National Hurling League 2023 Discussion

breezy1985 · 19-03-2023 10:24pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120377468#Comment_120377468

It's just trendy to batter it but it has always been the secondary tournament. People are acting like it's a new phenomenon that "needs fixing"

Just enjoy it for what it is. I certainly did today.

Iecrawfc · 19-03-2023 11:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120377583#Comment_120377583

Every 10 years or so it's the same cycle often from the same pundits, if there is not a mix of weaker teams in the top divisions it's a case of the elite teams don't want anyone breaking through, Westmeath etc. can't improve if they don't play the top teams then they change it and it's the elite teams want it easy playing the weaker teams, being hammered does nothing for Westmeath etc.

19-03-2023 11:36pm

In terms of the credibility of the current format I can't ignore why it was changed in 2020. It was because the 1A counties in the 2012-2019 format felt 1A was too competitive and that it was harming their ability to field younger players and that the stronger teams in 1B had an unfair advantage.

This was a knee jerk response to Galway winning the All-Ireland in 2017 and Limerick winning it in 2018 when they played in 1B in the spring. (The previous 5 seasons the champion came from 1A as did the 2019 champion)

They changed it three years ago because it was too competitive.

That speaks volumes about how the big counties perceive the league. However, it's all about perception. It may not be the cut throat contest we'd like to see but if it facilitates counties to play new faces in a competitive environment then it's serving a reasonably important purpose.

Historically though, there is a ridiculous cycle of the format being changed every 4/6 years because the traditional powers decide the format isn't working. In some cases those changes have been postponed because the wrong team got relegated (2007 league - Dublin at the time unexpectedly claimed one of the 9 division 1 spots for the planned 2008 format at the expense of Offaly and the restructure was postponed a year because of objections to Offaly starting the new format in division 2)

The main thing I'd love to see is just pick a format and stick to it. Stop chopping and changing every 5 or so years.

windy shepard henderson · 20-03-2023 12:08am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120377822#Comment_120377822

its stupid , do what they do in the football ,have two teams promoted and two teams relegated in each division , get rid of them stupid finals , kildare should be promoted to division 1 this year and not made play offaly again

and yes go back to the division 1/a 1/b system of a few years ago let the top 6 be in division 1 and the next 6 in 1/b

20-03-2023 12:30am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120377902#Comment_120377902

Yeah this would be close enough to my own preferred structure. One major reason I find it hard to get behind the current structure is because it's very similar to formats that were tried for spells in the 70's, 80's, 90's and 00's and each time it was dispensed with. It will be dispensed with in the coming years for very same reason it was dispensed with multiple times before.

If they stick with it and in ten years time we still have this format then fair enough, I'll take that. But I'm close to certain it will be tossed out in the next 3/4 years.

windy shepard henderson · 20-03-2023 12:41am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120377940#Comment_120377940

a neighbor of mine on the sunday game has a lot to answer for in my opinion , he was calling for the current format to help offaly , it didnt , he was actually giving out about it a few weeks ago cant win

yeah common sense needs to take hold here , larry mccarthy was an excellent gaa president , the tailtenn cup means no more division 1/a 1/b and four divisions and each county with its deserved place

we need the same in hurling , laois sligo and wexford are division 4 at the moment all one time excellent football counties , i dont see anyone changing the structures for them

Grats · 20-03-2023 5:53pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120377575#Comment_120377575

Incorrect.

YabaDabaDooley · 20-03-2023 6:48pm

Sat 19.30, Gaelic Grounds, Limerick v Tipperary

Sun 16.00, Nowlan Park, Kilkenny v Cork

The league has been a bit of a damp squib so far but the two semi finals should be good.

breezy1985 · 20-03-2023 7:12pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120380539#Comment_120380539

As delighted as I am with the home game I really think they should just give it to the top team next year and save the messing around.

Gonna be good craic round north Limerick that night with the rugby on at 17:15 in Thomond Park.

20-03-2023 7:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120380657#Comment_120380657

I had expected home venue on account of the long standing agreement between the two counties but I’d agree - the CCCCCCCC should be the ones deciding.

On account of that agreement Tipparary’s reward for topping the Munster round robin group in 2019 with a 100% record was an away game against ourselves in the Munster final. There should be a reward for finishing in 1st place.

evolvingtipperary101 · 20-03-2023 9:11pm

Just to say the coverage of the hurling on the Sunday Game last night was absolutely dire. I'm a fan of her but Cantwell's attitude towards the hurling last night was terrible. Left a bad taste in my mouth. I really do wish there was a rival show.

C4000 · 21-03-2023 4:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120381056#Comment_120381056

We need a separate hurling show. Ridiculous that they blatantly said they werent going to bother with the hurling as they've decided the football is more important. It'll be worse in the summer with the major expansion of the football championship and loads of additional matches.

breezy1985 · 21-03-2023 4:50pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120381056#Comment_120381056

By rival show do you mean a hurling show ?

Because a rival GAA show would be more blatantly football.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120383830#Comment_120383830

"blatantly said they werent going to bother with the hurling as they've decided the football is more important"

Did they actually say something to that effect ?

C4000 · 21-03-2023 5:36pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120383984#Comment_120383984

Pretty much. Joanne started the show by saying something along the lines of 'you'll forgive us for the football dominating today as there's nothing on the line in the Hurling league'

Billy Ocean · 21-03-2023 8:29pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120380782#Comment_120380782

Funnily enough I'd say Pat Ryan and Liam Cahill are happy enough to have away semi finals, probably see the trips to Gaelic Grounds and Nowlan Park as good character testers, I remember James O'Donoghue and Paddy Andrews saying on the Football Pod on Off the Ball that their managers used to love away games in the league to the likes of Mayo and Tyrone for that reason.

Grats · 21-03-2023 10:14pm

Well, like an away fixture or not, Tipp and Cork don't have a choice so the managers will put their own slant on it. What else could you expect. Kilkenny were in that position this time last year with a semi final in Cork.

In all honesty, we'd all prefer a home fixture!

randd1 · 22-03-2023 12:31pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120384196#Comment_120384196

Well, she wasn't wrong.

Hurling "experts" have been telling us for a while now, and especially after Waterford's post-league collapse last year, that it's not worth going all out in the league, going well in the league will do more harm than good, that the championship is all that matters. Pundits/columnists repeatedly saying the league has no cut to it, that it's become a series of competitive challenge matches. The structure itself basically made the final round meaningless apart from the Kilkenny/Waterford game, and both those sides have been in poor enough form. And the league itself has been of a poor quality in general this year and has had air of pessimism floating over it (especially with regard to the rampant cheating that is the throw replacing the hand pass, and the over-elaboration of the possession game it allows).

So if it's a choice of the above, or football matches that actually matter and may have an impact on the rest of the year, the obvious choice for a broadcaster is to go with the games that matter than the ones that don't.

If hurling wants more league games shown, then the league needs to matter. If it doesn't, then there's no use in complaining about it.

legendary.xix · 22-03-2023 6:26pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120384196#Comment_120384196

RTÉ were right to start with football. The hurling league has become a league of challenge games for the top 9 counties under the current format.

breezy1985 · 22-03-2023 6:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120388701#Comment_120388701

Whats all this old man shouting at clouds "become" talk that I keep hearing.

Always was not become.

C4000 · 22-03-2023 8:58pm

People who are interested in hurling still want to see these matches. Pundits might be complaining, but the games are still drawing crowds. The average attendance at this year's league matches is higher than it was in 2016/2017 when we had a supposedly way more competitive league.

Wouldnt agree with this idea that the games are just challenge matches. Yes teams are trying out different players and aren't fully up to championship pitch, but the players that are selected are out there trying to impress and secure their places in the team. Its the same as the league always was.

legendary.xix · 22-03-2023 9:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120389213#Comment_120389213

The hurling league has no jeopardy. The GAA could reduce the hurling ticket prices to €10 and play football Division 2 matches on hurling weekends so that there are competitive games for RTÉ and TG4 to broadcast.

breezy1985 · 22-03-2023 10:08pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120389423#Comment_120389423

Not winning should be jeopardy same as any other league.

You know who has the ultimate power to make winning important. The fans.

legendary.xix · 22-03-2023 10:16pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120389529#Comment_120389529

The one thing the leagues usually have brought is league status. The current format has removed the status of hurling counties being Division 1. The Munster Leagues don't need relegated but the national traditionally has that as it's strength.

breezy1985 · 22-03-2023 10:25pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120389559#Comment_120389559

What ?

Division 1 status was always a given for the top hurling teams. If they did ever get relegated to 2 they would batter everyone else.

breezy1985 · 22-03-2023 10:30pm

Any other sport and the league would be a closed shop with no relegation such is the gulf in class.

It's like thinking relegating one of the top 5 from the 6 Nations would help.

evolvingtipperary101 · 22-03-2023 10:40pm

Get rid of the league.

Get rid of provincials.

Have 3 divisions - from Antrim to Warwickshire. This way everyone will have wins and take beatings and get a sample of higher standards.

Home and away. Game every week. No question, the best squad will win.

Winner is the top banana.

Division 1 - Leinster and Munster competitors - Top four into semis and then final - 3 relegated - semis - 1 v 4, 2 v 3 - choice of venue for top two - final is three games played at Croker - winner is based on scoring aggregate and not on number of games won

Divisions 2 - Joe Mac & Christy Ring competitors - Top two promoted - 3rd to sixth wins promotion through semis and final - 3 relegated

Division 3 - Nicky and Lory competitors - Top two promoted - 3rd to sixth wins promotion through semis and final

legendary.xix · 22-03-2023 10:41pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120389604#Comment_120389604

Division 1A for 1 to 6 is a fair level. Brackets of 6 seems to suit hurling.

breezy1985 · 22-03-2023 10:45pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120389661#Comment_120389661

Tried that. It was crap.

And it did not increase the prestige or attendances of the leagues one single bit.

The only people who can do that are the fans.

legendary.xix · 22-03-2023 10:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120389627#Comment_120389627

The 3 lower ranked of the top 9 and the next best 3 is a fair level. Clare, Dublin, Wexford, Antrim, Laois and Westmeath.

breezy1985 · 22-03-2023 10:50pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120389687#Comment_120389687

Will it make winning division 1 more prestigious ?

And how ?

National Hurling League 2023 Discussion

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