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Hurling- what’s gone wrong and where do we go from here.

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,870 ✭✭✭CrabRevolution


    This already happens though. Over the years in Meath we've had several players from Limerick, Tipp, Dublin etc. playing with us. We had 2010 Tipperary All Ireland winner Timmy Hammersley playing for us at one stage.

    One of our best players this year is a Tipperary man, though he recently transferred to a Meath club.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,815 ✭✭✭Sunny Disposition


    Quite a good article, it's a pity not to see more of this in the main papers. He's obviously thought about it and researched it.


    This line really sums up hurling in recent years.

    "To some, this is fascinating, to many, this is simply boring."

    I would be concerned about inter county hurling. I think the interest is far less intense among supporters than was the case a few years ago. i don't think there's a will to do anything about that either.



  • Registered Users Posts: 511 ✭✭✭Davys Fits


    Some are happy that throwing the ball around allows for tactical play to develop and they find that fascinating. If you can easily keep possession then you can mount a tactical game, as is the case with Gaelic football. If you cant easily keep possession (clean up the handpass) then all bets are off and the madness of the old game prevails. I know which one I prefer when Its legal and skillful.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,309 ✭✭✭evolvingtipperary101


    I've proposed the exact same thing somewhere on one of these threads. Joe Canning says he would back a group stage championship, which would combine the league and championship into a single competition. Get rid of pre tournaments. I'd agree with that one hundred percent. It's over for the provincials.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,174 ✭✭✭Lost Ormond


    i dont see why you need to get rid of the provincial competitions. you can retain them even if you had a league based championship. you could play it in between the league rounds. would only take 3 weekends. no replays. counties could if knocked out play club championship potentially. give a decent reward to ensure counties dont dismiss them or treat them like a secondary tournament.

    Totally agree with remvoing pre season competitions. teams are playing loads of friendlies anyway



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,309 ✭✭✭evolvingtipperary101


    Maybe, you could play a Triple crown kind of thing within the league itself?

    But you couldn't have a separate comp if you're going to do a 10 or 12 team open-form league.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,007 ✭✭✭randd1


    You easily could different meaningful competitions in hurling.

    Say you had a 12 team round robin Championship, top two of the round robin go to AISF's and the next 4 teams go to the AIQF's, with bottom team relegated. Simple format, and would work for the lower tiers (12 team Intermediate, 11 team Junior) as well, including promotion/relegation of course. Roughly the same amount of games as we currently have, but all of them meaningful.

    And then you could have a Cup competition based on the traditional Provincial setup. The provinces always worked better as a knockout competition anyway. The Cup could work out that the provincial winners go to the SF, the Ulster champions play Galway in one QF and the two provincial losers play in the other QF. If all games finish on the day then you'd have no more than 6 rounds from start to finish. Or Galway and Antrim into Leinster and have straight knockout, so there's no more than 5 rounds in total (which I'd prefer as it would be real knockout).

    Run the cup on alternating weekends throughout the round robin phase and finish before the championship knockout begins, and you'd have a championship that matters and knockout games from pretty much the start of the season to keep the fans engaged.

    A weeks break every 5 weeks during the round robin/cup phase, having the AI final on the last week of July and work backwards, you'd be starting towards the end of February, which gives plenty of time at the start of the year for the colleges/pre-season, as well as a proper Christmas break.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,170 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    To be summarized as "my team ar not winning any more wawawawawa"

    "What made hurling brilliant was the chaos. The duels. The Battles. The Contests. The roar of the crowd. The Clash of the Ash."

    If you ain't seeing duels, battles, contests, crowds and the clash of the ash (whatever the fuk that actually means) at Limerick games you are blind or more likely willfully so through bitterness.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,589 ✭✭✭newhouse87


    Kilkenny were wining just as much as this limerick team over a decade ago and nobody was saying it was boring, the style of play limerick have introduced is reminiscent of football tactics. Outside of limerick, id wager most people consider hurling to be a lot less attractive to watch with rugby/football style tactics on show and lads with acres of space after getting a throwball from a ruck pointing from the halfway line. BTW tipp were last team other than limerick to win all ireland in 2019 so hardly a famine to be crying about.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,170 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Would you have any stats there to back up a decline in attendance or viewership.

    People were btching about Cork and their tactics under McCarthy/Allen and we're btching about all sorts of bending the rules with Kilkenny.

    Rewrite history in your own head and pretend all you like that it was nothing but honest praise and standing ovations from the opposition for that Kilkenny team. But it's bollix kid.

    Funny that never once at a Limerick match do I hear this stuff come up from opposition fans. Only on whingebag threads or the blogs of failed journalists.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,589 ✭✭✭newhouse87


    Where did i say there was a decline in attendances or viewership, appreciate if you didn't put words in my mouth like you see posters on current affairs threads. I don't expect you to acknowledge the lack of entertainment value in intercounty hurling at the moment, doubt i would see it either if tipp were winning so much. I work wit a few kilkenny lads and most agree this is a great limerick team but the style of play is just not appealing to those outside of limerick. BTW unless fans are confrontational, they are not going to go up to opposition fans and say " ah yere winning but ye are shite to watch".



  • Registered Users Posts: 235 ✭✭Freneys Treasure


    You've repeatedly shown an incapacity to understand that it is the decline in the entertainment level of the game that people have concerns about, not who is or who is not winning.

    Of course successful teams that have gone before have been subjected to constant whining and criticism of their approach (indeed some of the biggest whiners during the era of Kilkenny dominance were Limerick people who spent most of the decade following 2007 crying about Kilkenny's approach to the game) but if you re-read Newhouse87's post he never claimed there "was nothing but honest praise and standing ovations from the opposition for that Kilkenny team", (this is something you simply made up and assigned to him to suit your argument) he stated that Kilkenny's approach to the game was never thought of as boring, whereas the way game has evolved this time round has lead to a sport that is simply not as entertaining as it once was.

    Based on your infantile response to the posted article, you obviously take this notion to be an anti-Limerick thing, but it is not, the main points of the first part of the article would still apply if Cork for example won this years All-Ireland 



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,170 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    There is no decline in entertainment.

    Just old men shouting at clouds.





  • Bit of a silly post to be honest. You probably didn't watch games like the Munster final last year. Skill levels have never been higher. Sit back, relax and enjoy this fine Limerick team



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,143 ✭✭✭Billy Ocean


    The game has never been more skilful that it is now but probably just a bit of spontaneity lacking at times, this might sound mad but with the level of coaching, S&C etc. these days some games are almost too perfect and are a bit like a video game, Kilkenny scoring 2-26 in last year's final and losing an example of that , to put a snooker terminology on it some games now are frame after frame won by century break after century break and not many safety battles or missed pots adding excitement. I still find the enjoyable on the whole but just my observation.

    Post edited by Billy Ocean on


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 195 ✭✭Deiselurker


    I'd agree with that. I think hurling entertainment value was probably at it's best in the 2000s but now everything is so prepared so there is less off the cuff hurling and less mistakes. I don't get the same excitement as I did from watching games now.



  • Registered Users Posts: 511 ✭✭✭Davys Fits


    Maybe you can define old men for us? Are we the ones that cant see the 3mm gap between the palm of the hand and the ball or cant count more than 4 steps?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,168 ✭✭✭zetecescort


    how long before they clamp down on arms and hurleys around the neck? no player carries the ball under their chin

    but, sure look it, let it flow etc etc



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,532 ✭✭✭crossman47


    Agree completely. Robotic LImerick are turning me off hurling (and I've been watching for more than sixty years.



  • Registered Users Posts: 829 ✭✭✭Glenomra


    watching hurling for decades also, and never enjoyed it as much.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 943 ✭✭✭Vinnie222


    Limerick are at a different level. 1st touch, movement and their skill level are well above anyone else.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,069 ✭✭✭awaywithyou


    Limerick are a joy to watch... the skill they have for the size of men they are... gearoid hegartys skill level out of this world... their movement is top class.. someone was on bout snooker in an earlier post.. limerick are thinking three or four stick passes or handpasses ahead of everyone else... the way they work together as a team passing the ball around is probably what i enjoy the most.... they have similarities with the Kilkenny team from 2002-2012 in terms of physical size and strength... kilkenny blew teams away as quickly as possible mainly by scoring goals... this limerick outfit doesnt score that many goals.. definitely not as many as KK did but i do think they have more skill and hurling ability and they also are greater then the sum of there parts...

    what has happened with the underage system in KK.. it used to be the envy of the other hurling counties... whoever is over the development squads etc. seems to have fell asleep at the wheel about 10 years ago... the KK players that played today i would be slow to criticise them as they are the product of what is obviously a failing underage structure



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    When did Limerick last string four stick passes together?

    I know a lot of this stuff is sour grapes towards Limerick from hurling counties who don't like to see an underdog dominating them but Limerick are hard work to watch



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,495 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    Thats correct, people like me no longer bother watching games like the Munster final, because they are boring for neutrals.

    I thought that was the entire point of the thread.

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


  • Registered Users Posts: 235 ✭✭Freneys Treasure


    I think posters should be careful not to conflate Limerick's dominance with the general problems with how the game is played and refereed.

    While how Limerick play is based on blatant cheating via throwball, they are good enough to win the game any way it is played and although some boredom results from watching them hammer teams, it is disparate to the boredom induced by the sporadic, methodical approach to the game taken by many teams these days, facilitated by the game not being refereed properly

    Post edited by Freneys Treasure on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,069 ✭✭✭awaywithyou


    tom morrissey was adjudged by ref to have thrown a ball yest.. when a replay was shown on tv.. he clearly handpassed it



  • Registered Users Posts: 655 ✭✭✭BoxcarWilliam99


    I hadn't watch a match in a long time tbh and when the camera was showing the Limerick lads lining up the build and size of these guys is immediately noticeable. The Limerick full back is a unit of a man as is most of the team. I'm sure this is the norm in GAA now at this level.

    To think it's still an amateur sport is crazy. It should be semi professional at least. There should be some sort of payment for these lads who give everything



  • Registered Users Posts: 235 ✭✭Freneys Treasure


    So what? Leaving aside the argument that could be made that he didn't perform the handpass in a way that demonstrated a clear striking action to the referee and so deserved to be penalized, are you trying to suggest one questionable call by the referee means that Limerick don't throw the ball? This is the Derek McGrath/Dalo mindset that has lead to this blight on the game being ignored.

    The throwing was at farcical levels again yesterday, in general Limerick will perform a legal handpass when under no pressure such as across the full back line, but when under pressure or as part of a move up the pitch, the ball is flung around like a hand grenade



  • Registered Users Posts: 787 ✭✭✭cnoc




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Would love to see a Cork or Wexford or Waterford win Liam this year.

    I think hurling needs it, somebody new to win it & make it meaningful again.

    Limerick looked to be at a different level again or the other team’s haven’t closed the gap yet though.

    Having a match on with empty terraces like yesterday does no favours to build an atmosphere or sense of occasion.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,971 ✭✭✭teednab-el


    Nothing wrong just Limerick too good at the moment and the other counties aren't up to their level. Same as Kilkenny before Tipp beat them in 2010. Limerick will be beaten some day too maybe not this year though. Limerick fans appreciate it while it lasts.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,170 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Were you at the game yesterday ?

    I thought the atmosphere was great until the game faded in the last few minutes.

    Someone new like "a Cork" who have only won 30 odd titles and a million Munsters 🤣



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Mundane enough

    Well they haven’t won Liam in almost 20 year’s so I’d say they’re due.



  • Registered Users Posts: 511 ✭✭✭Davys Fits


    Flanagans handpass to Gillane for the second goal was sublime and an example of the perfect legal handpass off the hurley. Why cant we encourage more of this and less of the other throwing stuff with a simple rule change...



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,309 ✭✭✭evolvingtipperary101


    Why are posters discussing yesterday's match on here? Or who wins what? Or anything to do with Limerick or any other county's style of play?

    That has nothing to do with the thread...



  • Registered Users Posts: 89 ✭✭Clare in Exile


    It can't be denied that hurling does have an issue currently. The analogy with century breaks in snooker was spot on. The fact that Kilkenny lost the All-Ireland Final last year with the score that they shot tells you that something is wrong. I've little interest in watching a game where it's almost a constant stream of either points or wides. The madness of some of the games from not too long ago has definitely disappeared, nowadays it's almost too structured, close to perfection as someone said.

    I much prefer a contest such as Clare v Cork in the football yesterday, where every score was hard fought for and had an effect on the match.

    With the scoring rates in hurling these days, I'm constantly reminded that the final tally of 1-13 to 2-08 in the 1995 final is often being bettered by half-time in most of today's hurling matches.

    Something has gone wrong, the midfield contest has become a thing of the past and as someone said over the last few days, it's now almost become the case that corner forwards are being asked to minimise the amount of scores that corner backs shoot.

    Interesting discussion...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,971 ✭✭✭teednab-el


    Cork are going 26 years without a league. 18 years without an All Ireland and 5 years without a Munster championship. 🤣🤣🤣. A generation without success for the first two.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,170 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,170 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,170 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Don't you know this is just the hurling version of the old "split Dublin" threads.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,971 ✭✭✭teednab-el


    You should know what it feels like. Limerick waited a long time for all Ireland final championship success. 1973-2018.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,170 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Wow I never knew that.

    Must have been a great time for the rest of ye to not have us around ruining hurling for everyone.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,593 ✭✭✭Asdfgh2020


    How about splitting Limerick…….a ‘Limerick city’ based team consisting of teams from city only and then a limerick county team with players from everywhere else…🤣



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,145 ✭✭✭Rosita


    Even longer than that. Apparently 2018 doesn't count either as Cork should've won it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,971 ✭✭✭teednab-el


    Nobody said Limerick were ruining Hurling. I said here already on this forum that It's up to every other county to get up to Limericks level. Not Limericks fault at all. They are a great team. I love the way they play the game right now.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,971 ✭✭✭teednab-el


    Well they came back and won it that day and the result is all that matters.



  • Registered Users Posts: 648 ✭✭✭jeff bingham


    Would love to see a rule introduced whereby the player fouled strikes the free. If its a case of someone on opposite team fouling the ball the ref quickly picks the first player on the scene. I would apply something similar to the line ball. Closest player to it strikes it.

    Its becoming a pain to watch a full forward or whoever jog out 100 yards to take a free and slow everything down.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,145 ✭✭✭Rosita


    That would encourage more fouling as it wouldn't be a specialist free-taker each time.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,170 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    "When did Limerick last string four stick passes together?"

    Sunday. Barry Nash goal.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,815 ✭✭✭Sunny Disposition


    It's doing the thread an injustice to say it's anti-Limerick. It's not about Limerick, it's about how the game has changed for the worse. No one could blame that on Limerick.



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