Irish Property Market chat II - *read mod note post #1 before posting*

But everyone is not the same. If someone in another company gets a pay rise, there could be all sorts of variables behind it. Is his/her company profitable? Is he/she providing a service that is in demand? Is he or she underpaid by industry standards and thus could get a higher salary elsewhere. My brother recently got a 10% rise, so he told me. He, however, works in a different industry and is a far, far more talented and skilled individual than I am. Thus, it's apples and oranges, once again.

In the case of the civil service, many (though certainly not all) people in there are working in jobs that in reality are not required. There is massive bloat in the civil service, and many of these jobs simply aren't needed. In such a situation, the individual working in that job has no right to expect a pay rise. They should simply be happy that they have a job at all.

Please don't think that I'm saying this out of acrimony. I'm sure many civil servants are fine people, but there's no free lunch at the end of the day. If they get a large salary increase across the board, taxpayers will have to pay for it, and it would only worsen inflation.

Honestly, I think that the entire civil service needs to be audited (independently) and massively reduced in size. With the money saved, the staff who are needed could be given a pay rise. However, that's not happening, and we all know that.

Bless them ....

No one is blaming civil servants. We're discussing economic and fiscal policy and decisions that can and have contributed to rising costs.

There's plenty of blame to go around, and there's no single cause of the crisis; there never is.

My own two cents is that this is decades in the making, and the root cause is neo-liberalism/globalism that sees us chasing infinite GDP growth. All countries in the West are suffering broadly similar problems to Ireland. It's not just housing; every social system is in decline, and everything is becoming more and more expensive.

Single civil servants aren't the problem in the housing crisis, but if two of them get together as a couple they have significant buying power and push up prices and that becomes a problem. We might need a law, no marriage amongst civil servants, or else come up with a new legal caste where civil servants can't outbid non civil servants on property as their wages are paid by taxes. The problem obviously is that they are all so detestable that no-one outside the public sector will consider a mixed private sector/public sector relationship, so if we ban intra sector marriage it might be considered unfair by some. 🤣

I couldnt believe the amount of teachers that left my kids school last summer. And then I finds out that even more are leaving this summer.

The wages of tech workers has come up many times on this board, and rightly so. The huge salaries that are available in the IT industry here have certainly contributed to housing price inflation here.

The salient point here is that when a large number of people are in receipt of a large salary, there are knock-on effects in the economy as a whole.

First we are going to cut the wages of the civil servants, and then the IT workers. Is that what you want :)

There have been lots of layoffs in the IT sector and if the company does not make a profit then you can bet that the employees of that company will not be getting a payrise the same cannot be said for civil servants

Why did you have to quote fliball123 :)

I have him on ignore. Why? Because all of his posts are going off on one about the public sector. They just werent making any sense so I put him on ignore. Even though all I saw was a blank post I knew full well it was some rant about the public sector. which i now see when you quoted him. I can do without seeing them honestly :)

Just to be clear though, I am private sector myself but there is some serious thinly veiled jealousy out there for certain sectors. That kind of stuff is best just avoided altogether. Once you start engaging with them there will be a flood of more rants and then what was an interesting conversation is ruined.

It's not surprising they got pay increases for 6 or 7 years after the troika were in to claw back some of the massive austerity pay cuts some of which were temporary, also a huge new tax/pension deduction on salary was introduced to pay for the same pension they were already getting which is another pay cut relative to pre austerity.

You can't compare private and public sector jobs like they are the same, you need to compare by role and qualifications required etc.

20% higher means nothing, you may as well say HSE doctors get paid 20% more than barristas. Does that 20% include bonuses, tips, cash jobs, tax avoidance patent schemes etc.?

The public sector is open to everyone, if they get such an amazing deal people can just join.

Recent public sector pay increases have been nowhere near keeping track of inflation, they are not 'near inflation' levels.

52% of public sector salary increases for people on the higher rate go straight back to the exchequer (never leaves in the first place) and another large chunk goes back in a pension deduction, which is essentially a new public sector tax brought in post troika, because when it came in it didn't add anything to existing pension benefits. You might be surprised to hear that the public sector is also made up of TAX PAYERs and they are paying a bigger percentage of their salary to the exchequer than anyone else.

Are you seriously holding the UK up as a target for policy? I have to stop typing now my sides hurt too much 🤣

You're free to move to the UK you know, and see your TAX spent wisely!

The case with regards to public sector pensions is the majority of public sector workers including new recruits come no where paying the full costs of their public sector pension. They contribute more than they did but it still falls short. As for pay rises you only have to look at the continued upward cost of servicing public sector pay and pensions from 2013 to 2022 to see that were were pay rises mainly via increments going on but in the land of the public sector an increment is not seen as pay rise yet it all has to be paid for from the tax payers pocket or from borrowing and that borrowing is going to be squarely biting the tax payer in the hole as debt is rolled over to the new higher interest rates

Some major troll feeding going on here. Knew the thread would be ruined. Is this not about the property market?