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Union Jack flying south of the border

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  • Registered Users Posts: 33,363 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    No, again, that would be mob rule.

    Democracy - negotiating with people.

    Mob rule - democracy without negotiation.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • Registered Users Posts: 164 ✭✭Irish History


    No disrespect but you are not thinking clearly - not understanding the reality of the flag situation. Ireland does not claim to own part of Britain - but Britain does claim to own part of Ireland.

    When Britain flies its flag in Ireland, it is a foreign flag of occupation - the same goes for the foreign monarchs flag with the Irish peoples historical symbol of Ireland, the harp - which is why England uses it - to claim ownership. Crown over harp.

    It's an illegal claim in the first instance and should be unacceptable to all right minded Irish people.



  • Registered Users Posts: 164 ✭✭Irish History


    Duh - don't Unionists in the north already have an artificial veto on democracy in Ireland?

    That veto remains within the GFA - they can vote to retain that veto if they want.

    Whereas Irish people in south and north are being denied real democracy and self-determination in our own country because of that artificial veto - and are not allowed to end foreign British rule in our country because of the Unionists undemocratic veto on democracy in Ireland.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,202 ✭✭✭pgj2015


    I dont know. if I moved to the shankill in Belfast, I definitely wouldn't be raising an Irish tricolour over my house, same if I moved to England.


    Will anyone be able to fly a Russian flag in Ukraine in 100 years time or will that flag be burned down? its the same with a British flag flying down south here, its done to provoke.



  • Registered Users Posts: 164 ✭✭Irish History


    Get real - majority rule is hardly mob rule.

    Ever hear of "elections" and "referendums" - that's democracy.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,658 ✭✭✭suvigirl


    There are plenty of tricolours being flown in the UK, why would you think that's a problem?



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,435 ✭✭✭boardise


    I'm surprised at a person of your obvious intellectual stature making a statement like that. As you must surely know ,there's nothing God-given about counties -they're simply arbitrary administrative arrangements and could vary in number at any point in time were circumstances to require it.

    The number of 'provinces' has changed many times through history. The RC church varies numbers of parishes and dioceses etc. etc.. No need to have a fetish about numbers of any humanly devised boundary decisions..i.t's a silly form of absolutism.

    Some of your other posts would suggest you spend much of your time looking through the wrong end of the telescope ...but hey . we all have our little foibles eh?



  • Registered Users Posts: 34,837 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe


    I am surprised such a staunchly Irish man as yourself would continually refer to The Republic of Ireland as 'The South'. It's a very British way of referring to our country.

    Not sure about you, but I live in 'The East'.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,202 ✭✭✭pgj2015


    I wouldn't do it. Dont see the point in doing so.



  • Registered Users Posts: 164 ✭✭Irish History


    I live in "Western" Ireland myself.

    And in fact and in reality, the 'Southern Ireland' State is obviously not Ireland - it is merely in Ireland. Although it is a republic.

    And the 26 county 'Southern Ireland' State as frankensteined by our historical and hereditary enemy England, is not my country. Ireland is my country.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,658 ✭✭✭suvigirl


    Don't see the pint of flying any flags? That's fair enough. Don't see the point of flying a tricolour in particular?



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,202 ✭✭✭pgj2015


    Any flags in other Countries, unless at a sporting event etc maybe an Irish flag outside an Irish pub abroad to show its an Irish pub.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,658 ✭✭✭suvigirl


    Ha ha ha ha ha

    No flags anywhere other then Irish flags outside Irish pubs. 🤣🤣🤣



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,435 ✭✭✭boardise


    I don't recall that particular point . I thought she set out to 'break the hunger strikes' and 'break the unions' ...but the entire Irish people ? How would she even have set about this absurd project ?

    Anyway 'break' is a weasel word which should be sparingly used especially by public figures . Alternatives like 'defeat' or 'overcome' don't raise hackles as much.

    As an aside , I wish everyone would tone down their rhetoric a little so that the merits of an argument can be more clearly seen rather than have people spitting venom at each other and trying to get in the smartest riposte or impugn each other's motives.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,202 ✭✭✭pgj2015


    😂 Exactly. same if there was an American bar in Germany or British pub in Poland etc

    I dont get why anyone would fly a national flag outside their house, its a bit low class.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,658 ✭✭✭suvigirl


    Many countries it is normal to fly flags outside your house or business.

    It's only weird here because the IRA kidnapped the tricolour and made it a bad thing to do.

    I've lived in countries where it is perfectly normal



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,363 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    You need to re-read the post. I never defined "majority rule" - I merely gave you two interpretations of it: democracy (majority rule with negotiation) and and mob rule (majority rule without negotiation, i.e "breaking them")

    Now definiely leaving you here as I have proven factually that: 1) you are either incapable of reading posts or choose to deliberately misinterpret them (at which point debate is obviously futile); and and 2) your argument of "breaking" someone who does not agree without negotiation has proven you don't actually know how democracy works (proven by responce above).

    So you can continuue said advocation of violence and flawed political knowledge and ad homeinem some other poster.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,363 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    Well, she tried to break some specific Irish, but I see your point. if you want something recent though, you could argue Bloody Sunday and various pretty much the entire era of the troubles. They British army was there to break up what they saw as a terrorist organisation and sometimes people who even looked like it and thus to break spirits and rule by force.

    Not spitting any venom, here - just pointing out that what Irish History is advocating here is pretty much civil war. Whether he doesn't realise this or realsies but doesn't care, I'm not sure.I'm guessing the later. Perhaps a better question for a referendum in Northern Ireland would be, "Do you want to go back to the era of the Troubles?" and see what the majority decide.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,177 ✭✭✭✭ILoveYourVibes


    Well I could be naive but is it possible its a family or person who is from the UK?



  • Registered Users Posts: 309 ✭✭Astartes


    My Neighbour who is from England put up that Union Jack bunting and had a few flegs flying for the Coronation. They invited all the neighbours and we had a lovely time. I wore my commemorative 1920 Tipp jersey



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,435 ✭✭✭boardise


    Just to clarify ...I wasn't suggesting that you were 'spitting venom'. I know from your previous posts that this is emphatically not your style. I prefaced the remark with 'As an aside' to try to make this clear but I know ,however, that it is almost impossible in a written forum to achieve the proper level of nuance or prevent misapprehensions or unwanted implications arising.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,070 ✭✭✭coolbeans


    Really? At least I don't copy my very questionable history lessons from politics.ie. Seriously old chap, that's pathetic.

    My grandfather always said beware the zealot and reading comments from you and young richie81 serve only to entrench that lesson. As I said, you're myopic.

    Post edited by coolbeans on


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,443 ✭✭✭sondagefaux


    So what? Ireland's a democratic state with constitutional and legal rights to freedom of expression. Grow up.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,317 ✭✭✭gameoverdude


    I'll be honest...I don't care unless provocation. Sure most Ukraine flags are hung out by irish people.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,138 ✭✭✭realitykeeper


    I can see how the shared island "investments" could be seen as a potential controversy. My guess is this is Anti-united-Ireland politicians black-guarding. Obviously the Republic is under no obligation to fund any part of the UK while the part in question remains in the UK.

    My guess is an agreement exists whereby the Irish government is repaying a loan they accepted from the UK back around 2008 or 2009. If I recall correctly that loan was for about 2 billion. They are dressing up these loan repayments as funding various projects in northern Ireland.

    If there was a united Ireland, it would be no different to any other part of Ireland. The same can be said of the status quo. Northern Ireland is technically no different from any other part of the UK when it comes to funding. All of the UK runs on deficit spending ie funny money from the BOE. The ECB can be just as funny when Ireland runs a deficit.

    I would welcome a united Ireland and I tend to see through any shenanigans the real Brits and west Brits throw up to obscure the truth



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,168 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    Sawa fella walking around with a Union Jack Tee shirt recently. Wondered was it a fashion thing or was he being political?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,665 ✭✭✭ittakestwo


    So are we not allowed freedom of expression here. It is a flag. British is their national identity. If they're proud of it fine. In 2023 people need not be provacted by the flag.


    Btw the union jack is compromised of the English flag the Scotish flag and an all Ireland flag superimposed on to each other. The flag representing Ireland when we were in the union was St Patricks cross which is a white background with a red X shape cross. The flag was never changed even after the south left the union. And the flag is really now the offical flag of NI. The red hand of Ulster on white background used sometimes to represent NI at football matchs has no official status.


    Although irish unionists adopted the st patricks cross as thier national flag nationalists went with the tri colour despite both nationalists and irish unionists accepting St. Patrick as thier national patron saint hence why the 17th march is a national holiday in both the north and south.


    Irish unionists did not just live in north. There was alot in the south too at the time of partition that wanted all of Ireland to stay in the union and presumably would have the union jack as their national flag.


    Saying oh you live in this jurisdiction which now has this official flag so therefore that has to be your national identity is gutter ideology. Live and let live. Also if there is a UI there will be alot of union jacks in it. Go through east belfast and it is literally hung from every lampost. That want change even in a UI.



  • Registered Users Posts: 374 ✭✭dublincc2


    To add an update to this, I was recently in the same area (Oram/Mullyash) east of Castleblayney on the Monaghan sign of the border around the time of the 12th July and saw more union jacks and Ulster loyalist flags flying on lampposts, this is from 5km within the republic onwards. More as you cross into Armagh. What is going on in this particular area?



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,376 ✭✭✭corner of hells




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  • Registered Users Posts: 374 ✭✭dublincc2


    Yet this area is the only place on this side of the border I have ever seen loyalist flags permanently flying.



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