Irish Property Market chat II - *read mod note post #1 before posting*

In Clare they found a closed hotel (there are many more) and holiday homes to house refugees. Kerry's most famous hoteliers are selling up so I'm not buying the BS narrative that air BnB is the saviour of the tourist industry.

We are in a situation where many workers can not find accomodation, yet many choose to leave accomodation empty. A serious country cannot allow that to continue.

Let's see how it plays out

Well considering that it's possible to not pay a mortgage for a decade and keep a house, it's only fair that renters enjoy the same access to fiscal irresponsibility....

2 completley unconnected events and easy to say when its not your own home.

If its your own asset, you face much less risk with AirBnB, due to govt legislation over LTRs.

Its largely the govts fault that people choose to AirBnB.

Derisk LTR and you will see more landlords move into that space.

The problem is that many landlords wont LTR under the current legislation.

The housing crisis is the govts making, it is not the fault of private homeowners.

Current vacant property tax has been nullified for approx 50% of those levied with it, so even increasing the rate wont make much difference if only 1 in 2 actually have to pay it.

I completely agree there are issues that need to be addressed for landlords. Most notably the inability to evict non-paying tenants. This should be treated as urgent as any tenant side measure - 100%.

But there should be a use it or lose it policy on second homes during a housing crisis. If not effective, vacant property tax rules need to be tweaked until they are effective. Having idle homes in a housing crisis is like having rotting food stores in a famine, it’s just completely socially unacceptable to most people and the government are feeling that pain in the polls.

People with multiple houses happy to leave them idle cause ‘ITS MY PROPERTY’ are so small in number they are largely irrelevant as a voting base. Any party that prioritises them over essentially an entire generation of people will get crucified and rightly so.

Such a shame FG/FF have taken so long to see the light - it’s led us to where we are staring down the barrel of an SF government. I used to ridicule people who voted SF - but whist I never would myself, I can now fully understand it when you see the sheer ineptitude of this gov on things like tackling the disease of STLs.

Yes, good points.

The eviction process is the number 1 issue to sort out.

The govt are very liberal and i would say centre left & dont seem to have an appetite to protect landlords here.

There is also next to zero chance of SF tightening landlord protections on this front, if they do get in.

I still think that if push comes to shove, most STL LLs still wont rent out their property for LTR under the current conditions, even with a more cutting VPT.

They will move someone from family in "officially", they will make the home uninhabitable and claim it needs work done, they will just pay the VPT, or they may even sell it.

If they do sell it, it is still unlikley to come onto the rental market.

So the core renter group are still left with little pickings, once the STL homes in their town have gone through the above filtrations.

I think the real answer lies in incentives, not punishment.

Sure, hit people with a high VPT, i agree with you.

But help them be a landlord at the same time. Make them want to choose LTR, rather than stacking the cards so that they do everything in their power to avoid it.

That old saying still rings true, where there's a will, there's a way.

LLs will find a way to do what they want to do with their own property.

So make LTR attractive to them.

On another note, I hope SF dont get in. I really dont see how they will increase housing output and am yet to see any valid counter argument.

Youy arent wrong when you say public acceptance is the issue.

Ultimately laws need to changed by politicians who are voted in by the public, namely:

• Residential Tenancies Act 2004 affords the protection of non-paying tenants
• Family Home Protection Act 1976 affords the protection on non-paying borrowers.

Dropping rates to near 0 (and less in some cases) was the "solution" to the 2008 financial crisis. Many argue, and I'm inclined to agree, that the fundamental causes of that collapse were never fully resolved. Rather, the states of the west printed money in the trillions to inflate economies back to growth. Indeed, how many of the ills of the West today can be traced to chasing the infinite growth genie? Inflation, mass immigration, declining services, soaring housing costs, etc....

I don't exactly know what is going to happen, but as things stand, a deflationary recession would not necessarily be a bad thing. The state was less dangerous when it was broke!

I think that that's what worked before, so it's not unreasonable that it will be tried once again. However, we really don't know what will happen.

I know a person with multiple houses.

2 are being used for airbnb, barely ever used.

One has no interest by airbnbers so has been relisted. It just sits there, has been going up in value for last decade, so why not.

People dont care about the Countries housing problems, they look after themselves. Its not something I would do as I have a lot of honor but I can see why.

Yes, very good.

The value of money erodes over time. There has been no period in history where the value of money has gone up.

Everything goes up over time...property, stocks, oil. But if you are buying something on credit, rates must be considered.

Shadow banking, Ireland has plenty of it.

Credit availability is a major factor - We havent seen the full effect of ECB interest rates rises yet as Irish Banks have been extermely slow in passing on higher ECB interest rates to borrowers. That is changing now and this will have a dampening effect on prices.