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"Green" policies are destroying this country

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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,551 ✭✭✭roosterman71


    Last sentance is rubbish right. We're tied into EU pricing structures re gas. Tying ourself to the UK who can then charge what they like to us outside of collective EU buying power is madness. Depending on others for critical things is bad news. We should be capable of sustaining ourself as best as possible



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    It's interesting you bring up non-compliance with EU directives as regards energy security. As far as I am aware there is no action forthcoming on that but maybe you have some info. I know it's been highlighted locally but I haven't seen anything from the EU.

    As an aside there are several actions opened against Ireland for non-compliance to other directives

    I'm sure you are as concerned as I am about Ireland's non-compliance as regards emissions

    The NEC Directive sets national emission reduction commitments for several pollutants to be attained by each Member State each year between 2020 and 2029, and more ambitious reductions for 2030 onwards. Member States are required to establish national air pollution control programmes (NAPCPs) to show how these reduction commitments will be met.

    The Irish EPA have a good write up on our non-compliance issue that might interest you




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    When second hand ev market kicks in and people realise that wealth influences range. It will be interesting



  • Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭AnFearCeart


    Was in a car dealers last week. 2012 EV on the forecourt and was there the last time I was there, so enquired for the pig iron of it. Selling price, a sweet fiver short of €4K. Range 80km.

    No doubt it will be there next week and the week after.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    This is it. When yall have to keep paying each time the standard charging fee. Yall get annoyed really quickly. Grand when ya have a shiney new ev. Not so much when the capacity on the battery is run down over the years.

    Batteries are finicky too. Ya could drive it out of the car dealership and a month later the battery is completely shite holding no charge.

    Unless batteries can be replaced cheap and recycled properly. A least an ice ya can tell straight away by a good mechanic by the way it sounds. And if maintained will last you a long time which in turn saves on waste.

    If ya really wanted to help things scrape these Pcp loans and such and stop people changing there cars every year for a new one. Complete madness that.

    I'm all for looking after environmental of this little planet but is has to be realistic and practical changes to help it.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,593 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,395 ✭✭✭prunudo


    You're last couple of paragraphs sums up my view of the current green agenda, its all about money. Getting people to spend money on things they don't need, on things that have no lifespan and need to be replaced frequently. Consumerism and using finite resources is what is damaging the environment.

    I just don't see the logic in spending 60k on a car that will have to be replaced in 5 years, from both a monetary and wastefulness point of view.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,199 ✭✭✭✭Furze99


    In fairness to the Green Party, I don't think they are really hugely enthusiastic about EVs. They'd rather an urban life society with transport by cycling, walking and public transport. They (I hope) have been kinda shoehorned into supporting the EV car solution by economists & the car industry as well as other political parties i.e. as the next best thing that will keep the motor and consumer taxes rolling in. Any Green worth their name must surely abhor the waste associated with EVs and the idea of churning the market, rather than keeping perfectly good stock on the road.

    But they are allowing themselves to be associated with promoting EVs, so not entirely whiter than white or greener than green. Will come back to haunt them yet.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,551 ✭✭✭roosterman71


    Agree with this. Personal transport is not a green way of looking at things. Active travel and public transport is more their line. Makes sense. Plus doesn't Eamon Ryan have an old diesel himself and hasn't traded in for a shiny EV



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,395 ✭✭✭prunudo


    True, and to be fair I was referring to the overall green agenda, which probably has been highjacked by economists/vested interests too, rather than the GP themselves. Although I do find that as a party they are a group of people who don't really all share the same ideals which then gets confusing for the voters. I suspect there might be splitting of the party between the realists and diehards around or after the next election. All depends on whether Eamon Ryan contuines as leader imo.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    I did not say we were not compliant on gas storage. It would have been a bit farcical to do so due to the interesting and relevant fact that we do not have gas storage facilities. I said we are in non-compliance with E.U. legislation on energy security. If you believe that to be incorrect then take it up with Aoife MacEvilly chairperson of the CRU who has publicly stated the same, as have Eirgrid as far as I recall

    Why would I ask the Irish Green party about a proposal to buy LNG from Germany after they have returned it to its pre liquefied state and deliver it to Ireland via a pipeline through a state that is no longer part of the E.U Security of Supply agreement. A proposal that has now morphed into us using tanker ships to get our own purchased LNG too and from German LNG terminals that would require 600 times more the number of tankers to transport it to Ireland that would be reqired to transport it to Germany in its liquefied state ? That is not a proposal from the Irish Green Party, it`s your proposal.

    Where you have got the idea from that after another four winters the E.U. and U.K. will be so awash with LNG that they would be literally giving it away I have no idea.

    On Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland has its own gas pipeline which runs from Twynholm in Scotland to Islandmagee in Nothern Ireland. A few short years ago many would have said it was pure paranoia that Germany`s transition policy using Putin`s gas, (and by extension their encouragement of other E.U. state to do likewise) would leave them in their present energy supply mess. Or that U.K. nationalist jingoism, (similar to Russia and Putin), would result in them leaving the E.U. was anything other than pure paranoia. I imagine that in 2018 to even suggest that a U.K. M.P. would propose starving Ireland into submission on the Northern Ireland backstop would have been looked on as pure paranoia, yet it happened and that M.P. was promoted to Home Secretary of the U.K. the year after coming up with that idea.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,387 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78




  • Registered Users Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Are you suggesting that Aoife MacEvilly chirperson of the CRU is lying and that we are in compliance ?

    With you, like other Irish Green Party acolytes, being such a believer in running to the courts to ensure all E.U. green legislation is followed to the croosed t`s and dotted i`s and calling for the immediate imposition of daily fines for not doing so feeling it`s all fine and dandy to ignore legislation that doesn`t suit is somewhat hypocritical is it not ?

    Especially with you stating you would have no problem on informing on your own neighbours for any breach of such national green legislation.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,787 ✭✭✭antoinolachtnai




  • Registered Users Posts: 9,787 ✭✭✭antoinolachtnai


    So the worry that Britain would cut off our gas is what this is all based on? Would you not be worried that they would also blockade or just torpedo our LNG terminal?

    whwt you describe as my proposal is not my proposal and a lot of what you ascribe is as you well know not what I said at all. It is more of your oratorical clowning.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    It's enlightening that you show zero concern about non-compliance to emission related directives that Ireland is in trouble for yet you show a great deal of concern over a directive that the EU have not made any moves against Ireland for.

    Very enlightening indeed



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Do you also belive that Aoife MacEvilly chairperson of the CRU was lying to varoius Oirechtas Committees was lying when she stated that we were in non-compliance with E.U. legislation on energy security ?

    Personally I have no reason to believe she was, or Eirgrid, as far as I recall were, when they said the same. But If you do, then why not just phone the CRU office in Tallaght (1800 404 404) and tell them you believe she was lying. When you are on to them you could also question them on her telling the Oirechtas Committee on Environment and Climate Action 29th. March 2022 that Ireland must consider, without delay, putting in place LNG infrastructure to ensure energy security for the State.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Under your proposal that we would get LNG supplied by the U.K. reconstituted to its gaseous form and supplied through a pipeline that like nuclear generated electricity would magically alter it to the satisfaction of the Irish Green Party, then other than throwing a switch or just simply saying "Sorry we have none to spare at the moment" why would the U.K. declare war on us using blockades and torpedos ?

    It is your proposal that we get LNG supplied by Germany and the U.K. rather than putting in place our own infrastructure and purchasing our own LNG under the E.U. negotiated price. No point in you now getting sniffy with me for pointing out why it is not a valid proposal.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Nowhere near as enlightening imho as the fact that someone who is such a fan of legislative penalties being enforced. Especially someone even to the extent of informing on his own neighbours is happy to hypocritically ignore legislation that if enforced would result in very substantial daily fines until the legislation is complied with.

    Very hypocritical indeed.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,787 ✭✭✭antoinolachtnai


    Whether the UK torpedoed an Irish FSRU or cut off the gas pipelines it would have exactly the same result. US and EU sanctions on the UK would freeze the UK politically, economically and literally. There would be an election and the government would be thrown out.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    The U.K. is no longer a member of the E.U. and as such are not governed by the E.U. Security of Supply regulation on gas.

    There would be no onus on the U.K. or no basis for anyone to to sanction or freeze the U.K. poitically for simply saying when we come cap in hand looking for LNG, "Sorry mate, none to spare I`m afraid"



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,593 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande



    The Germans are now well & truly tied to coal for decades to come. They covered up the failure of the energiewende with natural gas to meet the shortfalls caused by unreliable generation and also power their industry. They have closed their reliable nuclear electricity generation and now have to import gas in the form of LNG, their direct Russian supplies are turned off, they are committed to LNG for the next two decades. For reliable baseload generation coal is their only domestic resource.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]




  • Registered Users Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Already answered, but like the poster I answered, if you believe she is lying then take it up with the CRU chairperson.

    When you do you can also tell her you do not agree with her assertion to the Oireachtas Committee on Environment and Climate Action that Ireland must consider without delay putting in place LNG infrastructure to ensure energy security for the state.

    Be sure and come back to me with how you got on.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Lol

    I'll keep you posted on the action the EU are taking in relation to the non-compliance on emissions as there doesn't appear to be any open actions in relation to energy security, unless you'd like to link it



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    So now are you not just attempting to squirm away from your implications that the Chairperson of the CRU was lying, you are also attempting to ignore that she also told an Oireachtas Committee on Environment and Climate Action over a year ago that Ireland must consider, without delay, putting in place LNG infrastructure to ensure energy security for the State.

    You know as well as I do that the E.U. would be perfectly within their rights to impose eye-watering daily fines for non-compliance in the morning. For someone that is such a supporter of legislation where it suits, (even to the extent of informing on his own neighbours), very poor and hypocritical posting form imo.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    From all you highlighted when you look at the data it does not make the situation any more rosey.

    For the first two quarter of 2022 Germany was still getting gas from Russia. Third quarter, electricity generation from coal-fired plants rose by 14% Source : Reuters.

    2022 additional emissions of 15.8 million tonnes of CO2 due to the "intensive use" of German coal burning plants. Source : Clean Energy Wire.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]




  • Registered Users Posts: 24,061 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    Well a red letter day of sorts.

    Mayor Khan of London has found out what his citizens think of his proposal to hollow out that great global City and kill a huge swathe of commerce.

    And in Germany, the federal government has decided to surrender itself to energy scarcity and its people to fuel poverty, while no one else in Europe is even dreaming about closing down nuclear until viable replacements are in place to be switched on.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    What's happening at the end of that graph there. Big uptick there

    Ah sure constant secure energy blows in the wind don't ya know.

    That's why its reflected in our relatively inexpensive bills😏



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