The Kerry Babies Case

The guards totally own the blaming of Joanne Hayes. This couple may be guilty of a number of crimes but that's not one of them.

The parents need to talk, their son was brutally murdered, staying quiet isn't acceptable.

It's sad seeing Baby John's grave, I wonder who takes care of it and if his parents have ever visited it?

Yeah what's this about.

They should have come out years ago with the truth.

They can easily say the deceased man only told them on his deathbed and at that point as Hayes had be cleared and apologised to, it was easier to say nothing. For that we are sorry and should have come forward.

Job done.

But who do they need to talk to and for who's benefit?

They don't need to talk to us to satisfy our curiosity.

A file has been sent to the DPP, if there is any talking to be done it will be done in court to answer any charges.

That's the only talking the couple are obliged to do.

This case reminds me of the missing postman, Larry Griffin, who went missing Christmas Eve 1929 while in a village pub with people he knew.

Whatever caused his death we don't know maybe he fell due to being drunk or was in a fight but everyone there, two Garda, school principal, publican and one or two others never spoke of it.

There was a search that lasted years, a collapsed murder trial, and endless media interest and yet a wall of silence.

The silence was such that an author who researched the matter believes that descendants of the conspirators know less about the case than readers of her book.

Here we have an infant baby, viciously stabbed to death, yet nobody speaks out. No comment 40 years later.

The parents still being together is extraordinary; infant death for "natural" ends a lot of relationships how a couple could survive the violent death of their child beggars belief.

How would a couple sit down and go about planning a family after something like happened baby John? How do you look at your other children, family photos and not break?

40 years later or not a Garda investigation is warranted, part of the criminal justice system has to be about saying to the victim "you matter, we will find out the truth and prosecute this case".

And gardai rarely are posted in the area they have grown up in.

If this story has any truth and becomes the main area of interest, it will be very embarrassing for the gardai

Maybe relationships werent soured though, families can have a dogged determination to protect a murderer within them especially if there is a dominant patriarch or matriarch at the head of the family. Like its likely the murderer was a blood relative, someone they know very well. To come forward essentially meant shipping a relative for murder with a potential 20 year prison term for the culprit. At the time of Johns birth this couple would have been children or teenagers themselves and were placed in a cover up situation. Once the die was cast the easier thing to do was stick with the family line and say nothing even as they grew into adulthood.

The other aspect is that it is a crime to have knowledge of a murder and not to come forward. Once they turned 18 they became criminally responsible themselves as adults. So theres an element there that given they didnt come forward they are continuing to commit a crime themselves. So their fate was then tied to the fate of the murderer hence they are incentivised to continue on the cover up to keep both themselves and a blood relative out of facing prison.

Dont get me wrong I think the whole case is abhorrent especially what the Hayes family were put through. But its not hard to see how a cover up in the family was set down early doors and once that was in place people who knew just doggedly continued to stick to the family line through thick and thin.

Yeah I can understand them staying quiet to keep the families reputation - it still doesnt make it right. I think within that family there would have to be very toxic soured relationships. Imagine having Christmas dinner with the person that murdered your baby? If relationships were not sour than this pair must be hard as nails.

No it wouldn't.

yeah its definitely not right but with blood being thicker than water you can see how it would have went down. Undoubtedly the mother of baby John harnesses animosity towards whoever took him away from her and killed him. But killing him was a crime justified to her to cover up the family shame and Catholic guilt of a baby born out of wedlock in an era when these things mattered. And then the murder itself is even more shame and guilt on the family. And because all their fates are tied together the cover up endured for decades, even to the point that they watched on as the Hayes family were threatened with murder charges. I wonder would they have stood silent while Joanne get convicted of murder. Id say its likely because at that point they were very much in for a penny and in for a pound.

To be fair I'd imagine there wasn't a garda in the country at the time who wasn't aware of the investigation if you mean the original one back in 1980s especially a garda from Kerry or stationed in Kerry.