourage all of you to tune in and watch this amazing game. Let's show our support for Scotland and let's watch them bring home a big win.

    And, who knows, maybe one day soon we'll see an American team competing in the Six Nations. That's the kind of thinking we need, folks. That's the kind of big league ambition that makes America great.

    So, let's enjoy this game, let's cheer on Scotland, and let's make America proud. Thank you, and God bless America.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,599 ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    Any word on the status of the team. When did they fly to Scotland. Are they still to fly or are they already over there.


    I saw big delays in some flights this morning.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,644 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    Naw, trump would have said at least 5 times how great he was at the rugby.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,546 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Team is out. Matches up with Thornley's prediction bar Murray starting.




  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Kiera Miniature Bungalow


    I hadn't really been paying attention to the permutations, but if we win with a BP and neither England nor France win with a BP, we win the championship. Don't think it's overly far-fetched, our getting a BP will be tough but definitely not beyond the realms of possibility.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,939 ✭✭✭jacothelad


    Well, Asimov did write about psychohistory in his Foundation Series. Chomsky's psychiatry might be useful to Ulster 😉



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,939 ✭✭✭jacothelad


    The weather in Edinburgh today is fabulous. Very little snow, clear skies and blazing sunshine.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,573 ✭✭✭typhoony


    Any news on the Springjocks team?



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    Scotlands defence hasn’t been stellar. I’d expect this to be a high scoring game. Wouldn’t be surprised if we got a BP.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,729 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Good team, big back row



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,830 ✭✭✭✭AdamD


    I'm willing to die on this sword - Finn Russell is the most overrated player on the planet.



  • Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 35,118 Mod ✭✭✭✭AlmightyCushion




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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,795 ✭✭✭arsebiscuits1


    Bookies have us at -7 which is pretty fair.

    While we've had Scotlands number reasonably consistently over the years, the Murrayfield tests have been close.

    4 of the last 5 trips there have been one score games with 2 wins apiece and then a relative anomaly in 2015 with a resounding 40-10 victory for us.

    Scotland in their current form are probably their best iteration of the last 20+ years.

    The problem is there's a very strong argument that we are too.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,546 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Scotland with two changes to the backrow that started against France. Seems they're going for extra mobility to match our threats.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,475 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Scotland: 15 Stuart Hogg, 14 Kyle Steyn, 13 Huw Jones, 12 Sione Tuipulotu, 11 Duhan van der Merwe, 10 Finn Russell, 9 Ben White, 8 Jack Dempsey, 7 Jamie Ritchie, 6 Matt Fagerson, 5 Jonny Gray, 4 Richie Gray, 3 Zander Fagerson, 2 George Turner, 1 Pierre Schoeman

    Replacements: 16 Fraser Brown, 17 Jamie Bhatti, 18 Simon Berghan, 19 Scott Cummings, 20 Hamish Watson, 21 Ali Price, 22 Blair Kinghorn, 23 Chris Harris



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,175 ✭✭✭SaoPaulo41


    Thoughts on Healy being on bench instead of Kilcoyne? Thought killer did well last time out when he came on.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,795 ✭✭✭arsebiscuits1


    One thing I like to do is try to make a combined 23 of the teams.

    While Scotland, like many teams playing good rugby, are much better than the sum of their parts... I don't think there's a single player in their 23 I'd take over their Irish counterpart.

    I don't want this to sound like a callous Irish fan being over confident. I'm looking at the teams as objectively as possible and I just can't see it.

    Probably you could say VDM shades Lowe for the 11 spot.

    Maybe White for Murray?

    Richie Gray for Hendy?

    Watson for Conan? (Watson was extremely ordinary for Edinburgh being fairly well outplayed by MOTM Scott Penny)

    I don't think there is any Scot that gets a slam dunk pick over any of our 23 to be honest.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,533 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    Kilcoyne has done fine, but Healy was always likely to come back in once fit.

    No harm to get a look at him anyway, he's at an age where ability can start to decline rapidly.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,048 ✭✭✭Cosmo Kramer


    I think Duhan walks in to our team anyway. After that there are three or four more of the starting 15 that would be marginal either way (1, 5, 9).

    I'd also take Watson and Kinghorn on the bench over our equivalent options. Bhatti and Price would be close enough also.

    Having said all that though, I'd have us clearly ahead in about 10 of the starting positions and four of the bench spots. If we keep 15 on the park we should be winning this with a few points to spare.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,795 ✭✭✭arsebiscuits1


    Can't say I'd take Shoe over Porter nor Grey sr. over Ryan at these stages of their careers tbh.

    I do like the cut of Whites jib and I think he could push Murray close in a head to head.

    I thought about Kinghorn because I like him as an athlete. But he's little more than a pretender as a 10 option. Especially at international level. He's like a deer in headlights and has no reliable ability to kick off the tee.

    Not only that Finn Russell has played the full 80 in every single game so you'd be comparing Kinghorn against some of our outside backs. And he doesn't get near to any of them for me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,048 ✭✭✭Cosmo Kramer


    My mistake, I meant Henderson in the second row, not Ryan. Ryan's the first pick of all the second rows involved for me.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,475 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    I really don't see it with DVDM - He's a big unit and looks flash going forward but I really don't see the rest of his game being up to all that much.

    For me he's the epitome of the flat track bully.

    Lowe has the better all round game and contributes to the game more, likewise with Hansen.



  • Registered Users Posts: 719 ✭✭✭flatface


    I think Finn Russell will Finn Russell a few times and create some magic scoring opportunities for the Scots, but he will also likely Finn Russell a few times to create great opportunities for us.


    Overall our team is stronger at finishing our own and defending against opposition attacks. We have a great team, players back in, momentum and a very strong team spirit. Ireland by 2 scores.



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