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Enoch Burke turns up to school again despite sacking - read OP before posting

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  • Posts: 1,539 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Justice Owens mentioned the school would now be entitled to a permanent injunction.

    I'm just speculating here, but I wonder if the school applied for a permanent injuction, would it change anything. Maybe then the Gardai would have to remove him, if he turned up at the gates.

    I presume they can't move to have the injuction made permanent until the independant hearing on his appeal on his dismissal is heard and decided.



  • Registered Users Posts: 283 ✭✭GarfieldandPookyBear


    A few wayward sprinklers that reach across the road. A bin full of dog shite… whatever it took I’d be doing it 😂



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,347 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    And the pupils and staff and legitimate visitors getting sprayed as they go into or out of the school, and having to put up with a vile stink. Way worse than a sad individual just standing there.



  • Posts: 1,539 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Eventually he is going to have to earn some kind of living, once the pay from WHS stops. (If it hasn't stopped already). A 300km return trip to WHS every day, must be costing a fortune in diesel.

    Given the high profile nature of his behaviour, I don't believe he would be seen as meeting the efforts conditions on "available for and seeking work" by DSP if he tried to claim a jobseekers payment. Not unless he quits turning up at the school. Standing outside a school all day reading a book, would not meet DSP's requirements, which are quite detailed.

    I've said it before - I can see him setting up as self-employed, offering private tutoring, like Mammy did. He already has the youtube channels set up for this. He has a lot of content up online already aimed at LC German, which is free, now he'll probably start charging for it.

    I wonder also, can he apply to act as a JC/LC invigilator, (somewhere other than WHS) or mark JC and LC exam papers? .

    (eta) Okay, on second thought, not as an invigilator, which would involve contact with students, (bad idea) but marking papers? AFAIK, he is not in any dispute with DoE



  • Registered Users Posts: 283 ✭✭GarfieldandPookyBear


    Well I don’t mean 24/7! He turns up, turn them on and soak him. Turn them off. Let him stand there soaking wet. Obviously visitors, staff and children don’t hang around a school gate. Well not at my kids school anyway. Having said that, we wouldn’t be too enamoured with an ex teacher hanging around our kids school either. It’s very strange behaviour and shouldn’t be condoned.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 283 ✭✭GarfieldandPookyBear


    I’d say he’d make a decent online tutor to be fair 👍 I’d sign mine up for it for videos but not in person 😂



  • Registered Users Posts: 51,758 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Not going to work or even be tried.

    A law like that would also effect legitimate trikes and industrial disputes and would never be passed.



  • Posts: 1,539 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    That's the sad thing, I never doubted his ability as a teacher. Some of his videos are really very good.

    Such a pity he went and fcked it all up, as highly invested teachers are worth their weight in gold.



  • Posts: 1,539 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    They'll come up with something new.

    Enoch's defiance of the Courts and Judiciary has been too public for them to just ignore it.

    They came up with something to deal with Isaac Wunder.

    They'll come up with something to deal with Enoch Burke too.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,735 ✭✭✭Karppi


    Oops sorry, I’m in the uk and tomorrow is a holiday here. Apologies



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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,637 ✭✭✭✭OldGoat


    As Enoch keeps turning up at school I think the school are more likely to put on a Christian style response rather than an adversarial one. While they go through the legal steps required they will probably provide a lean-to shelter, a portaloo, perhaps even some water facility. Being antagonistic towards Enoch only plays into his martyrs mindset. Enoch, on the other hand will find it hard to be to maintain a positive public presence while being aggressive towards the Good Samaritans and those that turn the other cheek. Even his most ardent supporters (if there are any left) will find that a bitter pill.

    I'm older than Minecraft goats.



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,347 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    That's great thinking! They could put up sadly admonitory posters regretting that they cannot employ him but encouraging him to go and do something useful with his life, just so he doesn't forget why he is there, beyond stubbornness.

    They could of course gaslight him by moving the shelter an inch further away from the gates every day...



  • Posts: 1,539 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    👁️ Enoch Watch 👁️

    • Monday May 29 – Day 70 of EB protest outside Wilsons Hospital School post dismissal*
    • Monday May 29 – Fines x 123 Days @ €700 per day (27 Jan to 29 May inclusive) = €86,100
    • 🏳️‍🌈 ⚧️ Donations to "Enough, Enoch" GoFundMe in support of Irish LGBTQ+ charities = €11,245 ⚧️ 🏳️‍🌈 (no change)
    • Donations to "Enoch Burke" GoFundMe to assist Enoch Burke pay daily fines = €40 (no change)

     *School closures / Public Holidays / Court Dates are excluded.

    Dates to note:

    • Friday 2 June - Last Day of Term.

    With the end of the school year 2022/2023 fast approaching, it will be interesting to see if Enoch continues his protest during the State Exams.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    Actions like that might be considered assault.

    I've a query for those who know the school. Is standing outside of the gate actually standing on the school's property? Could standing outside of the property be considered to be standing in a public place?



  • Posts: 1,539 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I'm open to correction here, but I think earlier in the thread someone checked the property folio, and ownership extended out to the middle of the road.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,450 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    It's many many years since I was in Wilsons but I'd imagine that the gates of a school would be reasonably considered a "public place" given that lots of people would be stopping there to pick-up and drop off etc.

    However , context is important as they all have "legitimate business" there. Enoch Burke does not.

    He could argue that until his final appeals etc. are gone through that he has good reason to be there , but he's running out of road on all of those.

    By the time the school re-opens next September the context could be very different for him.

    He will no longer be on the pay-roll , he will likely have exhausted all his legal challenges and so on. So if he turns up and is asked to leave , a refusal to do so should hopefully have larger consequences for him than it does now.



  • Posts: 1,539 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    From landdirect.ie - It certainly looks like it does extend to the middle of the road.

    If he really wanted to, I suppose he could just stand on the opposite side of the road.



  • Registered Users Posts: 68,652 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    The property line to the middle of the road doesn't stop the road being a public place.



  • Posts: 1,539 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The property line does appear to cover the gate area where Enoch has been seen standing.

    He's already been arrested once for trespass for standing there, even if the DPP decided not to proceed with the charge.

    If WHS proceeds with an application for a permanent injuction against him, like Justice Owens said they were now entitled to, that may change.

    As an aside, this country needs proper "restraining orders", why don't we have those?



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,450 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    To be fair , he wasn't arrest for trespass for standing at the gate. That arrest came about from the one day that he actually entered the school building after he had been sacked.

    After his release from the Garda station that day he came back and stood at the gate again for the rest of the afternoon.



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  • Posts: 1,539 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Didn't he sneak in when someone opened the gates? He's like a defiant little child, proving his point.

    I honestly don't know what they can do to get him to stop lurking there. Do we have laws on loitering?

    (Personally, I don't care if he stands there and freezes himself blue every winter for the next 20 years).



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    I'm far from a supporter of Burke but I don't think anybody needs to have 'legitimate business' there to stand in a public place.

    Personally I think his actions are very foolish in the extreme (and I'm being very nice to him in describing his actions in that way).



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,602 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    Including outside a school? A grown man standing outside a school for hours every day with no legitimate business to do so is fine?



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,913 ✭✭✭✭Leg End Reject


    Folios will always show the boundary out to the middle of a public road, it's the same with privately owned homes.

    Maybe Enoch will take to standing in the middle of the road if the school manage to have him legally barred? 😂



  • Posts: 1,539 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I googled loitering in Ireland, and this came up:

    What is Section 13 of the Public Order Act?

    13. —(1) It shall be an offence for a person, without reasonable excuse, to trespass on any building or the curtilage thereof in such a manner as causes or is likely to cause fear in another person.

    What reasonable excuse does Enoch have to be there, now? (Reasonable to anyone other then the Burkes, that is).

    Or hopefully a handy ditch?



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,343 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    I’d be happy for my taxes to house him in mount joy indefinitely, I know the judge released him as a waste of resources and I’m sure there more worthy recipients of a cell but I’ve no issue with paying my share.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,484 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    Where are all the concerned parents that are hassling refugees? Surely a grown man hanging around a school is concerning them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 283 ✭✭GarfieldandPookyBear




  • Registered Users Posts: 51,758 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    You would think so but the Civil Liberties crowd will be watching on and ready to defend human rights and the right to protest. Apart from the trespass during the early stages of his protest and his contempt of court, which the court didn't do a lot about, there's not much else they can do about him except jail him for non-payment of fines after they have exhausted every other means.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    I'm not stating it's fine. I'm stating that it may not be illegal if he's standing in a public place. And if he's not doing anything illegal (and that's a big 'if') then there's very little the authorities can do about it.

    Kind of like how you mightn't like a 90 year old riding an 18 year old. You mightn't like it or think that it's right, but it's legal so there's sweet FA the authorities can do about it.


    Looking at that legislation, I suppose as long as he isn't trespassing then his reasonable excuse is that he's there to protest.

    To fall foul of that law firstly he'd need to be trespassing. We haven't established if standing outside of the gate is trespassing. It's possible it could be considered a public place so therefore it probably wouldn't be considered trespassing if that's the case. I just simply don't know if he is trespassing or not. I'd assume if he was trespassing by standing outside of the gate, the school would have instructed the Gardai to remove him before now but they have never done so.

    And secondly, I'd also argue that, while he is a plonker, he probably isn't actually causing or likely to cause fear in another person. T'wud be a sensitive soul that he would cause fear in while he's just standing there like a gobshyte wasting his time. I know he caused fear when he caused a commotion at the school function and possibly when he entered the school, and possibly at the disciplinary hearing (WHERE IS JOHN ROGERS), but what he's doing now isn't likely to cause fear in another person. That said, he might be causing fear in someone so I can't say for definite if he's causing or likely to cause fear in another person but it's not a given that he is.



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