Ladies footballers and camogie will play 'under protest' over lack of progress on welfare

The big thing here is financial.

Nobody would argue in principal with female players having better conditions, facilities, etc. However, the sticking point is that the GPA claims that if the LFGA and Camogie Association can't afford to pay any more, then the GAA should make up the balance.

It's a microcosm of why full and and true integration is still a long long way away, and indeed, why it might never happen.

The eejits can't even fix matches that don't clash with the other code- integration will be a disaster

Unfortunately for some its better to be king of a ruin than actually achieve something positive. The only thing that will bring equality at all levels is integration.

At local club level, in some areas, the situation is chronic. Local hurling club basically told the camogie club to go jump when all they wanted was a chance at pitch access more than one evening a week. Sure its our pitch was the attitude even though it was the entire community that built it. Camogie were left with a situation that all training from u6 up to senior has to be completed in a single evening. They might be able to schedule a match on a Sunday morning, if they are lucky.

The football club in the same catchment area shows what integration could achieve. They fully implemented the one club guidelines, and while not perfect - getting experienced coaches involved with the girls is a challenge, access is equal and looking from the outside both sides look to be treated equally by the club. This is a voluntary guideline only though and uptake among clubs is hit and miss.

With regard to your local hurling club/camogie club situation:

• how many pitches does the hurling club actually have?
• how many squads/age groups of their own do they have to accommodate on those pitches?
• Is it the case that the pitches are all filled with hurling squads every evening apart from the designated camogie evening? Or are they actually leaving a pitch vacant on one or more evenings, rather than letting the camogie club use it?
• Might it be the case that there are other times available to the camogie club, but they won't take them, because "they don't suit"? For example, would be unusual if every pitch were filled with hurling training every Saturday and Sunday afternoon and evening. But maybe the camogie club simply doesn't want to train on Saturday evenings because "the girls want to go out", or on Sunday afternoons because "people have other things to do"?
• Has the camogie club ever made or even offered to make a contribution to the annual running & maintenance cost of the grounds, or do they expect to be able to come and go as they like for free?

Which leads on to this common argument of "the whole community put it there", which holds no water with me. Sure, "camogie people" may have contributed to fundraisers to provide or maintain facilities. But they're the only ones with the expectation that buying a few tickets should then automatically entitle them to use those facilities. Am sure members of the local soccer club and Old Folks Club and whatever other clubs are in the area would also buy tickets, but they don't automatically expect to be able to use the pitches and clubhouse for their own activities as often as they want to.

For the record, my own club accommodates both camogie and LGFA, with never any real hassle. There's not an evening goes by where there's not girls or women in action on at least one of our pitches, with the lads using other ones. And the camogie and LGFA make annual contributions of approx. 5% of the annual maintenance costs. It means the GAA club still picks up 90% of the tab, but at least the women's organisations are recognising that there's a cost to having the facilities in the first place.

But we're lucky enough to have three pitches, so we can do all that. If we had only two, there'd be far less availability for camogie and LGFA, and they'd have to be far more flexible.

Ladies football and camogie obviously generates less money to go around for expenses etc. If the money is just not there then it becomes a very difficult situation.

Hard to ask the GAA to make up the balance if they are a different organisation.

I suppose if they had the benefit of being imalgimated, the GAA would need to start pumping as much into Marketing as possible for them. Money that the LGFA/Camogie Associations just don't have.

Who is the president of the Camogie Association?

should she resign?

Yeah, I got that part.

But the beginning of the article is all about access to pitches, physios and all the other supports that they might need/use. The opening line in the OP even says "players can't afford to train"...........WTF is a 'charter' going to do to change that? How will they be able to afford to train after integration, except with more money being thrown at them? Whose money will that be?

And how is integration going to change any of it, except via funding from other bodies? I mean, if they could afford all that sh1t now, then they'd just pay for it? But they can't, so they're joining up with the GAA and using their funds to pay for it all.

That is a valid opinion to have if you also believe the the men's teams should also not get expenses, training gear, access to physios etc.

They are asking for the three organisations to engage with them on how things are going to be improved in the longer term, not for money today. They just feel that to wait for integration to make a plan would be too long. The three organisations have already voted to integrate, so in the long term the ladies teams will be "their own camogie and football teams". So either the GAA decide in the long term that they want elite men's and ladies gaelic sports, in which case the pot will need to be spread a little thinner, or not, and lose girls to other sports, and probably lose government funding also. This is what integration means and its what the organisation voted for.

It also cannot be ignored that the reason the GAA has so more more revenue than the other organisations is because its the legacy organisation.

The women's sports weren't valued as much because the offering was so poor for so long.

There wasn't much to go around in terms of sponsorship or funding, because nobody wanted to sponsor it or fund it. And all because they were outside the GAA (which was their own choice, as far as I can recall....they deliberately chose to be separate entities and organisations to the GAA, did they not?)

Now that re-integration is on the cards, they're seeking assurances that they'll get a larger slice of the (considerably) larger pot than they've been getting so far. And threatening 'industrial' action, if you can even call it that, if they don't get their way.

Why weren't they playing hardball before now with their own lot?

Why wait until joining the GAA family became a likelihood before opening your hand mouth?

Why are they moaning about the financial aspect of it all if, as you say, they're not seeking funding from other sources?

Answer: They are 100% seeking funding from other sources. The behemoth that is the GAA.

Saying "that resource should benefit everyone, not just the men" is all fine and dandy, but there were no women's teams to share it with because they wanted to go full Beyonce-independent-woman with their own 'self-sufficient" organisations. "We don't need no men, until we see the euro signs being flashed in their direction, so now we want in, as equals, and we want an equal share of your our money".

Honestly, it makes the LGFA and the Camogie heads look like gold-diggers. Because, as anyone with an ounce of objectivity can see, the reality is all that money was generated by the men. If the women's games were self-sufficient and able to generate their own funding, they wouldn't be looking to join in with the boys in the first place.

Lets cut funding to the Mayo hurlers and Waterford footballers so. They don't bring in revenue either. And handball. No revenue there either

Yeah, cos that's exactly what I said, of course. No strawman here. You're also ignoring the fact that the Waterford footballers got less than a quarter of the hurlers about three years ago, but that kinda deflates your argument, so no surprise there. The Mayo hurlers get about half the footballers, also, in case you were wondering.

Anyway, that funding was generated by their respective county boards, the teams themselves and HQ/the GAA.

Spending YOUR OWN money on your own teams, especially on those that are under-performing, is the hallmark of a financially astute organisation. However, generating all that money and then having the new guys trying to hold you over a barrel unless they get a slice.....or else.......would rankle with anybody. They're not even in the door and they're making demands.

What would happen to "elite" women's GAA sport in this country if the GAA told the other two organisations to piss off, sort your own finances out? It would be dead in 4 years or less, is what.

They need the GAA.

Or, to put it another way, they need the GAA's money to bankroll them because they want to be able to operate at a loss, and need to be subsidised by the men's game, as much as that may hurt..

Which is all okay, by the way. I think it's a good thing, and integration is long overdue. But the only reason it is happening is because of the relatively recent success of the two ladies' codes and, at this moment in time, their ambitions are bigger than their bank accounts. To pretend otherwise is the act of an ostrich.

You're doing yourself absolutely no favours in your arguments with either me or other posters here.

Where did I state or even suggest that I'm opposed to better conditions and supports for inter-county LGFA and camogie????? It would actually be a marvellous thing to see happen.

What I do have grave reservations about, and yes, what I'm absolutely opposed to, is the expectation and belief that in order to get these improvements, all they have to do is ask often enough and loud enough and strong enough until eventually the GAA gives them the money required, and that the GAA should be doing that because, well, just because.

The pressure should instead be on the Camogie Association and LFGA at both national and county levels to develop additional revenue streams and use that income for the benefit of their players.

And by the way, that other poster above makes a good point. Why do Offaly, or Wexford, or any number of other counties field two adult camogie teams (e.g. senior and intermediate/junior) rather than just one? Doing so instantly doubles the costs. And by the same token, fielding just one team would instantly double the amount that could be spent on individual players by way of things like expenses, gear, meals, etc.