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Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings and threadbans - updated 11/5/24*

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    #8162
    suvigirl
    Registered Users Posts: 7,538 ✭✭✭suvigirl


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120787162#Comment_120787162

    'I stated that not all migrants move for economic reasons and to think so would be stupid, as there are a myriad of reasons as to why people emigrate.'

    economic migrant

    NOUN

    economic migrant (noun) · economic migrants (plural noun)

    1. a person who travels from one country or area to another in order to improve their standard of living

    Most migrants move to improve their standard of living.

    ______________________________________________________________________

    Improving one's living standards is not always tied to money, are you unable to comprehend that not all people's lives revolve around money!

    I never mentioned money

    _____________________________________________________________________

    There are neighborhoods in those countries where emergency personnel do not enter on a general basis and when necessary to do so it is under armed guard. 

    different to what you stated in your last post, where you said law-enforcement don't enter certain areas. They enter every area. I do agree that some emergency personnel need police with them when they enter certain areas. Ballyfermot, Neilstown, Loughlinstown are just a few areas I'm aware of that DFB personnel have been attacked by locals.

    _________________________________________________________________________

    it also true that some neighborhoods are operating unto their own laws and have their own courts.

    All neighbourhoods in all countries are subject to that country's laws, there are no exceptions.

    https://fullfact.org/law/uks-sharia-courts/

    sharia councils have no standing in law. Neither do Jewish councils.



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    #8163
    JP Liz V1
    Registered Users Posts: 86,105 ✭✭✭✭JP Liz V1


    From Newstalk

    More than 180 asylum seekers who arrived in Ireland last year failed to show up for their first official interview and never entered the refugee system.

    Figures released under the Freedom of Information Act revealed in 41 of these instances the applicant provided a reasonable cause and the interview was rescheduled.

    Last year, 13,651 people arrived in Ireland seeking refuge - a 186% increase on 2019, the most recent comparable pre-pandemic year.

    https://forumofgames.com/




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    #8164
    paxreseuropa
    Registered Users Posts: 97 ✭✭paxreseuropa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120787415#Comment_120787415

    This is without a doubt the main issue. What a farce that someone is trusted to voluntarily leave a country they have travelled thousands of miles to in undoubtedly awful conditions. It makes a complete mockery of the system and illegal economic migrants will continue to come to Ireland in their droves until the system is overhauled.

    Over 75% of the population are in agreement on this and it will only rise the more they let in and down the line when the effects of this disastrous policy are fully seen a sharp rise in nationalism, hate speech and racial attacks will also be seen. The current government and opposition policies on this matter are abhorrent, they could all care less and are too busy pandering to the 'politically correct and sensitive souls brigade' to the detriment of the majority of society.



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    #8165
    suvigirl
    Registered Users Posts: 7,538 ✭✭✭suvigirl


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120787915#Comment_120787915

    Perhaps you didn't read the definition of economic migrant?

    You stated that law enforcement don't go into certain areas, that it a complete fabrication, they go into all areas, you then stated emergency personnel don't go without protection. If you can show me exactly where refugees are the cause of that, I'll appreciate it. Even the fact that it happens here in ireland, involving Irish people, is enough to show it is not refugees that cause this issue.

    you're equating sharia councils with murderers? Yes they exist, what is wrong with them exactly?

    Jewish councils also exist.

    Canon law also exists.



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    #8166
    suvigirl
    Registered Users Posts: 7,538 ✭✭✭suvigirl


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120787941#Comment_120787941
    https://europeanconservative.com/about/

    It publishes articles, essays, interviews, and reviews that illuminate the different varieties of conservative, traditionalist, reactionary, and right-wing thought from across Europe and around the world.

    'We welcome unsolicited manuscripts and submissions.'


    So, you prefer to take one random persons opinion on the internet, over another random persons opinion, on the internet. Not surprisingly you will take the one published from right wing thought, as that what suits your own views on the subject.

    Doesn't make it fact however.



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    #8167
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,062 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120787162#Comment_120787162

    So put them all in a prison basically because they are not from - sounds remarkably familiar

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #8168
    paxreseuropa
    Registered Users Posts: 97 ✭✭paxreseuropa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788037#Comment_120788037

    Oh dear! I am not disputing the definition of economic migrant; I'm disputing your idea that people only move for economic reasons, how can you not comprehend such simplicities.

    I said at times they don't go into areas but when they do it is generally under armed guard; but there are cases whereby emergency personnel won't respond to minor incidents in certain areas due to the level of violence that they receive. It happens in Sweden and Germany in particular, this information is widely available online go look for it yourself, I'm not your personal research assistant. Just because something happens in Ireland in a particular way does not mean it is true of every other country on Earth, do you normally generalize swathes of people and nations with this black/white rationality?

    It was an example but sure why not, it is a well-known fact that Sharia Law enacted as it is in certain countries and areas of other countries punishes particular perceived crimes with death.

    Everything is wrong with them!! Religion holds no place in society, if people want to worship in private (including having places of worship) then they are free to do so and should not be prohibited from doing so unless it is harmful, which is exactly what religious councils are, they are harmful and exist to usurp the laws of the land.

    Canon law holds no place in the legal system of this country so it is irrelevant here. And justifying one religious councils existence through the existence of former existence of another and/or their "laws" is not a good case, if anything it only further shows how absurd the idea of religious councils and laws are.



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    #8169
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,062 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788112#Comment_120788112


    Immigrants aren't the reason you can't see a doctor.

    Immigrants are the reason you CAN see a doctor.


    FB_IMG_1688140238014.jpg


    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #8170
    suvigirl
    Registered Users Posts: 7,538 ✭✭✭suvigirl


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788172#Comment_120788172

    I never suggested people move for economic reasons. You and other posters talk about economic migrants like there is something wrong with being one. I have pointed out the definition. I said most migrants move to improve their standard of living.

    I will not go Google something myself, if you are asserting something as fact then you back it up. As pointed out, such incidents occur in lots of countries, in different areas, by different people, so we cannot blame one particular group.

    Sharia law in other countries, where it is the actual law, is most different from having sharia councils in countries that have other legal systems. No religious council usurps the law and they have no legal standing.



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    #8171
    paxreseuropa
    Registered Users Posts: 97 ✭✭paxreseuropa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788227#Comment_120788227

    Not only did you suggest but you explicitly stated that the only reason people emigrate is for economic reasons. There is absolutely nothing at all wrong with being economic migration as long as it was done through the legal channels. Where the problem lies and you are very much aware (stop playing stupid) is with the illegal migrants who are moving to Ireland for economic regions but they are claiming asylum and refugee status as they know they would not be able to satisfy the legal requirements to move here otherwise. Moving to improve ones standard of living can be done through means other than economic.

    Of course you won't because you don't care to do the research! You'd much rather laze about and call anyone and everyone who disagrees with alt-right, racist, and xenophobic. If these issues are popping up in several European nations and it is the same cohort of individuals causing the issues I think is perfectly fine and factual to assign these incidents to the group that are carrying them out.

    You simply don't understand. Just because Sharia Law is not the law of the land in the UK or other jurisdictions does not mean that people in those areas don't operate under Sharia Law. It has literally been reported on numerous occasions that these types of courts are being run by Sharia Councils in the UK and elsewhere and they are meeting out justice to individuals for perceived violations of said laws. I said they exist with the aim to usurp the law, this has even been stated by individuals from these communities; they are literally telling people this is what they are doing and they are facing zero recriminations for it due to the political classes not wanting to upset the 'alt-left' brigades precious feelings.



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    #8172
    JP Liz V1
    Registered Users Posts: 86,105 ✭✭✭✭JP Liz V1


    https://apnews.com/article/eu-poland-hungary-migration-refugees-relocation-cf75417b7a9490c3a41216478200c9e0

    More countries needed to make even a dent for change

    https://forumofgames.com/




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    #8173
    suvigirl
    Registered Users Posts: 7,538 ✭✭✭suvigirl


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788293#Comment_120788293

    'Of course you won't because you don't care to do the research! You'd much rather laze about and call anyone and everyone who disagrees with alt-right, racist, and xenophobic.'

    You made the claim you back it up. And point out where I called anyone those names? You're the only poster I see calling others names.


    If these issues are popping up in several European nations and it is the same cohort of individuals causing the issues I think is perfectly fine and factual to assign these incidents to the group that are carrying them out.

    I have already pointed out individuals in Ireland causing these issues, so it is obviously not the same 'cohort '


    You simply don't understand. Just because Sharia Law is not the law of the land in the UK or other jurisdictions does not mean that people in those areas don't operate under Sharia Law. 

    I absolutely do understand, the law of the land is the rule of law, it doesn't matter if people in sharia councils try to operate sharia law, they are still subject to the same laws as everyone else. Muslims are not the only community that tried to have their own laws.



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    #8174
    paxreseuropa
    Registered Users Posts: 97 ✭✭paxreseuropa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788377#Comment_120788377

    Its backed up through one simple Google search, as I said I'm not your personal research assistant and I'm not running around gathering information for you which is easily accessible and sure no doubt you probably are already aware of but choose to ignore as it doesn't fit your agenda. What names have I called you, please elaborate?

    There is an extremely small group of youths causing trouble in disadvantaged areas primarily in Dublin but also in other cities to a lesser extent. What you are failing to comprehend is there are also groups of individuals from particular regions who are claiming asylum and refugee status that are causing havoc across several European nations and the UK; so yes they in particular are of the same cohort! And the trouble that the separate groups of 'Irish youths' and 'Refugees' are causing are not the same, so you cannot simply band them all into one category. In addition, just because one particular group might cause trouble in country does not mean you can't speak out on another group causing more serious issues both domestically and internationally.

    You may understand that but you clearly cannot understand that not all people understand that or wish to obey by it and they do enact their own religious councils which in cases act as courts and live by their own law, which in this case is Sharia Law. You're literally saying its okay that Muslims are doing this because others have tried and failed before them; what way do you think? Honestly its beyond baffling, your justification is troubling.



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    #8175
    suvigirl
    Registered Users Posts: 7,538 ✭✭✭suvigirl


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788419#Comment_120788419

    I'm not your personal research assistant and I'm not running around gathering information for you which is easily accessible

    if you can't be bothered to back up your statements, don't expect anyone to take them seriously.


    just because one particular group might cause trouble in country does not mean you can't speak out on another group 

    well obviously. You cannot blame one group for certain incidents when it has been proven many groups cause those particular incidents.

    What you don't seem to understand is that absolutely everybody can be a criminal. Everyone. You seem to believe that only certain 'cohorts' of society cause issues.


    You may understand that but you clearly cannot understand that not all people understand that

    I got through this waffle and once more, and I am aware I am repeating this for you. It doesn't matter if some people wish to live under sharia law, they are subjected to the rule of law of the country they live in.



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    #8176
    Jizique
    Registered Users Posts: 1,887 ✭✭✭Jizique


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788654#Comment_120788654

    That's a great point, most (over 95%) voters support being on the EU and freedom of movement which that entails, which has been hugely beneficial, plus also obviously any American coming to work for a multinational (which still involves getting a visa through the regular route) but the issue is with the unwillingness to ensure EU citizens who do not have a job but are claiming social and housing benefit are not sent home (as they can be) and the other economic migrants from outside the EU is destroying the country, all for the benefit of landlords as i really cant think of anyone else who benefits.



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    #8177
    Jizique
    Registered Users Posts: 1,887 ✭✭✭Jizique


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788817#Comment_120788817

    Never said that - try moving to any EU country with a strong economy (Germany perhaps) and think you can claim dole, housing, medical etc while perhaps doing a few nixers and you will get short shrift - under EU rules you must be able to provide for yourself and not be a burden on the state, they should be implemented as it would be a benefit to society



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    #8178
    grumpyperson
    Registered Users Posts: 426 ✭✭grumpyperson


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788300#Comment_120788300

    I know two people that missed out narrowly on medicine

    https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://healthmanager.ie/2023/06/disproportionate-number-of-irish-medical-school-graduates-do-not-become-consultants-in-ireland-government-report/%23:~:text%3DThe%2520research%2520highlights%2520that%2520in,%252DEU%2520students%2520(46%2525).&ved=2ahUKEwjc4eO0zOv_AhVWUUEAHchdDEwQFnoECAwQBQ&usg=AOvVaw2czzOwgYevHJ7k_t9cDU6E

    The research highlights that in the 2021/22 academic year, there were 1,403 medical student places available in the Irish Higher Education System. This is the highest medical graduate output per capita amongst OECD countries However a very large proportion of those students are Non-EU students (46%)

    Our system is set up to prevent Irish citizens becoming doctors. If you're wealthy and from abroad....

    This is a major problem with our educational system that rarely gets talked about. Much cheaper to pump out history graduates that don't need cadavers to train on. The blame rests entirely on the people of Ireland that allow the madness in the education system to persist.

    This topic alone deserves a separate thread.

    Post edited by grumpyperson on


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    #8179
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 76,131 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    paxreseuropa threadbanned



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    #8180
    thegame983
    Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭thegame983


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120789123#Comment_120789123

    That isn't what I said.



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    #8181
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 76,131 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    Yet another reminder

    This thread is about Ireland's refugee policy. It is not about immigration in general



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    #8182
    paxreseuropa
    Registered Users Posts: 97 ✭✭paxreseuropa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788599#Comment_120788599

    Mod

    Warned for ignoring thread ban.



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    #8183
    suvigirl
    Registered Users Posts: 7,538 ✭✭✭suvigirl


    More than 12,000 asylum seekers have been allowed to work in Ireland since the rules changed in 2018. That's is 80% of those who applied.

    The second most common reported job was healthcare assistant ( kitchen poster & cleaner came next, could also be in a healthcare environment)

    Source, schengenvisainfo.com



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    #8184
    Patrick2010
    Registered Users Posts: 3,166 ✭✭✭Patrick2010


    Yes, unfortunately if you’re not in favour of unlimited asylum seekers you’re a racist



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    #8185
    rgossip30
    Registered Users Posts: 2,462 ✭✭✭rgossip30


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120789388#Comment_120789388

    So does that mean more refugees and asylum seekers should be allowed in !!



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    #8186
    silverharp
    Registered Users Posts: 18,100 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    local Restaurant-er in Killarney not happy

    https://twitter.com/PaulTreyvaud/status/1674826926362443788


    This weekend was always the busiest weekend of the year in Killarney. Anywhere from 10-12k cyclists down for the Ring of Kerry plus a Munster Final every second year.

    This year, 4K cyclists as there is no accommodation and a kerry Tyrone match up in Croke Park.

    Kenmare’s busiest weekend of the year is the Ring of Beara in May but numbers were way down this year due to a serious lack of tourism accommodation too and this is repeated all over the country.

    We’re in serious trouble. Businesses are under incredible pressure. It’s all the governments fault with an insane policy of using tourism accommodation to house refugees/asylum seekers and if they think this will not cause serious repercussions then they are even more clueless than I thought.

    This winter, yet again, will be carnage for small businesses across Ireland. There will be huge closures again. Businesses simply can’t sustain this constant pressure.

    But thankfully our government have their priorities right. Use MORE tourism accommodation. Give old folks homes and student accommodation away. And KEEP piling on the pressure on the people of Ireland and it’s services by bringing in unlimited amounts of people.

    Label every concerned citizen as far right and bring in hate speech laws to shut people up. Yip, sounds about right alright.

    Our MSM aren’t showing a thing as to the extent of what’s happening in France right now. If you don’t know, have a look because that’s the direction we are heading in

    Or maybe that’s just what they want…..

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



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    #8187
    suvigirl
    Registered Users Posts: 7,538 ✭✭✭suvigirl


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120789428#Comment_120789428

    Don't see anyone suggesting that anywhere.



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    #8188
    rgossip30
    Registered Users Posts: 2,462 ✭✭✭rgossip30


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120789697#Comment_120789697

    So then why not a cap on the number .



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    #8189
    Ha Long Bay
    Registered Users Posts: 15,070 ✭✭✭✭Ha Long Bay


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120789682#Comment_120789682


    Twitter AI at it's finest.


    1.jpg




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    #8190
    superbatman
    Registered Users Posts: 130 ✭✭superbatman


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788163#Comment_120788163

    You are taking what that person said and twisting it for your own cause. No way says migrants don't provide for the country. As has been said by many people on here, what people do have an issue with is illegal and mass immigration. It doesn't do anyone any good in Irish society from the Irish to the Brazilians to the Indians etc.



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    #8191
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,062 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120789870#Comment_120789870

    You clearly are not reading the thread at all. There are lots of people saying migrants and refugees are all criminals, rapists, have nothing positive to bring to the country.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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