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Tension over future of Rosslare-Waterford rail route

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,712 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...greenways are a fantastic addition to our infrastructure, and people know this, hence the shares and likes, but its somewhat understandable why concerns are expressed over costs of major projects such as rail, as we ve conditioned ourselves to think such must be financed via general taxation, this is actually very much untrue, we have to start embracing major public borrowing for such projects, as the benefits far out way the risks of taking on such debts...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,712 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ah shur, thats the gig, wealth extraction, its relative easy money.....



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,434 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    More often than not, it's a stretch to call a greenway 'infrastructure'. They are leisure facilities.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,066 ✭✭✭purplepanda


    We already have the New Ross to Waterford Greenway opening soon built on the old rail link, that same line used to continue across the Barrow river after New Ross & onwards to Macmine Junction on the current Enniscorthy - Wexford line & onwards.

    The line above was called the North Wexford line & also used to connect to Bangnalstown & beyond, it was closed in 1963. This line is proposed for conversion to a Greenway which would also connect New Ross - Waterford to Wexford town & Enniscorthy.

    The Greenway lobbyists & their dodgy politician friends are not happy with reusing closed railways from 60 years ago, they want recently closed railways for Greenways as well, the costs of these Greenways are certainly not inexpensive so they would rather use a recently closed railway & save the older closed lines for later lucrative projects.

    The Wexford - Rosslare -Waterford & beyond railway should be reopened with proper regular rail services, the population has increased in Wexford County from when this railway was closed from 100K to 165K & will continue to rise in future, the same applies for Waterford City & East Waterford County. Proper pubic transport for the future is needed in the South East region, destroying the current railway for a Greenway when there are already other better route options which will not destroy public transport infrastructure available is short sighted.

    Support the Wexford Greenway & reopen the Rosslare to Waterford railway!

    https://www.facebook.com/WexfordGreenways

    https://www.facebook.com/search/top/?q=waterford%20to%20rosslare%20railway%20line



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,190 ✭✭✭fuzzy dunlop


    This reminds of the arthouse cinema in Galway that was funded to the tune of 10 million by the state while cardiac services were underfunded. When you asked them why it was justified the answer was inevitably, "Sure it'll be great for Galway".

    Same thing here. No proper analysis only "everyone around here wants it".

    Father Ted stuff.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,712 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,604 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    Probably a few use the greenways to cycle to work. It should encouraged but it is not the same as a train. Train is a much higher level of infrastructure. I love to compare the cost of reopening the train lines to opening a new road.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,253 ✭✭✭jackofalltrades


    And this Greenway proposal from New Ross to Wexford via Macmine Junction has the support of all the landowners who have assumed the alignment into their fields?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,066 ✭✭✭purplepanda


    All the details of the Wexford Greenway are covered in their proposals on the website.

    https://www.wexfordgreenway.info/?fbclid=IwAR2JurZU9Klt9IU6atJ7k0UOr-8r3hywHp-qQIycYGG8mBko_DaSPm-ogVU



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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,036 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    Any reason they don't actually say who is involved? Just weird, the website looks like a loner with no actual backing threw it up (not saying thats what happened but that's what it looks like)



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,036 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    Also I went along the rosslare strand line over the weekend, the sleepers are crumbling underfoot after about 1km outside Rosslare Strand. I imagine that the cost of getting it up to working order again would be a good few pound and alot of the stations are a good bit behind usable. Hopefully they maintain a few lines of double track at certain stations to allow continuous back and forth. One of the great weaknesses of the current Rosslare Dublin line is the lack of trains on a regular basis. If you don't get the first one at 6am, there is nothing for another 1.75hours



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,712 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...be far cheaper to upgrade an existing line than trying to create a new one!



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,036 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    100%, I am just saying that in the grand scheme of things, it won't be as cheap as simply reopening it, there are huge deficits along the line. All of the farm crossings need upgrading, signal boxes almost the entire length need to be replaced, sleepers for the majority of it and so on. Basically, the idea that Irish Rail had kept it in near operational condition is misleading. Apparently they are required to by the NTA but that isn't obvious to a lay person like me.

    I am wholly in favour of it reopening. A service every hour from 7am to 10am in both directions and from 4pm to 8pm, maybe later on a Friday and Saturday. Increase the speed limit on the Rosslare end to bring it under an hour. There are several cross over points but Wellington Bridge would seem a sound one, two trains could probably handle it back and forth swapping over there. This idea of one service each way at odd times though will kill it stone dead, hopefully that won't happen again. It's the main issue with the 370, by the time you drive out to it, most people realise its easier with no cost difference to just drive the rest of the way.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,218 ✭✭✭Junior


    Tender gone out today for section of the Greenway https://irl.eu-supply.com/ctm/Supplier/PublicPurchase/237108/1/0



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,227 ✭✭✭JMcL


    That's presumably related to the Waterford-New Ross section, no?

    I'd never really thought about the route before, but from just looking at the map and what I know of cycling the backroads between Ferrybank and Glenmore there're some seriously lumpy bits. Though that said is is a former railway line, so I'd presume they made it as flat/gradual as they could back in the day



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,778 ✭✭✭✭JPA


    Delete.

    Post edited by JPA on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,604 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,712 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    selfish, how so?

    ...but we do need to start reopening and in fact expand our rail network, and rather urgently to...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,604 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    because a greenway prevents a rail link which is more more important.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 805 ✭✭✭CreadanLady


    Do people not realise that this line was open and did have a rosslare to Limerick route, latterly Limerick junction to waterford, and connecting trains.

    NO-ONE used it. The notion of the connection to Rosslare port being a vital strategic link is bullsh!t - Rosslare port is mostly ro-ro traffic and foot passenger traffic is minimal. This has been the case since cheap flights became a thing over the last 20 years or so. You have people advocating for facilitating a type of travel that simply no longer exists at that port.

    I remember being on that train once or twice and it was only myself, a disinterested IE ticket checker and probably a similarly jaded IE driver on the train. No-one else.

    The MFV Creadan Lady is a mussel dredger from Dunmore East.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 805 ✭✭✭CreadanLady


    Anyone coming from the UK to limerick would just fly to Shannon. This thing of hoards of people coming from the west of ireland to catch the boat to England is out of the 1950. Very very few people cross the water by boat any more. And when they do, they are bringing a car or camper on a ro-ro ferry.

    The MFV Creadan Lady is a mussel dredger from Dunmore East.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,712 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...this is actually highly subjective, and in the interest of fairness, but are in fact equally important, both are critically needed pieces of infrastructure, for our overall wellbeing and existence, we need to expand both, and at the same time....



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,123 ✭✭✭Glaceon


    Where I was coming from with my comment is that treating this as a standalone line would never work, but having it as part of a larger line could work. If you tried to run Killarney to Tralee that way it would almost certainly close.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,712 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...it looks like we maybe coming to an end of the era of cheap energy, for obvious reasons, which means we could be coming an end in cheap transport options such as cheap flights, we clearly need to move back to rail, but to more advanced methods of fast rail, roads are becoming very congested, and if we keep pressuring oil based industries, which is more than likely whats gonna happen, alternatives such as rail are gonna have to be a part of the solution, which of course can be electrified....



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,604 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    No I really dont agree. You could build a cycle track on any bend lane. You cant build a railway anywhere. Railways have to be long. Cycleways dont. There are massive constraints to straightness.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,712 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...again, i do somewhat agree here, we probably do have to put a halt in converting pre-existing lines to greenways, and consider building greenways from scratch, as the overall costs of building lines compared to greenways, from scratch, far exceeds the latter, and we urgently need to start reopen lines, and expand our network, in order to meet our current, and future demands....



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 805 ✭✭✭CreadanLady


    Yeah. They're called busses. And they can go anywhere they like, not confined to rails that only skirt along the outskirts of places.

    The MFV Creadan Lady is a mussel dredger from Dunmore East.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,712 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ..increases in busses will also be needed, but so to will light rail, similar to the luas....



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,724 ✭✭✭Beta Ray Bill


    The issue part of wider problem with rail infra in Ireland (Or the lack there of)

    The port itself is situated on the side of a hill, which is very strange, expansion is near impossible.

    The track in and out of the port is single line (Useless for a busy freight port)

    The Gas thing is, there is serious amounts of money to be made off freight services on rail, even RO RO ports can benefit hugely from rail freight with these kinds of cars:

    It's a total no brainer. But like everything else in Ireland, it will never get done.



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