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Leinster Team Talk Thread (Love you Furlong time)

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    That could be a factor. He has had surgeries in the past.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    I'm all for Hb and giving him the minutes. I still believe that he can be a top end 10. I never mentioned anything about Harry being dropped. He is just 24! Plenty of games for him to get to his best. Prendergast is doing very well for a 20 year old. He is being managed well.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Guys, are a few of you seriously suggesting that Garry Ringrose, one of the very best centres and very best rugby players in the world, can't pass from left to right?!

    He wouldn't have made a Blackrock JCT if that were the case, or past Leinster U15 development screening, much less go on to have the career he's had.

    Everyone is entitled to their opinions yada yada yada but surely this isn't a serious argument?



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    There is a difference between claiming he can’t pass from left to right. Rather than suggesting it’s a weakness, that he factors in when choosing between passing a running. So no, no one is suggesting he can’t pass to his right, other than maybe you.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    So with the national training squad named, Leinster have a good crop of players to chose from at the start of the season. I thought that Milne and Molony would have been picked. Depending on the schedule, I think we'll have good chance.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,537 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    I want McCarthy to make the WC squad, but it would be deadly to have him at the start of the season. Give him a chance to earn a starting spot next to Ryan



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,553 ✭✭✭ersatz


    Some kids! I am not the first person to observe that about Ringrose's game and guaranteed it's something coaches note. For some people any critical observations about players they admire are unwarranted because the observer is not a pro rugby player. Why do you comment then, or do you only praise? Simple question, am wrong, is it not a habit of Ringrose's that's been commented on for years?



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,484 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    Sometimes things get repeated because they're observable consistently over time.

    Sometimes they get repeated just for the sake of repeating them and they become received wisdom rather than fact.

    You can usually tell which is which.



  • Registered Users Posts: 211 ✭✭conquestscarer


    Equally, if he goes to the world cup and plays himself into getting game time or a bench spot, I don't see how he doesn't get a shot at a starting spot for us next season.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Would McCarthy be vying for a spot over Baird? The thing is, is Baird seen as a blindside or lock? I see McCarthy as a grinder. A good powerful carrier. Baird is a different player and supremely athletic.

    For next season, I guess we need McCarthy to progress. Could he have made a difference v La Rochelle? I don't think it's too far away from one or the other of them getting more gametime than RM.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    If Baird is seen as a blindside, then the options are; Ruddock. Martin Malony, Soroka and Baird. Then there's Mangan! That's a stockpile of weapons!

    There's also the option of Deeggan and Doris playing at 6.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,537 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Cullen definitely fucked up by picking Jenkins ahead of McCarthy.



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,484 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    From what I can see, McCarthy is very much a TH lock if we're sticking to roles. This means he's vying with Jenkins and either as backup to Ryan (when he plays alongside Molony or Baird) or starting alongside him if we want full beef in the row. If Ryan is to have a long career I think he'll be missing chunks of the season - you either get timid Ryan for a lot of matches or beserker Ryan for half a season the way he plays.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Sometimes I think shoehorning players into different positions can be a bust. Take Lasisi, he's just moved over to tighthead and he had 1 appearance? this year. I think he'd be a good loosehead. We see this happening more and more. It must sap the confidence of the lads who are in the position that a lad has been moved to.



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,484 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    You need to be more patient I think, Dub. TH prop is possibly the most technically difficult position on the pitch and it generally takes players years to get to a competent level.

    Porter, when he switched over, was phenomenal, I thought, given his age. I'm still not convinced he should have moved back to LH.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,194 ✭✭✭Must love hardship


    While i get your point...

    If Porter had not moved back.. then irieland squads first choice LH Props for the WC would be Healy and Kilcoyne.. With furlong Porter and Beadlam at tight head.



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,484 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    That's probably the long and short of it. Maybe Milne or Dooley would have progressed more over the last two years but there's not much evidence that they would have.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    The allocation of players to positions isn't done lightly, I'd imagine. It's not just a case of looking at a guy and thinking the team would be better served with him playing elsewhere.

    For someone like Lasisi, I would imagine they take a holistic view of the situation and identify what is in the pipeline on both sides, where the potential bottlenecks are and where the potential gaps are.

    Lasisi was good at U20 level but he never looked as good as Boyle did (Boyle was involved a year young in the same squad as Lasisi before being a stand out player during a GS win the next year).

    Then they had Michael Milne coming through who was only 2 years older than Lasisi (various teams had tried Milne at tighthead also but Leinster wanted him at loosehead which was his original position given they had Clarkson at tighthead).

    Then they look at tighthead and see that they don't really have the same quality on the horizon with only Clarkson looking like a strong option coming through in the development line. They lost Salanoa, Sam Illo and Jack Aungier all in 12 months which essentially wiped out their pipeline at tighthead. Something had to be done there to try and develop another tighthead.

    In the case of Porter, it's far more a case of immediate need at the top level of the game. Healy was on the wane and we really don't have great options beyond Porter still. It's Healy in the 23 still at this point. Hopefully one or two of the options above come through to a test level in the next 3 years but I don't disagree with the Porter move.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Maybe, but Lasisi was very competent on the loosehead side. Could the move over cost him a career in rugby? If he doesn't get to the required level, his goose is cooked?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Not ideal. Lol. Imagine having a couple of oul fellas facing down the Boks. Ouch.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    I reckon Milne could be at the required level if he had not missed last season. I think Milne looks to be in a solid position for the future.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Nail on the head there! Boyle does look a great prospect and did look better than Lasisi although, we never know how things pan out down the road. Losing 3 tighthead props like we did has been a strain on the squad. It kind of forced Leinster's hand with Clarkson. I thought he was thrown in the deep end fairly early into his career. Granted there has been improved play from Clarkson. Fingers crossed for next year.

    I do hope Lasisi becomes a viable alternative. With McGuire not even getting started we look thin at tighthead depth.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    More concerningly on McGuire than the injury problems, I've heard from people in UCD rugby that they think while he has good size etc, they seriously question his grit / application, which are not ideal deficiencies in a tight head prop. I had heard similar things when he was coming through Blackrock, but thought he looked a good player at Ireland U20 level.

    He's a young player who equally needs time to develop within a pro system.

    I'm curious to see if Paddy McCarthy remains a tight head at the pro level. Beyond that then, I've heard good things (and seen bits of) some younger guys coming through at the position like Andrew Sparrow (St Mary's), Adam Deay (Tullow / Lansdowne) both at U19s and then Riain Coogan (Michaels) and Alex Mullan (Blackrock) at U18s level.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,599 ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    Possibly but trying to compete with Boyle could also cost him a career in rugby.


    Given that he made the conversion he might get an extra year at Leinster even if he doesn't look good enough at the end of academy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    If true on McGuire then that will probably be that. I hope it's not true.

    Paddy McCarthy could be good. He probably needs a few kilos packed on.



  • Registered Users Posts: 211 ✭✭conquestscarer


    Sparrow looks good, but has a thinner frame for a prop, Reckon he probably goes down the loosehead route as a pro but looks like he is properly physical folded people at both scrum time and open play. Alex Mullen looks seriously promising as a tighthead though, think he is about 6'4/5 and looks large enough to play the postion as a pro. He also has a great pair of hands for a fella that big. Can't comment on the club players because I Haven't seen enough of them but hopefully they have the heft to play tighthead.

    If none of Lasisi, Clarkson, McCarthy or McGuire don't come good as tightheads by 2025 I think we are in a serious panic mode at tighthead. Furlong looks like he will be a part time player for us from here on out and the younger lads will probably take 4 years of development at least and tighthead prop is the position that players typically take the longest to become solid at.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,605 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    If we hadn't lost the tighthead props we have lost, there would have been no need to sign Ala'Alatoa.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,544 ✭✭✭ulsteru20s


    Its tough to sign a guy like jenkins on pretty good money presumably and then not play him at all in those kinds of games.



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