General Irish politics discussion thread

The PDs brought change to this country, they achieved some of their goals.

The likes of PBP and Solidarity have achieved none of their goals. There is no legacy of PBP. Ditto SF, nothing achieved.

If you put survival above achieving change, then you are correct.

This is just taunting from a position of arrogance. As I said earlier, when you are too long in power arrogance is endemic.

Anyone who rejects the idea of opposition in democratic politics or who claims that it 'achieves nothing' is not a democrat.

I can look at what FG and FF did in their terms as opposition and give credence to their existence.

The SSM referendum came about as a result of Labour being part of a coalition government, and working with their allies on the socially liberal wing within FG (Shatter being prominent amongst them).

You've given an example that directly contradicts the point you thought you were making

It was the massive vote in favour (approx 80%) at the Constitutional Convention that changed the lead party's mind IMO, they rejected Labour's call for a referendum initially, treating them as I said most if not all smaller parties have.

They simply couldn't ignore it anymore after that convention. Labour certainly and to their credit, held FG's feet to the fire, but that does not mean that a 'coalition' party was solely responsible.

Even though they deserve credit, what happened Labour at the next election is more proof of my point. They lost 30 seats in 2016, another one in 2020 and now have 6 seats.

Surprise surprise as many FG TDs and others are a bit pissed off that those conspiring against Varadkar last week were overwhelming in their praise and hypocrisy at a parliamentary party meeting on Wednesday. The following day, yesterday, FG received their worst ever poll result from an IT/Ipsos Poll, leaving them at 18%. LV's own personal rating fell by 6%. I have to say that's peak Fine Gael - not the sharpest tools in the box.

For the first time though it makes me think that a possible leadership election within FG could happen this year. Another bad poll would probably bring it about so watch out for announcements in public investment from LV out of sheer desperation in due course (as the same poll describes the public's desire for increased public investment in health and education ahead of tax cuts and just behind house building).

We are a year away from effectively what will be 6 months of campaigning and electioneering. The 2024 European Elections and Council Elections are 11 months away with the General Election around 6 months after that. Too many people in FG are nervous now about either losing their seats or not getting elected at all. Some have seen the wood from the trees and announced they're going anyway.

For LV the writing is probably on the wall. He's been an appalling leader.

Considering the apology by the Gardai to Pat Carey, will Fionnan Sheehan do the same?

Exception that proves the rule maybe?

I agree with you, nobody gets into politics to be in opposition. But that is the derisory insult I responded to. Many people don’t get into it to sell out either.

There is honest benefitial work that can be done in opposition too.

This smacks of patronising.

The voter is well able to know the difference in my opinion.

There is compromising and then there is selling out the basic principles that saw you exist in the first place.

President coming under fire for his comments on NATO.

The government need to spell out to the baying hounds that there is nothing unconstitutional about what the President did. There is no bar on what a President can say or give an opinion on unless he is addressing the Dáil, or making a formal Address to the Nation. Constitutionally he needs permission from the government on those occaisions.

Don't think a President can make comments that contradict Govn't policy.

NATO and our interaction with it is up for discussion. I think though the thinking is, a wide selection of people as possible contribute, not to be led by the President. BTW I probably wouldn't be in favour of joining NATO but I do see some defence type obligations with the EU.

Shedquarter not headquarters if I remember correctly.

Criticise away, he is perfectly correct to give his view.

Protocol is only protocol until somebody is brave enough to break it.