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Sick of this country

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  • Registered Users Posts: 39,970 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    I don't think you're particularly interested in the topic anyway as you're here to score points and that seems sort of inappropriate one week after the death of the president of the ASTI, Miriam Duggan, who died aged just 63. May she rest in peace.

    Ah jaysus lad you just used the death of that poor woman to point score.

    Your assertion that teachers die 5 years after retirement is dubious at best.

    Absolutely no need to bring the unfortunate death of anyone into it.

    -------------------------------------------------

    I have great respect for teachers, they do a tough job and should be remunerated adequately on pay and conditions.

    But to be honest you are doing them no favours with quite farcical militant defence of them.

    The teachers I know can't stand the unions for the exact reasons.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,871 ✭✭✭Peter Flynt


    I most definitely did not. However I understand your interpretation and accept that could be taken as such and so will remove/edit.

    Unions are very important but less so in Ireland due to the close relationship between union leaders and politicians which generally doesn't happen in larger countries like the UK or France.

    The teaching unions have not been particularly strong in Ireland for other various reasons.

    It is true that younger people of the millennial generation generally are avoiding unions in all professions.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,138 ✭✭✭realitykeeper


    Let`s put it like this. FG took a bucket of crap and mixed it with the cariar. Separating the two is no easy task. I have sussested in the past reversing everything they did since 2008 but that involves resurrecting Anglo Irish Bank, selling Ireland to it, doing a demerger with Anglo getting it`s original debts back etc. Also going after defaulters for years of arrears and so on. FG made such a monumental mess of everything, that fairly blunt tactics are needed. What I know is it would be a mistake to take on a big mortgage to buy a house that has been deliberately inflated, while at the same time exposing yourself to the 200 billion euro debt, acquired to inflate house prices. This is why house prices must be deflated and the beneficiaries must be the ones to pay. I know what I am describing is a blunt instrument and micro surgery would be needed to separate the liable from the non liable.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,138 ✭✭✭realitykeeper


    The crisis of 2008 was avoidable in Ireland. It was the consequence of decisions FF made. But FG`s responce to that mess, makes it responsible for this mess.

    Yes, other countries made the same decisions FF did resulting in similar consequences there, but we don`t rule those countries. If we did, I would prescribe the same medicine for that enlarged Ireland.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,138 ✭✭✭realitykeeper


    Communism is borrowing 200 billion euro to protect defaulters, pay civil servants high salaries, bail out the banks etc etc all to inflate house prices and then handing the bill to people who were school children when the property mania was in full swing.

    Capitalism is hitting those responsible, ie owners of existing properties, with punitive taxes every month and automatically advertizing every house for sale on a government website from the very instant it`s tax has not been paid.

    Granted some are more to blame than others. Some have merely benefitted but were happy to stay silent as their property was deliberately inflated. Others got away with years of default because the government wanted to keep properties off the market so house prices would stay high. So yes, what I am suggesting is a blunt instrument but there is no reason the more culpable could not be singled out for special treatment.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 39,970 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    The bank bailout was roughly 60 billion.

    Half that is gone never to be recovered, we should recover the rest and probably a bit more.

     ie owners of existing properties, with punitive taxes every month and automatically advertizing every house for sale on a government website from the very instant it`s tax has not been paid.

    No people who bought a home at a certain time are not "culpable" nor should they have their houses taken off them by the government.

    For lots of reasons, but primarily because that is a fúcking mental idea.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,138 ✭✭✭realitykeeper


    House prices have been deliberately inflated. Had FG not inserted a false bottom in property prices by insuring a traunche of houses against negative equity when house prices were falling, they would have continued falling another 20%. Had FG not inflated house prices deliberately with borrowed money which they used to prop up banks and facilitate those in default (for more than a decade in some cases), had FG not used borrowed money to pay high salaries in oder to ensure government employees paid their mortgages, then your arguement might have some merit.

    Correcting the situation requires punitive monthly taxes on all existing properties and the sale of any which are not immediately compliant.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,151 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    @realitykeeper

    Communism is borrowing 200 billion euro to protect defaulters, pay civil servants high salaries, bail out the banks etc etc all to inflate house prices and then handing the bill to people who were school children when the property mania was in full swing.


    Capitalism is hitting those responsible, ie owners of existing properties, with punitive taxes every month and automatically advertizing every house for sale on a government website from the very instant it`s tax has not been paid.

    This is the most bizarre take on both Communism and Capitalism I think I've ever read anywhere in my life.

    hitting those responsible, ie owners of existing properties, with punitive taxes every month and automatically advertizing every house for sale on a government website from the very instant it`s tax has not been paid.

    The vast majority of people buy HOMES. They don't buy "property". What you're looking for is ridiculous in the extreme. Taxing the crap out of people because they bought a home to put a roof over their family's heads? What?

    Frankly, that just sounds the rantings of someone who's incredibly bitter.



  • Registered Users Posts: 39,970 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Hang on are you taking the píss?

    Your ranting and raving promoting delusion as fact which all sound like an extremely weird revenge fantasy.

    Resurrect Anglo, Punitive, Special Treatment, Stealing homes.

    Please tell me you are on the WUM?



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,446 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    He has been ranting and raving on this forum for the last 10 ish years. I. The middle of the downturn he wanted to do away with the minimum wage so we could compete with China.

    I just mostly ignore his ranting and raving.

    Post edited by Bass Reeves on

    Slava Ukrainii



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  • Registered Users Posts: 348 ✭✭iniscealtra


    @Peter Flynt Teachers in France teach less per week by four hours for a Full time contract. The day is longer because they have a two hour lunch break. They also do no supervision at breaks. Other people are hired for that. The school year at Second Level i believe is the same but the holidays are laid out differently.

    Primary schools in France teach 4 days with every Wednesday off for 144 days a year, significantly shorter than the Irish school year of 183 days,



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,138 ✭✭✭realitykeeper


    Well maybe Putin will hit us with that nuclear tidal wave and then the whole discussion will be academic.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,771 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    There are HSE pay scales. Foreign workers get paid the same in the HSE as Irish workers do. A foreign nurse isn't cheaper than an Irish nurse.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,771 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    Plus the cost of goods and services is much higher in Australia. And housing is more expensive in the likes of Sydney or Melbourne.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,771 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    Are you trying to say most teachers are doing well to live to be 70 years old? Not sure where you are getting your stats on that one. G'way outta dat.



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,968 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    Accept in Flannerys of a Thursday night eh? Whoop! Whoop!



  • Registered Users Posts: 91 ✭✭johannmall


    I could be flippant and say bon voyage but having lived in both aus & the us I can truly say this country despite its faults is by far a better place to raise a family , I paid 10k in the states to send my kid to a Catholic high-school , in fairness weather it was one or ten kids it was the same rate but my point is this country is such a good place to raise a family, sorry if you feel cheated !



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,771 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    It's incorrect to say there were no pay increases for the period 2008 - 2018. There were pay increases for some in 2016, most in 2017, and for all in 2018 and in every year since.

    I'm sure someone will be along to correct my figures below but that's based on a 15 minute search. I'm too tired to put any more effort into it.

    The Building Momentum pay agreement for 2023 gives all public sector workers (of which teachers are a cohort) a 7.5% pay increase for the period between Feb 22 and October 2023.

    In January 2016 all salaries up to €24k were increased by 2.5% and salaries between €24,001 to €31,000 were increased by 1%.

    On 1st April 2017 all salaries up to €65k were increased by 1%.

    In 2018 there was a pay agreement that gave 1% in January and another 1 % in October.

    In January 2019 all salaries up to €30k were increased by 1%. There was a September 2019 increase of 1.75%.

    In January 2020 all salaries up to €32k were increased by 0.5%. There was a 2% increase in October 2020.

    In October 2021 all salaries up by 1%.

    In February 2022 all salaries up by 1%.

    There might be more that I'm missing. But by my calculations that adds up to 16% for the period 2016 - 2023 inclusive, which is 8 years, which adds up to 2% per year average. And that's excluding the increases to people under €24k, €30k, €32k etc.




  • Registered Users Posts: 39,970 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Sorry did you think your ranting raving about stealing houses off people wasn't academic?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    Marno. A lot of this is true... but the housing crisis and crap wages, high tax rates if you are a high earner are factors... if you are a nurse or doctor, the system here is a farce... if you are a teacher, im imagining Ireland is a cushy as it gets , I've a mate who taught in England, now back in Ireland, Ireland is a doddle in comparison. Not having OFSTEAD on your back etc...


    I think as a young person, the nightlife here clubwise is very limited ...



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,386 ✭✭✭tinytobe


    I'd say the country is as good or bad as most others.

    It's working out for some, but it isn't working out for many others.

    Salary, cost of living, cost of housing, healthcare, are the usual subjects.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,138 ✭✭✭realitykeeper




  • Registered Users Posts: 11,431 ✭✭✭✭Frank Bullitt


    Just FYI, that is East Hastings, the poorest postal code in Canada. A very very grim place.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    This is a global issue. Its the young its not working out for... mental property costs where they want to live, in cities for the most part... let's take Ireland, public services and infrastructure are a farce, cost of living is mental , pay is low...



  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,386 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    I agree with the tax rates to an extent. There really needs to be a third tax band from 40k upto a certain figure of 30% for middle earners. People earning just north of 40k are getting crucified in this country. But there is a Government of two centre right parties and a "environmentalist" party, with several TDs who are basically PBP TDs running under a Green banner. It's very difficult to get tax measures like that passed when you need to bring those TDs on board with it.

    I often note that it's currently only possible to get a house if you earn less than c. 35k or you earn more than c. 75k. Because in the lower band there you can obtain social/AHB housing and on the higher band you can qualify for a reasonable mortgage. If you are in the middle band you are buggered and then you are paying 46% tax on that. But anytime it's raised all I hear is "tax cuts for the wealthy" so...

    But if you are concerned about housing costs, the places most of the "Irish young are fleeing to" are scandalous for rent too. Australia especially Sydney, Melbourne, Perth.

    I think the nightlife issue is very subjective, but then again if a person is emigrating for nightlife I'm not sure you can blame Fianna Fail and Fine Gael for it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,616 ✭✭✭maninasia


    They are huge compared to non EU countries and even compared to EU countries they are high.



  • Registered Users Posts: 171 ✭✭200mg


    Hap is a huge issue they should never have said what it's amount is and also pay directly to the person not the landlord. That would remove the minimum price. As you have no idea if the person is on welfare for example.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,616 ✭✭✭maninasia


    10k is cheap for a good private school in the states given the far higher salaries and lower taxes there.


    Getting kids into schools has become a nightmare for many parents in Ireland. You sound way out of touch. I applied to about 35 schools only one accepted off the bat. Also personally I dont want my kids in religious indoctrination schools but no choice in many cases.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,446 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves




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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,201 ✭✭✭carrollsno1


    I got an email from the union yesterday saying there is a pay rise on offer at the minute but its up to us to decide if its accepted or rejected. The other union putting in a claim for a raise to match someway with inflation has rejected it and is going to fight for more. On offer is a 3.5% increase this year as well as a 1.9% increase next year which is €26 and €15 net extra per week respectively. Every little helps and ill probably vote to accept it however it in no way matches the rate of inflation and would probably only half fill the tank these days too. It seems unless you do whatever overtimes available and get a job on site where travel allowances are paid tis fairly hard get ahead. I was on about 2/3 my current rate last year but was taking home about €200/week more due to overtime and site allowances i thought when i got the last payrise id be rolling in it but its far from it.

    Better living everyone



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