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What would they have done with the Twin Towers if they hadn't collapsed completely?

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,388 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    Do you really think a helicopter can hover so still that it would allow you time to catch a rope, figure out where the end is, work out how to tie it through your belt loops (are your loops even big enough to fit a rope through?) hold your breath for a few seconds, and then jump out a window?

    What happens next? Do you climb up the rope like Indiana Jones? Do they drop you onto another building's roof like in The Matrix?

    Seriously, life is not like action films. There is no way anything even close to what you are suggesting would have worked.

    Helicopters move around when they are hovering still. One tiny movement from the helicopter and the rope you are delicately trying to tie around your waist would jerk out of your hands at best and at worst, pull you out the window when you're not ready. And that's even if they could somehow get it to you in through a window (they couldn't)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,317 ✭✭✭gameoverdude


    So the moral to your post that employee's require bull whips on induction day? I'm on board!



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭Brid Hegarty


    You're entitled to turn the sarcasm back on at any time you want. You ask if I play too much GTA? Well lets think of it this way; if I had a hypothetical thought 25 years ago and suggested to you that it would be possible for a team of just 10 hijackers to make the entire world trade centre disappear inside of two hours without any bombs or guns, you'd have made a similar remark towards me. And you'd have been wrong!



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭Brid Hegarty


    @o1s1n Do you really think a helicopter can hover so still that it would allow you time to catch a rope

    Well yeah I do, here's a guy at 5:44 deliberately making sudden movements with the joystick and it would still be fine for all of that to be happening while someone would be tying up the rope... assuming the rope was long enough.

    @o1s1n are your loops even big enough to fit a rope through?)

    Now you're just being difficult. I dare you to report back to me after finding any piece of rope in your garage and trying it.

    @o1s1n Helicopters move around when they are hovering still. One tiny movement from the helicopter and the rope you are delicately trying to tie around your waist would jerk out of your hands...

    Only if the rope you brought wasn't long enough. It goes without saying that any person with a reasonable amount of intelligence would anticipate this issue.

    @o1s1n ...pull you out the window when you're not ready. 

    So? That's the one thing you're all forgetting, isn't it! That you'd die anyway.

    There is a chance that it mightn't work, but not because of any reason you suggested. No, the only reason it might be dangerous for the pilot is if the person jumped before being instructed to do so... because the longer the rope, the more of a shock this would give to the helicopter once the rope would become taught if they jumped. If this did happen, I don't know how easy it would be for a chopper to with-stand this force... I know you'll say it couldn't! The other reason it mightn't work is if people couldn't keep calm enough, and started fighting for the rope. You still couldn't stand to lose in that case though as it would not affect the safety of the chopper.

    At some windows the people were crowded, while at other windows there were people that could be seen all alone. The trick would be to go towards one of those windows. I wonder if the instructor on the chopper brought a speaker and said "don't jump, wait to be pulled"!

    @o1s1n What happens next? Do you climb up the rope like Indiana Jones? Do they drop you onto another building's roof like in The Matrix?

    I'm not even going to answer that. That's the easy part.

    You're just being difficult with me for your own amusement. If I hadn't mentioned the idea of tying the rope around someone's waste in my initial suggestion, the very first thing you'd say is "oh it wouldn't work because there'd be too much force for someone to hold on to the rope with with their hands". You're just a naysayer.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,317 ✭✭✭gameoverdude


    Oh my. What in your opinion is the best type of knot to use? Trouser loops are well known for their helicopter strength design. Friction of the rope is not important as it would be nivia coated.

    Asides from that, sure its only a building on fire and collapsing. Not a bother!



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭Brid Hegarty


    Panic? You've never been in such a situation so you can not immediately assume that you'd be panicking. People who undergo the experience of being in an emergency are often surprised at how they handle themselves.

    This photo was taken 1 hour and 30 minutes after that tower was hit. The smoke is only in certain areas. You cannot assume that every one of those rooms was so full of smoke that you'd have to hold your breathe. Now if you were to try this an hour earlier, it would be easier. The idea would work in theory and there was actually quite a bit of time to plan it.




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭Brid Hegarty


    Ah yeah, they resort to sarcasm when they're stuck.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,317 ✭✭✭gameoverdude




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,447 ✭✭✭✭Jim_Hodge


    Christ but this has become bizarre.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭Brid Hegarty


    @gameoverdude Have you ever seen the twin towers? They were pretty big. Not to mention the surrounding buildings. It's downtown NYC!

    What's your point?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,317 ✭✭✭gameoverdude




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,447 ✭✭✭✭Jim_Hodge


    It seems the point is you haven't a clue how things work in the real world.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,957 ✭✭✭kirk.


    What's the discussion here is it rescuing people in helicopters ?

    Would it be possible on the roof



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,447 ✭✭✭✭Jim_Hodge


    It started with what would have been done with the buildings had they not collapsed and leapt to throwing ropes from helicopters to rescue people.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,362 ✭✭✭mojesius


    It wasn't possible on 9/11 as the access doors to the rooftops were locked, there was no one on the rooftops to rescue; unlike the 1993 bombing where people were rescued from the roof.

    Additionally, the heat and billowing smoke from the jet fuel as reported by the police helicopter made it impossible. Both towers were engulfed. They saw a spot on the north tower roof that was clear but there was nobody there to attempt a daring rescue. Also, they didn't know if more planes were incoming.

    The helicopter police said all they could do was bear witness to the 100s of people waving at them from the windows. Very sad.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,317 ✭✭✭gameoverdude




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,447 ✭✭✭✭Jim_Hodge




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,317 ✭✭✭gameoverdude




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,388 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    It is seriously the kind of escape plan a six year old would have drawn up with crayons.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,447 ✭✭✭✭Jim_Hodge


    I know but I keep seeing Towering Inferno when I read the OP's rescue plans.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,388 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    I just keep thinking of John McClane bouncing off the side of Nakatomi plaza on the end of a fire hose.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,317 ✭✭✭gameoverdude




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,001 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    Not a hope of a chopper landing on the helipads.

    the pilots had zero visibility to approach and to land safely on the helipad…

    ingesting the smoke into the engines and into the lungs of the crew would have been fatal.. for crews and those who temporarily survived.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,769 ✭✭✭✭greenspurs


    No problem .......

    "Bright lights and Thunder .................... " #NoPopcorn



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,580 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    National Geographic made a six part documentary series for the 20 the anniversary.

    Probably the most in depth documentary on the topic from the human perspective, one of the people interviewed was one of the people who was in the helicopter circling the towers, they said they were so close they could count the pebbles on the roof of one of towers but nobody had gotten access to the roof, one corner was free of smoke but there was nobody there.

    He described how he could see the anguish on the faces of the people hanging out of the windows but there was no way they could get to them.

    As for the buildings had they stood, there had been a quote of a several billion given to the new owner in the summer of 2001 for removal of the asbestos that was used in one and a half of the towers. The only possible outcome would have been demolition. The buildings had the attacks not happened would likely have been demolished /deconstructed and rebuilt by now anyway.

    Glazers Out!



  • Registered Users Posts: 119 ✭✭slither12


    I'm surprised no one has talked about the asbestos which made the towers a serious liability. It was almost a blessing in disguise for Silverstein as he no longer had to pay for the costly asbestos removal.

    Personally the Freedom Towers are not only safer, but more aesthetically attractive.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭Brid Hegarty


    Freedom tower, not towers. I don’t know if it looks better, but it’s certainly not as iconic… that’s for sure!

    Did you know that the asbestos was only up to about floor 40. The regulations changed while they were being built.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭Brid Hegarty


    Okay then why don’t you explain, with 20+ years of wisdom, what would be the best (or least worst) thing to do to save them?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,769 ✭✭✭✭greenspurs


    Best - deffo the big inflatable slide ........

    Least Worst - Also, deffo the big inflatable slide .......

    "Bright lights and Thunder .................... " #NoPopcorn



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭Brid Hegarty


    But how could they possibly build a slide that big and put it in place so quickly?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,447 ✭✭✭✭Jim_Hodge




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,769 ✭✭✭✭greenspurs


    You are taking the pee ..... 😣


    • has left the group ................................

    "Bright lights and Thunder .................... " #NoPopcorn



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,001 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    My guess no.

    the amount of smoke would have made it impossible….

    helicopters couldn’t land in zero visibility on a structure with vasts amount of equipment, ie. Satellite dishes, aircon units, maintenance huts…..never locate the helipad

    helicopters couldn’t land and operate with smoke the being ingested into the engines

    crew would have been overcome by smoke / fumes..




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭Brid Hegarty


    Didn’t you already say something very similar to that? The question isn’t about landing on the roof. That was never up for discussion.



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