Abortion - It's back on the Irish political agenda

Proof they prefer to go abroad? You've got numbers, surely. Most abortions are 'medical abortions' (mifeprisone based) not surgical abortions.

How many women are going abroad?

The 3 day wait was an Irish solution to an Irish problem. Nobody should have any control over another’s body - if Stephen Donnelly or Peader Tobin are so concerned for the unborn babies of Ireland, encourage men to use condoms. It’s insulting to women to think that they can’t decide for themselves what is best for them or their families.

I don't believe your anecdotes about 'women prefer to have their abortions overseas' is because of anything to do with the procedure. It has everything to do with the restrictions in Ireland (12 weeks) and, as you correctly point out, the incomplete implementation here 5 years on from the referendum. Hopefully the legislation being mooted comes into law soon, so the 3 day nonsense can be dropped, restrictions placed on 'conscientious objections' and (obviously) more investment in medical facilities to accomplish the procedure - as far as I remember only a few hospitals are up to speed, due to typical HSE foot-dragging and ineptitude.

Busted flush and Peadar Toibin is a clown with a party that can hold AGMs in a phonebox.

Thankfully you will not get a vote on this. We decided in 2018 to never have referendums on abortion again.

It might not happen in this review but sooner or later any woman who needs to have an abortion will be able to get one in Ireland, and that is a good thing.

because you know a woman's needs better than she does?

i presume you stopped reading at some stage?

I’d be grateful if you wouldn’t attempt to do my thinking for me, but I know that in reality you’re going to continue to do it anyway and then tell me I’m spouting BS on the basis of what you want to believe I’ve said.

I didn’t say anything about women swallowing a few pills or any of the rest of it. Read the post I was responding to, and why I pointed out that nobody talks about abortion for pretty much the same reasons. I don’t presume to know what women are thinking when I say they prefer to go abroad rather than deal with the Irish healthcare system. I know the Irish healthcare system is shìt, I know they’re taking enormous risks by going abroad, but I don’t ask questions, because I don’t want to know. They don’t owe me any explanation, I can see they’re in trouble and they need help, not a sermon. It’s not an ideal time to be ‘debating’ the minutiae of abortion or the morality or legalities of it or anything else.

You know my opinion on abortion, I don’t agree with it, I don’t support it, but I’m also capable of holding the belief that the current legislation was always flawed from the beginning, an imperfect compromise because some people have chosen to politicise the issues involved rather than deal with reality, and so we have the 12 weeks and 3 days nonsense by way of a compromise. To me that’s just teasing, I don’t need to be a woman to know that the gestation period in humans is about 40 weeks, and women in my experience at least, many of them weren’t even aware they’re pregnant before that time. Government knew what they were doing, and there were people who said “let’s just take what we can get, it’s a start”, and all the rest of it, but that to me was always the worst approach and ignored the reality of the situation - that the supports which are necessary, simply don’t exist. They won’t exist while people are still hell bent on addressing only the symptoms, while failing to address the underlying causes.

So we have a situation where people have to deal with what’s in front of them and moving pretty fast, and that’s not the best conditions for making rational decisions which would lead to an optimal outcome. It’s why GPs are unwilling to deal with patients who need their help, it’s why women will use google instead of going to their GPs, and why the medical profession are aware of their liability under current legislation if they’re prepared to risk helping patients in those circumstances - they make a wrong decision, and not only is it the end of their career, their reputation is in tatters, and the worst case scenario they end up doing time.

Basic stuff HD, doesn’t take a genius, just requires that you leave your own politics out of it, and if you can’t bring yourself to do that much, and you MUST bring your own politics into it, don’t fcuking project them onto other people in 4K. An idiot would be able to point you to numerous examples of people whose own actions do not correspond to their expressed opinions, none so more clearly or obviously contradictory than women who are religious who avail of abortion -

https://www.mtv.com/news/htq731/lifeway-christian-research-christians-have-most-abortions

That still comes as a surprise to some people. And yes, I know all too bloody well there are all sorts of reasons for it, and one could choose to lord it over another human being in unfortunate circumstances and kick them when they’re down, and probe them for answers and generally just humiliate them until they say fcuk it, and give in, or, that person could show a bit of empathy, understanding and respect for a person in unfortunate circumstances, and help them out. You continue to do you though, because that’s working out so well that you can spit stats at me like how 95% of abortions are nothing more than taking a couple of pills. I could be an arse and point out that the majority of abortions are actually spontaneous abortions, but I know what you meant, so I’m not going to be that obnoxious arsehole who cares more about themselves and their own beliefs than reality -

https://www.sciencealert.com/meta-analysis-finds-majority-of-human-pregnancies-end-in-miscarriage-biorxiv/amp

How many abortions did you think were happening before repeal?

Jesus christ, I can't believe we're back having to listen to this old chestnut.