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National Hurling League 2023 Discussion

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,448 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    There is a big battle in football to retain Division 1 status. Hurling previously had a good battle to retain Division 1A status. The 1A relegation final the last time was ridiculous though. The team finishing 6th should be automatically relegated.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,921 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    That's not the question I asked.

    A league that is all about the relegation battle is still a complete failure. If it was a success the country would not be full of Liverpool and Man United fans.

    Limerick were stuck in D1b for that time and it didn't make the league better/more exciting/prestigious one single bit. It was sht and way more sht than winning the league.

    Lots of big talk about making the league better but it won't add 1 single fan to the terrace or homecoming parade.

    "The league is sht" is just a nice excuse for fair weather fans.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,448 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    Your comment is fair but the league's edge has been about retaining status. Winning the league is a bonus. The majority of people would struggle to list off the last 10 league winners.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,921 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Sounds absolutely stupid and backwards to me.

    Is it really harder to list the last 10 football league winners than it is the last 10 years of relegation.



  • Registered Users Posts: 491 ✭✭Butterbeans


    Lot of truth in your last line there.

    The league has always been a secondary competition, which is perfectly fine. There's a huge amount of lazy commentary and punditry around it. If you win "can't get carried away, it's only the league". If you lose "ah sure it's only the league". Does it a disservice.

    It doesn't have the same bite as championship, and that's okay, it wouldn't work to have 2 big competitions of equal standing. I love going to league games and get to as many as I can, which is true for a lot of fans, and even if sides are experimental, I want my team to win. Its great for getting a look at new lads on the panel or lads who are progressing. Always love when Kilkenny win the league



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,448 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    At the moment it has the same bite as a preseason competition. That's why RTÉ started with football on Sunday night. The current hurling league format and favourable broadcasting are not compatible.



  • Registered Users Posts: 491 ✭✭Butterbeans


    Yeah, there's flaws absolutely. Only 1 game of consequence in the final round of games in 1A and B. Final too close to champ.....even if that only puts a few teams off seeking to go further, that skews it all. And yeah, we can change the format....again, but the constant tinkering does nothing for the appeal of it either.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,448 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    Agreed. There has been too much tinkering. If 1A and 1B have the same format as the other divisions, they should be able to leave it at that. Promote division winners and relegate the 6th team. Job done.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,733 ✭✭✭Grats




  • Registered Users Posts: 4,309 ✭✭✭evolvingtipperary101


    When the presenter of a show that promotes a national sport (our oldest and most valuable) that a state broadcaster has bought the rights to, I'd expect that presenter to treat the sport and competition to promote respect and value for the sport.

    Snide bullshit about it, making jokes about the state of the competition, won't cut it. It's actually very damaging. Whatever about social media complaints on here or elsewhere, that's a different format and can be taken likely. This is the national broadcaster, denigrating the sport. There's kids waiting all week, begging to stay up to watch that show and the someone comes out with that. That's bullshit of the highest order and it doesn't help anyone, especially the sport.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,448 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    Hurling had nothing on the line last week. RTÉ were very fair.



  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭C4000


    Two of the four semi final spots in the Hurling league were decided at the weekend.

    We'd be better off if the hurling and football rights were separated out and there were dedicated hurling shows.....the league sunday/Sunday game format doesn't work as they don't have the time to show everything. It's going to be a big issue this year with the substantial increase in the number of football matches.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,921 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    So her comment was wrong but all the pundits get to rip the absolute sht out of the competition and that's fine.

    Let's not forget you agree with her don't you.



  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭C4000


    One thing that is never mentioned with all the complaining about the league is the huge numbers of kids that are at these matches (free) and the enjoyment they get from running on to the pitch at the end to meet players. Was at Limerick v Westmeath in mulligar, there were a bus load of kids from Westmeath on the terrace beside me, they spent the day discussing whose autographs they might be able to get after the match.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,921 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    The kids thing needs to stop. Even worse the adults running on annoying players need to stop. They are queueing up with 10 mins to go to take part in this game.

    It was grand but it's become this this to be done "to be seen". They invaded the pitch while a Kerry league match was still on to get at Clifford. The Kildare footballers were trying to warm up in a mosh pit last week in Limerick at the double header. In Galway they were running on during the game robbing stuff from behind the goals.



  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭C4000


    Ah I think its great, they are genuinely excited and I don't think it bothers the players too much.

    The galway one was gas, coach left about 30 sliothars down for a drill, walked away for 5 minutes and the whole lot were swiped by a swarm of kids.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,309 ✭✭✭evolvingtipperary101




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,921 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    It's getting stupid though if it's at the point they are running on during games and warm ups.

    It became a social media event during Fossa games. A game to be played and nothing about just getting an autograph.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,309 ✭✭✭evolvingtipperary101


    It's one of the best things about the inter county league and the club - children's access to the field.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,921 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Sorry if I'm wrong but I thought you were one of the posters who thinks the current hurling league is pointless.

    You were saying league winners need All Ireland bonuses and the likes so it seemed to me like you agree with the Sunday Game



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,309 ✭✭✭evolvingtipperary101


    Never said it was pointless. But it needs to be changed and it will be.

    People like Joe Fortune made a great point that the divisions need more teams in them so everyone has teams of their standards while getting exposed to the higher standard teams. They should get an opportunity to face the best while also being in games they can realistically win. I don't think that's too much to ask for.

    If I had my way I'd make the championship a league - like the premiership. Combine them into one competition. Have your pre tournament but have a main championship league. No separation.

    The way the league is spoken about on national TV, by the state broadcasters and the likes of any commentators such as Anthony Daly, is a problem when its feckless and degrading.

    Opinions about the league and what should be done with it and the way the main promoters and owners of the footage of the league speak about it are two separate issues.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,983 ✭✭✭randd1


    Yeah, not a bad idea in an ideal world.

    Hurling has 35 teams if you count the three across the water. A 12 team senior championship, a 12 team intermediate championship, and an 11 team junior championship. Top two in the SF's, 3-6 in the QF's for each tier. Bottom team relegated, champions promoted.

    Do something similar with football, two 16 team divisions. Teams 1-8 face each other in QF's. Bottom 3 in Div 1 relegated. Two finalists and winner of promotion playoff (two losing semi-finalists) promoted from Div 2.

    Run direct knockout Cup competitions based on provincial system in both codes (solves the New York conundrum in football).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,921 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    The game won't go full league until it goes professional.

    Your asking for 18 games to win Sam and a knockout competition on the side.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,983 ✭✭✭randd1


    Yeah, I suppose. It'd be 24 weeks in total if you count a cup competition in football. A bit mad alright. Might be for the professional era as you say.

    Hurling could technically be run at the moment as a 12 Senior/12 Intermediate/11 Junior and amalgamate the provincials into it seeing as they basically have that many games anyway between the league and championship.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,448 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    The various hurling tiers in championship promote 1 team. That is fair enough for the championship. The league should offer a bit more variety. Divisions of 6 on metric promoting 2 and relegating 2 can spice up the league. If a team is out of their depth for a year, let them learn from the harsh lessons.

    For any of the top counties being in 1B, there can be little complaints if they are finishing third and missing out on promotion.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,309 ✭✭✭evolvingtipperary101


    If you win the league you play seven games. Round robin in munster is another four or five games if Kerry come into it. Then you're into knock out games in championship. If you got rid of championship and league as it is, and put them into a championship league you could have games every week and force a county to use its panel and extended panel. That way lads are not training for nothing.

    Why not have a game every week in a championship league- you'd be forced to rotate the panel in a proper manner, players will get a lot of games, and the best panel of players will win. Counties go too long not playing each other - does nothing to build up rivalries or get other counties involved. A lot of counties are out too soon after putting in too much effort.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,921 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    So it's ok to have a league/championship where teams are forced to rotate players but it's not ok to have a league where teams rotate players 🤔



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,448 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    After about 3 weekends of consecutive games, you'd want to give at least one rest weekend. A weekend off after league finals, provincial finals and All-Ireland semi-finals.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,309 ✭✭✭evolvingtipperary101


    The difference is, it's to be all-ireland champions - the league is now the championship, the championship is the league - everything is on the line and everyone plays each other and gets a game... Mother a god...



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,921 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    But why is it ok to have a championship where we pay to see a rotated squad rather than a league. Other than the fact the fans have decided the word championship means more.

    And how do you accept amateur players playing 18 highly important championship matches. And don't say squad rotation because you know the likes of Clifford or Lynch will be under pressure to play every week.



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