Waterford GAA Thread - Mod note post #1

Nice handy one

This is basically it bottom line is maybe these players are not as good as they think they are . We have had a stronger 1/15 team out then for a generation but to be honest the best of the best Ken mcgrath , Tony Browne , Mullane were better then the best now back then we just didn’t have enough of them . We need to find these rare nuggets if we are ever again in our lifetimes break the curse of Waterford senior hurling .

How did it all go so wrong. It's not as if the squad had a rushed preparation.

Injuries to Tadgh and Irlaith Daly were setbacks but that happens to other counties too. Kiely picking up an injury early on didn't help the cause on Sunday. What's the story with Aussie .... doesn't look fit at all but still hard to leave out even at that.

I’d have to agree with that. Our decision making is awful and seems to be the result of over coaching and basically… heads being melted? Davy spoke on newstalk yesterday about being 4 months into the job and that’s fair enough but you can’t go backwards to hopefully go forwards at inter county level. Even on puck outs, when players actually made good runs, Billy hesitated as if it wasn’t the plan and then hit it too late. When Prunty was free and open, he didn’t play it to him and hit a long one straight to a cork lad. When Aussie had a sideline and didn’t want to go for the shot, there was no decent movement and he hit an aimless ball into the square and there was nobody even near it. The dead ball restarts tell you that they are a very confused bunch of players.

I’m scratching my head like many are. I think the players did try and Jack Prendergast in particular gave it all.

Let’s hope we get a great performance the next day. It’s sad to think that we’re hoping for optimism for next year but it feels like that’s what we are facing. Even though we’re not out yet. Let’s hope we win the next day and at least have a chance on paper. I’d like to be going into the Tipp game at least having a chance and have some bit of excitement on the day if we’re going well and keeping an eye on other score updates.

I wonder if he did unnecessary damage by staying on the field way too long. (After injury)

Maybe more than two aren't at the level. I'm only referring to two that in my mind clearly aren't. Most of the rest have won a league or underage medals though. I can't see where I made any excuses for any of them though.

As for your second point I couldn't disagree more even though you appear to be confusing over coaching with over training. If you listened to Jamie Barron's interview before the championship he detailed how much time is spent on video review etc. Things like walk throughs of scenarios like puck outs are perfect examples of coaching where no conditioning is being undertaken. We have over done all this. Watch when a ball comes into our defence and beats the first two players contesting it. Numerous times a Waterford player could have got to it first but he's so programmed he can't act on instinct and instead waits for his opponent to run. The very same happened with Wexford in Davy's last year.

As I presume everyone knows Austin injured his hamstring against Tipp and was back training briefly before getting injured again so he has very little done for the last 2 months. Who else isn't in shape? I can't see anyone who's body shape is wrong. But as I said previously I see a whole bunch of players stuck to the ground when a guy like Peter Hogan who missed the entire pre season because of Ballygunner and injury is moving well.

I wouldn't put much fault on Conor Gleeson (though he should have been sent off for a second yellow), Prunty or Mark Fitzgerald. All three were totally under the pump and when you have good Cork players looking up and able to put the ball in space to favour their men those three lads were on a hiding to nothing.

Though I feel Mark Fitzgerald would actually be better deployed at centre back. Calum Lyons is a fine player but he can't get forward as much from there. And I don't think Darragh Lyons is good enough as a half back or midfielder. I think he could do a job in the full back line though.

At the end of this campaign, I imagine a number of players (including the class of 2013/16) will be considering their futures. Some might feel it's not worth the grief and call it a day.

Will be travelling to Thurles with some trepidation. With a Waterford side depleted with injuries and low morale coming up against Clare on a high, it might be a long evening. Lohan won't be showing any mercy to Waterford / Davy. Will be away for the Tipperary match so might be spared further humiliation ; it will all depend on how many points Tipp have at that stage.

With Score difference a factor now, no team can afford to run out of the subs for a few minutes or to take the foot off the gas. For Clare, the last goal against Tipp in Ennis was huge in bringing the score difference down. If you have one thing going for you now, it's simply that Davy cannot afford to play a sweeper, he has to go toe to toe with Clare and go for it. No sweepers etc, unless he wants a respectable defeat.. that's not unknown to him though.

Over on the Clare forum they are on about needing to put up a big score on us because they are worried qualification could come down to score difference at the end of the day. They must be taking beating us as a foregone conclusion! Jesus are the rest of Munster now looking at us as the whipping boys. How the f### has it come to this?

Given what we witnessed last wk v cork a hammering is definitely on the cards……last year in Ennis was every bit as bad as last Sunday and given how they (Clare) played v limerick we could well be in for a torrid time😡

Head to head is just with 2 teams level. It goes to scoring difference with 3 teams or more. Like If they all had 4 points then they get ranked in scoring difference. Scores against Waterford are very relevant as it will put their difference down. It would be the total difference from all the matches played in the group.

The whole imbalance between the Leinster and Munster championship structures isn't spoke about enough too. It's a bit of sour grapes and we are not good enough to get out of munster at the moment anyway but we'd still more than likely coast through Leinster to the All-Ireland series every year if swapped with Wexford for example.

Interesting extract from article by Maurice Brosnan in today's Examiner:

"Our puckout win ratio for the last number of years hasn’t been good,” Davy Fitzgerald told WLR last February. “Well under 40%. We have to try and get more in that area.” Waterford have actually been closer to 50% than 40% over the past four years but it was clearly an area their new manager identified as needing attention and explains why he was keen to entice Stephen O'Keeffe back into the fold. 

It is also the most alarming stat from their disappointing showing against Cork on Sunday. The raw numbers are stark. Cork won 25 of their own 28 puckouts and scored 0-13 in total. They conceded 0-2. Waterford won 19 of 39 puckouts and scored 0-7. They also conceded 0-7.

 The difference in returns was greater than the difference in scores between the teams at the end. It’s not rocket science but it appears to be beyond Davy.

Excellent suggestion by Ropaire to replace the current National Hurling League with the provincial championships run off on a league basis. The provincial champions could play each other for the National Hurling League title. However, I would then have just two groups of five in the All-Ireland series, with the first, third and fifth from the Munster championship in one group along with the second and fourth from Leinster and the other way around in the other group.

Current format is less equitable than what was there previously. New format could end up killing the game for the weaker team in Munster with supporters tuning out over time. GAA should be trying to expand the game which the back door did. Current system contracts it!!