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Russia - threadbanned users in OP

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  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    They have mainly used manpads to take out the various Russian helicopters,the same helicopters are now flying lower and shooting missles from well outside manpad range ,now the Ukrainan are prone to being hit with anti tank weapons from 10 + kilometers away from the nearest Ukrainian with a manpad ,4 + Anti tank missles per helicopter could do a lot of damage to an armoured convoys



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,805 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    Russians still need LOS with their missiles (afaik) which look to be the same range as stingers, 8km vs 8km. Again it seems it's a single video of a single helicopter taking out a single tank and the sky has fallen in.

    That armor column didn't appear to have any AA at all, plenty of armchair generals and more experienced people have found fault with the tactics Ukraine used in that situation. That doesn't mean every single probing attack or the main counteroffensive will use the same tactics.



  • Registered Users Posts: 510 ✭✭✭AerLingus747


    expression of interest has gone to Finland to acquire some of their F-18's, what comes of it, who knows... but if direct acquisition isn't possible, if the Aussie F-18's were to be on the cards, I'm sure the Fin's would be involved with training and support at some level...

    Swiss and Spanish operate F-18's with support contracts from the US. The Swiss won't help c0z ThEy'Re NeUtRaL, but Spanish are a possibility, however, they have been ramping down F-18 ops.

    F-16 support would almost certain be a mix between Dutch and Danish AF direct support and Sabena Technics in Belgium who had the USAF F-16 support contract for Europe until recently



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,338 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Surely the US could assist with maintenance depots in Poland for the Jets. Could train Ukrainians while servicing the airframes.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,069 ✭✭✭✭Furze99


    Look who's getting uppety! We look forward to your definitive take on the progress of this war.

    Meanwhile the rest of us will suspend judgement on posted still images and videos, as we see fit.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,425 ✭✭✭Dubh Geannain


    I'm happy to admit I got it wrong having seen the video. There's always going to be a bias, especially if emotionally invested in one side and if one goes looking for issues with an image they can certainly find them, which I did. But yes it appears more legit now.

    We've seen this thread de-railed enough times by some not big enough to swallow their pride, when shown to be incorrect, as posters clamber for a climbdown that never comes. The petty insults then ensue. But I start from the same perspective as you; I don't expect people to admit when they're wrong either. The fact that they don't just shreds their credibility IMO so much so that I no longer give the same regard to what they post.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,652 ✭✭✭greenpilot


    I agree. Plus, the F-16 performed very well during the Baltics conflicts. While both types can be refuelled air- to-air, this option won't be available to Ukraine as they have neither the tankers nor the training to do so. You also need to think of the ground- support and maintenance training for any Western type. Russian aircraft are designed to be operated from rugged airfields with less than ideal support structures. Western aircraft definitely are not! ( which is why, for example, the engine intakes of a Mig-29 close off for take off to stop foreign object ingestion into the engines. It uses auxiliary intakes on the top of the cowlings for takeoff. It's not usual to see lines of ground crew walking down the runways of Western airfields looking for any objects on the surface that may cause issues with engines. This is a very rare occurrence in Russia. Ukranian ground crew would need extensive training to deal with the very,very sensitive systems of Western aircraft. While they have the usual redundancies of most aircraft, they would not be able to take the punishment, nor have the simplified systems of Russian aircraft.

    For example, I took an aerobatics course years ago ( when I was flying) in a Yak-52. A Soviet-era training aircraft. While most other aircraft had hydraulic systems for braking and undercarriage, the Yak used compressed air for flaps, undercarriage,braking and engine starting ( a 9 cylinder rotary engine). This enabled it to be operated in the harshest of cold weather, unlike the Western electrical and hydraulic systems. The undercarriage retracts only partially, to enable control during an engine-out landing.

    However, as safe as it was, I was always troubled by the need to wear a parachute for each flight!

    These aircraft are built without finesse and were often operated without finesse. Some of the Mi- family of helicopters operated by Ukraine are over 50 years old! If you look at the fixed undercarriage of an Mil-17, it's made from one single block of unfinished titanium. Purely functional without the over-engineerung of Western types. ( Russia is not short of titanium)

    While transitioning pilots from East to West may not be too bad, transitioning engineers and groundcrew is a whole other thing altogether.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,416 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    18 months seems to be on the very conservative side.

    It will more likely be 6-12 months. Certainly too late to be of use this year, but from 2024 on should be operational to some extent.



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    When it comes to armoured assaults there's not a lot of tactics available if you don't have air superiority, artillery cover and infantry support,

    Without any of the above your left traversing open ground trying to get an objective while getting targeted by helicopters, drones and artillery ,

    The options are limited



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    On the whole aircraft situation over the next week started yesterday Nato are carrying out a Large scale Air excercise (Air Defender) over Germany with 250 + aircraft and 10,000 personnel from the US and other Nato members taking part



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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,036 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    Bradleys and Leopards being destroyed is not the end of the world - these vehicles are designed to take heavy hits, because of the usecase many will inevitably be destroyed. Thats just the price that will be paid for territory.

    15% of bradleys is a lot, but US have recently committed to replace all those destroyed. Also, none of the strykers, marders or challengers have even been seen in the field yet so there is plenty more vehicles in reserve yet.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,890 ✭✭✭enricoh


    I'd be giving the kids the codes for the Swiss bank accounts also.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,841 ✭✭✭Polar101


    Finland aren't going to give any F-18's to Ukraine, that was just a comment by the outgoing prime minster who said it should be discussed when replacement F-35's arrive. Should Ukraine get F-18's from someone else, then I'm sure Finland would help with training and logistics, but the actual planes will have to come from somewhere else.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,460 ✭✭✭Markcheese


    Its the crew are the big thing , if the crew survived and are recovered,then they can go again .. not that anyone is suggesting that there havent been casualties and fatalities, the vehicles can be replaced

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    But have they ?

    One tweet said it , nothing announced today that I saw that said the US government was replacing every damaged Bradley and Stryker vehicles



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,968 ✭✭✭Big Ears


    No, I'd say in the next 15 mins or so they'll probably completely abandon support for Ukraine and join ranks with the Russians !



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling




  • Registered Users Posts: 287 ✭✭dennis72


    Unfortunately time is not on Ukrainian side Russia just needs to hold until winter

    The west has been to slow f16 maybe apaches definitely a presents in the black sea b4 the offensive

    Russia has threatened the western support enough to get over the line imo

    That is enough to erode a sovereign state to submission and obliteration.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,257 ✭✭✭Virgil°


    This is not getting better for Russia in any way shape or form. The destroyed/ already replaced Bradleys confirm this to me. The USA has thousands of these things and that's just the ones in storage. Same goes for the brigade of Abrams tanks which haven't arrived yet. Nor the F16s.

    Once the logistical train is set up that's pretty much the end of it. War is a test of logistics and Russia now faces off against the undisputed heavyweight champion of military logistics. For moving heavy armor around the landbridge Russia relies almost entirely on two rail lines(Which are currently cut) from Crimea. All of which is targetable by storm shadow and the soon to be introduced thousands of GLSDB rockets. Meanwhile Russia has yet to intercept a single train of supply from Poland. Not one.

    Holding until Winter does nothing. Russia's literal only hope is that all of the west gets bored. Through their own stupidity/lack of ability they continue to target civilians and infastructure(the Nova Khakovka Dam). So that's not likely to happen any time soon. They're dead in the water and I suspect they know it.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,805 ✭✭✭Wolf359f




  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,325 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    I really don't see why the idea that the Ukrainians may have lost a number of mine-clearance vehicles in a failed attack is that controversial. I'm not an AI/Photo-editing wizard, but the only odd things about the image are the use of an MRAP, which may have been just to plus-up the numbers, and the location of the recovery vehicle, which may well have just veered left under power after being damaged before rolling to a halt.

    So an attack was repulsed. It happens. Russians have historically been quite dogged in defense, and on occasion, they will get things right. There's a common phrase in the US military: No matter how well you plan things, the enemy gets a vote.

    The video shows a couple of Leos off yonder in the distance. Not impossible that night fell, and the Ukrainians managed to get one or two back.




  • Registered Users Posts: 600 ✭✭✭mike_cork




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,257 ✭✭✭Virgil°


    One thing that jumped out from a comment posted on this. I wonder what the 300 mil is actually going to? A quick google shows that a Bradley IFV comes in at somewhere between 1-2 mil a pop. Even if it was double that ... where is all the extra money going? Either there's something Im not understanding about how the cost of sending stuff is valued. Or there's an ungodly amount of ammunition/equipment or HIMARS missiles hidden in that package or something.(maybe ATACMS? since they cost so much).

    Would love to have that explained.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,163 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    Wouldn't these be useful in Ukraine? Fast once the front is breached. Or maybe they don't have spare crew.




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,639 ✭✭✭victor8600


    Time is very much on the Ukrainian side. The war has already been lost by Russia. The war was never about just grabbing the south of Ukraine, it was about quickly taking over the whole country and putting Russia back on the international stage as a major player. And now Russia is just China's diseased lapdog, it is still barking, but its teeth are falling out.

    Hopefully, Ukraine's current offensive kicks Russian troops out for good. Though it may be too much to hope for this year. But even if the war drags on into 2024, a lot of things may happen to Russia -- death of Putin, internal fighting, etc, while Ukrainian resolve will stay strong.



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Weasle is an interesting idea based on WW2 tanketts ,

    Oddly enough they can be equiped with several TOW Anti tank weapons and some smaller short range air defense systems,

    There's a few hundred around



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,460 ✭✭✭Markcheese


    I'm surprised they haven't gotten a few at least , mightn't be great for an assault down south , but anywhere they can hide behind cover ..

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • Registered Users Posts: 510 ✭✭✭AerLingus747


    terrible news... @Gatling you were right again... time to call off the war



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Dutch intelligence tipped the Americans that Ukraine was planning to blow up the Nord Stream pipeline. The CIA supposedly warned Ukraine not to do it.



This discussion has been closed.
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