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Munster Team Talk Thread - Snymans are(n't) Forever

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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Okay...so then isn't Syd's argument logical? Like how long a period do people think there is between when it became clear he was going to stay with Ulster to it actually getting fleshed out, signed & announced?

    As I said above, the 3-year contract is the biggest telltale that there was some meaningful level of competition for him here, so it's not unreasonable to assume his agent has been going back and forth between the two clubs over recent weeks / months to see what the best deal he could wrangle out of them.

    I don't disagree that it is isn't a big problem for Munster having not been able to persuade him to return, but it definitely does look like at some point in recent weeks Munster have had to go back to the drawing board and dust off Plan B.

    That to me seems to be the essence of what Syd was saying.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,580 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    So Munster have to go back to the drawing board for a 3rd choice OH, and are missing out on a player who has 3 pro starts at 10 to his name, who they previously let go.

    It’s really not that big a deal.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,599 Mod ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    I see Exeter's Sean O'Brien has his contract expiring this season.


    With Exeter having just signed a centre he could become available and would be useful depth.



  • Registered Users Posts: 341 ✭✭bingobango12


    Agreed but there will be an issue if Crowley (likely) goes to the World Cup and Sexton gets injured (also likely) and Carberry is called up.

    With Munster looking like they will need to go after 1 or 2 front rows, along with possibly needing a senior centre, will they be allowed to sign an out half aswell?

    Flannery hasn’t done anything at Ulster and I’ve no idea if an academy out half would be up to the task but 10 could be an issue next season for you, particularly during the WC and international windows. But for all I know about the Munster academy, there could be a gem waiting in the wings.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,919 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    It's not a big deal, but it does mean one fewer IQ out-half who might have filled a red jersey is available.

    Maybe they have someone lined up and it's not a big deal.



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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,580 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    With the 2 senior 10’s in and around the Ireland reckoning, I think it’s a good candidate for an NIQ option.

    Especially considering we have, I think, the lowest number of NIQ players of any province at the moment.

    Would mean we can cast a much wider net.

    And / or they may promote Tony Butler early.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,236 ✭✭✭sprucemoose


    cant see any province getting a 10 who cant play (or potentially play) for ireland unless its an absolute emergency a la lealiifano



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,580 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Nucifora might be loathe to give an NIQ spot to 10 post-Sexton alright, but I think it’s possible we’ll see an NIQ for either 10 or centre.

    Given Nankivell, is already signed and Carbery and Crowley are both likely to continue to be in with a shout of Ireland selection, it think it might make sense. Particularly if he can cover centre as well.

    Once he’s at a decent level but Carbery and Crowley are still preferred in the 23 for the big games, I think it makes sense.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,236 ✭✭✭sprucemoose


    centre maybe since by definition there are double the amount of options available, 10 is too key a position for the irfu to allow a non-qualified player into any of the provinces barring a short-term deal

    anyway, its looking ever more likely that the munster team will be relatively full strength (as relative as that is) during the rwc so its the perfect time to give someone like butler a chance surrounded by more experienced players - the only slight caveat is that it would be with a 3rd or 4th choice 9



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,580 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Tbh, with the 10 and centre situation, not sure it's likely but someone like Frawley would be ideal.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 24,264 ✭✭✭✭phog


    Are some people thinking/suggesting that Flannery walked into the Ulster offices in the last day or so and put pen to paper and then Ulster went and announced it today as one big signing because that's the only reasonable explanation there is if you really think the cat was put amongst the pigeons here.

    I don't recall anyone here claiming that Munster weren't in the hunt for him but as I said in a previous post, aside from a mention of it 3 months ago there really hasn't been much more said on it until it was confirmed he was staying in Ulster.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    I think Ulster made it clear as soon as Healy announced he was leaving. That they wanted Flannery to stay. I’m sure Munster were well aware that this was a possibility from that point.

    It would appear though that Munster need to sign a 10 and a center. I wonder would Nucifora sign off on both being NIQ.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    That last paragraph is just asking for a Jimmy Gopperth scenario...



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,962 ✭✭✭realhorrorshow


    Would Conor Fitz to Munster make sense?



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,264 ✭✭✭✭phog


    He/Farrell/Munster have just allowed an IQ leave the country & probably never return, why would he care about us signing a replacement to him.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    Any player can leave, they can’t make them stay. Unless you believe we should cap every player at every province to fulfil their dreams of playing international rugby? Having 2 NIQ players in one position would be very unusual though.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,264 ✭✭✭✭phog


    I've previously posted that it would have been a **** thing to do, so no, I don't believe we should cap players which would obstruct their playing career paths elsewhere.

    If Munster are seeking a replacement to Healy then why would anyone care if the replacement is NIQ, the IQ one we had clearly wasn't required.

    As for centre, the few IQ centres we have aren't required by Ireland so who's career are we blocking by bringing in an NIQ centre.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    What was Nucifora supposed to do, steal his passport?

    Healy chose to go.

    In terms of the Irish 10 shirt he was probably justifiably behind at least 5 or 6 guys (maybe more), so it’s hardly unreasonable that he wasn’t capped or in squads.

    He recognised that himself and made the sensible decision to go to a weaker nation with less competition, where he has a better chance to compete.

    Good luck to him, but I don’t see how anyone in Irish rugby are to blame for this.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    I suppose it depends on who’s available. If I was Nucifora, I’d be having conversations with Frawley. Neither Leo or Leinster fans would be happy but it’s a move that makes a lot of sense for Ireland.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,264 ✭✭✭✭phog


    You started this asking would Nucifora sign off on two NIQ. Now you're introducing a possibility of him coercing a Leinster player to move here while also having just said no one could force Healy to stay.

    So, if we're talking about the possibility of Munster signing players from Leinster then surely those players would want something more than cover to Joey & Jack. There's such change coming in Leinster next year would any outhalf opt to leave there to be #3 in Munster.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    Well Nucifora has always favored movement between provinces over NIQ players. In this case I am thinking of Frawley as more of a 12 who can cover 10. Which is how Leinster view him and possibly Ireland too. I’m just using Frawley as an example as I can’t think of any Ulster or Connacht players who’d fit the bill.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,264 ✭✭✭✭phog


    Well if there's players floating around that are suitable and Nucifora/Munster can persuade them to sign up then there's no need for NIQ but if those players want to stay where they are and take their chances there then he can hardly stop Munster signing NIQ players.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,180 ✭✭✭✭mahoney_j


    What was plan b ……unless we’ve a truck up our sleeve next season it’s going to be no better than this ……a very poor front row against quality opposition …..major problem in the most pivotal position 10…..earls /o mahony heading twoards end of there careers coaching ticket have it all to do



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,180 ✭✭✭✭mahoney_j


    Who says they would be no 3 carbery has poor form ….Crowley has promise but we don’t know his level …..if and a big if it was frawley to come in it’s a level playing field and a straight shoot out as to who is starting 10



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,409 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    I don't think Leinster are going to give up any player that's currently in their starting 23 for Heineken quarterfinals.

    Munster will probably have Carbery and Butler to cover for the URC. Even if Sexton gets injured, Harry Byrne and Frawley are the cohesion replacements who will be drafted in.

    I'm more worried about scrum half. There are rumours that Patterson has suffered a serious knee injury in training. Murray and Casey are both going to be in Irish camp.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,580 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    What’s Cronin’s situation? He and Coughlan would be reasonable for cover during the RWC at least, as 4th and 5th choice.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,264 ✭✭✭✭phog


    This discussion started because Ulster announced they had re-signed Flannery, who was mentioned in despatches that Munster might sign as cover.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,264 ✭✭✭✭phog


    Cronin has been poor for us and I thought he was ending this season but maybe he's ok as cover. I'd prefer to see us go ve time to Coughlan if it was between the two of them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    Ok but that has not been the policy in the past. So we’ll see what happens. Personally I don’t believe Munster will be allowed sign two NIQ centres but we will see.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,778 ✭✭✭Jump_In_Jack


    It will probably depend a bit on how the next two URC rounds go.

    If Munster end up in the Challenge Cup next season, then I can't see why we wouldn't use that to develop academy/squad players, much like Connacht did this season.



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