Cost of a United Ireland and the GFA

When they set it up, and before they left it, it was not involved in any murders, explosions or anything like that.

Why did you mention Oliver Gibson, who it seems was never in a para-military or terrorist group? It seems you are really scraping the bottom of the barrel to try to find a unionist politician involved in paramilitary activity, or indeed any murders, explosions etc.

I asked you "The difference is SF members were at least sometimes IRA members and vice versa?" Some would say hundreds if not thousands.

"And SF attends commemorations for PIRA, and condones same? Ever see a mainstream unionist politician condoning a Shankhill butcher or UVF man from the troubles?"

Define Paramilitary group. If a group is set up for peaceful protest only, and within the law, OK.

It certainly is very very wrong to be a member of one if it is involved in shooting, explosions etc.

The closed you can get is a DUP person fined (the price of a house by the government of the Rep of Ireland) for "unlawful assembly".

Huge difference between that and the activies of SF / IRA? The difference is SF members were at least sometimes IRA members and vice versa?" Some would say hundreds if not thousands?

Indeed the protest in Co. Monaghan (nobody was really hurt) was extremely peaceful compared to many of the activities SF / IRA got up to, it is fair to say.

The only rockets that were fired when Robinson was involved were those petrol bombs by Republicans to celebrate the court fining him the cost of a house for his relatively peaceful protest / unlawful assembly.

If you have evidence he "tried to obtain rocket launchers" you should report that to the psni.

So in other words, no evidence or proof apart from the word of someone you say was in the UDA? Hnnn.

Were the rocket launchers ever got or used?

For someone who was defining what ‘war’ meant, funny you can’t define what paramilitary means

”an unofficial force organized similarly to a military force.”

Militaries were invented for peaceful reasons now? Thats some crazy bending of reality going on

Why would you believe the word of somebody who had set up at least 2 paramilitary organisations?

You don't believe Adams and McGuinness about their involvement or not with paramilitaries, why would you believe Robinson and Paisley?

It is accepted by any historian commentator worth their salt that Paisley's rhetoric in the 70's and 80's resulted in bloodshed, and we can see that for ourselves. The man was more than capable of transferring that hate to paramilitary activity.

I like most people, including the BBC and any historian you care to mention, believe Paisley not only 'was in' but started and led two paramilitary organisations.

No, you should phrase this correctly - 'you do not want to believe'.

But the facts are there, he started 2 paramilitary organisations, was implicated in paying for the first bombs to be set off, and indulged in the most vile sectarian hate speech heard on these islands. Even if he never put a rifle to his shoulder, those things he most certainly did are enough to link him to paramilitaries.

I have no issue saying that some members of SF were heavily involved with paramilitaries, that is also fact.

You 'believe' away but it is quite clear your bias is at the core of your belief. And that's a very shaky core.

I was making a relevant comparison, but if you want a more recent one, both the Gardai and the PSNI believe that the PIRA Army Council still control Sinn Fein, well, according to their more recent statements on the matter.

Having a meeting with paramilitaries is a lot less serious than being controlled by them, wouldn't you agree?

You accuse others of whataboutery and you divert without answering the question:

"Having a meeting with paramilitaries is a lot less serious than being controlled by them, wouldn't you agree?"

One man's apt comparison is another man's whataboutery.

I am happy to condemn the DUP for meeting with paramilitaries as well as condemning Sinn Fein for being controlled by them. Unlike you and others on this site on both sides, I hold both the DUP and Sinn Fein in utter contempt. One is more relevant to me because it seeks my vote. Don't mistakenly consider my distaste for Sinn Fein as support for the DUP, and I won't stop pointing out relevant hypocrisies when I see them.

Unlike me? I challenge you to find a single positive post I've made about SF Blanch. I'm regularly highly critical of them as you well know, so you can drop that line of b*llocksology and all.

I welcome you pointing out relevant hypocrisies where you see them, I'm sick to death of you turning absolutely everything into a rant about SF no matter how irrelevant. You'd save yourself a whole lot of time if you set yourself a template that started all your posts with, 'Ah but what about when Sinn Fein'.

Just the same as the "New" IRA or "Real" IRA or Continuity IRA are different to the Provisional IRA ( remember the Republican group which was involved with a few bombs before the Brexit negotiations to warn about the dangers of a hard border - bomb found in Armagh Feb 2020, the bomb in Derry in Jan 19 I think it was etc ) , so loyalist groups are presumably different people etc to those other loyalists 40 years ago / can warn and huff and puff as well. They are all equally as bad as each other. One thing for sure, there will not be a peaceful united Ireland.

Maccored, I expected better from you. That is a slur against a law abiding citizen who happens to be from the Protestant community in N. Ireland and is working here in the Republic. You have no proof he is a loyalist. I have heard ordinary decent Protestants here in the Republic been verbally attacked before about being loyalists and paisleyites and what not, and people taunting them with Uh Ah up the RA and such like, it is not funny. And then you wonder why the Protestant population went from roughly 10% to 3% in the 20th century in Ireland.

Kielty is right, we are not ready for a UI. Have we really moved on much sometimes? Maybe in 100 years.

Talking of Patrick Kielty, he had a great joke and he did connect them.