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PV Feed In Tariff

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    #2882
    Melted
    Registered Users Posts: 157 ✭✭Melted


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120801702#Comment_120801702

    so why would you get a massive array for your house whose output would exceed the demand? I dont see that as an investment at all.



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    #2883
    ColemanY2K
    Registered Users Posts: 891 ✭✭✭ColemanY2K


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120802413#Comment_120802413

    Output is highly unlikely to exceed demand in the winter months. Sure in the spring / summer / autumn periods that could be the case which is when FIT payments can be used to offset winter bills.

    Interestingly (or depending on your view - annoyingly) ESBN new restrictions on output will limit the inverter installs in the vast majority of future installations to a max of 5kW which in turn limits the size of the array. So we're unlikely to see too many +8kW arrays going up for the foreseeable.

    🌞 7.79kWp PV System. Comprised of 4.92kWp Tilting Ground Mount + 2.87kWp @ 27°, azimuth 180°, West Waterford 🌞



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    #2884
    HotSwap
    Registered Users Posts: 824 ✭✭✭HotSwap


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120802413#Comment_120802413

    A few reasons:

    1. FIT is currently very attractive; you can eat into any ROI period by fully taking advantage of this while it’s possible.
    2. Even very large arrays will struggle to support the demand in the winter months. So it makes sense to oversize.
    3. As mentioned; EV’s and Heat Pumps are likely on the agenda for a lot of people; it would be expensive to have a few panels installed; only to have to go back and install more later when the EV / HeatPump arrives.


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    #2885
    Melted
    Registered Users Posts: 157 ✭✭Melted


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120802458#Comment_120802458

    Fair enough I was talking with a fella who is getting a 14Kwh array with a massive battery with no intention of getting an EV and that dident really make sense to me.


    I hope the FIT is there long enough or at a suffient rate to be abe to pay that back as therwise you could be just pissing the money away. I guess im more stingy I see more value in using the energy rather than exporting it. But yea with its current implementation the FIT could help soften the blow in winter. I just hope he can get his thousands back over the next few years.



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    #2886
    HotSwap
    Registered Users Posts: 824 ✭✭✭HotSwap


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120802505#Comment_120802505

    Your reasoning is completely at odds with the government’s policy on solar PV. They are actively encouraging people to install as much solar as possible.

    If he has gone with an array that large he must of used the NC7 ESBN connection method; which also means that he is able to avail of the CEP (Clean Export Premium):

    Link:

    https://assets.gov.ie/244404/1477c2aa-9fbc-4c30-b4f7-454136806d33.pdf

    Table of rates:

    image.png


    What this means is that he’s guaranteed at least 0.135 cent per kWh exported for the next 15 years.

    This doesn’t prevent him from getting paid more than 0.135 cent if the suppliers want to pay that (as is the case now).



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    #2887
    Melted
    Registered Users Posts: 157 ✭✭Melted


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120802559#Comment_120802559

    ah ok dident know about the 15 year thing, good to know!


    No grant under 6KWe? ouch



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    #2888
    graememk
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 6,024 Mod ✭✭✭✭graememk


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120802559#Comment_120802559

    The wording is possibly ambiguous.

    I don't think domestic get the guarantee 13.5

    Eg

    [Domestic]and [ non domestic under 6kw] get SEAI grant but no guarantee.

    [Non domestic over 6kw and under 50kw] get no grant but a guaranteed 13.5c.

    It doesn't say about domestic over 6kw. Only large non domestic.

    The nc7 won't move you to being a non domestic customer.



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    #2889
    Melted
    Registered Users Posts: 157 ✭✭Melted


    I think there is a balancing act with all this. the scenario I talked about was person with no plans for EV getting a huge 14Kw array. I get you want to over produce especially to offset the winter bills so it it will pay to have aslightly large array than your house needs.


    But 14kw? madness. Its "investing" in solar panels so you can get FIT to pay for panels ou dont need?



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    #2890
    bullit_dodger
    Registered Users Posts: 2,520 ✭✭✭bullit_dodger


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120804037#Comment_120804037

    Yeah, 14Kwp is a "bit of a stretch" if you ask me (and I've 8.8Kwp). To give some balance though to the argument, he could be trying to get self-sufficient for more months of the year. Here's the PVGIS expected output of 7Kwp & 14Kwp. We'll assume south facing as we don't know. Naturally the output would be lower in some other config, e.g. east/west

    image.png

    With the average household being 4500Kwhr/year, and the typical skew towards using more in winter. We can say that roughly you'll want to use about 500 Kwhr (maybe 600 Kwhr) or so a month in winter. In feb, Oct and Nov above, you'd not get there with 7Kwp, but with 14Kwp you'd be close. Dec & jan of course the sun is simply too weak.

    Course the summer production is way (way!) more than anyone needs with 14Kwp unless you have a big family and lots of showers/washing/etc going on, and even at that.....a bit of a stretch.

    Still if someone wants to install that, they'll be producing green electricity and pumping that power to their neighbour. That's not a bad thing. Right?



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    #2891
    DC999
    Registered Users Posts: 1,448 ✭✭✭DC999


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120804037#Comment_120804037

    Different folks, different folks.

    ‘Madness’ is very subjective. What’s mad to me might be perfectly rationale to your and your circumstances, beliefs, hobbies, spending power…

    I’d agree that people shouldn’t invest in solar solely based on a high FIT rate remaining in the longer term. Would it be mad or kind if I could let a neighbour charge their car for free?.

    What if solar is a hobby? There is never an ROI on a hobby. What if that makes the person feel good as they are for-a-fact reducing emissions for them and others with that excess? That matters to me personally.



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    #2892
    DaveyDave
    Registered Users Posts: 6,239 ✭✭✭DaveyDave


    I can see the point in accounting for winter but without a battery to capture all that energy for evening/EV use would be the mad part to me.

    Would it even be feasible to offset huge amounts to cover your evening use if you didn't get a battery?



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    #2893
    SD_DRACULA
    Registered Users Posts: 2,293 ✭✭✭SD_DRACULA


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120804037#Comment_120804037
    Untitled Image

    This 🤣



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    #2894
    graememk
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 6,024 Mod ✭✭✭✭graememk


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805152#Comment_120805152

    With the current FIT rates, Its hard to make batteries pay.

    I have what ive generated and what ive used directly (ie from solar, to house use directly, not counting anything that went to a battery or even the EV charger) In 2021: I generated 6542kWh, and would have exported 4215kwh if I didnt have a battery or EV charger.

    Im with energia, so 18c, That would work out to €758/yr.

    In 2021 my batteries saved me €343/yr, that includes load shifting. (10kwh) (unit rates were 15c/7 and 20/5)

    in 2022 batteries saved 553, but I upgraded to 20kwh, rates(20/5 and 27/8) -renewal is the end of july

    Took some more crazy pills and went to 40kwh at the end of 2022.Really hard to do like for like comparisons between years



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    #2895
    bullit_dodger
    Registered Users Posts: 2,520 ✭✭✭bullit_dodger


    it's not all about money.

    Sure, 100% money matters - but the demographics for people reading these forums are generally environmentally friendly and people want to do right there as well as save a few quid. I always reckoned that 5-10Kwh was the "sweet spot" for a battery, it's hard to cycle a 20kwh battery daily. There's only so many washes you can do or showers to take. that said, like Graememk, I've plans to go to 20Kwh. Not because it will save me money, but I'm in the camp that I want to be as self-sufficient as I can. It'll be a fun project the DIY aspect of it.



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    #2896
    graememk
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 6,024 Mod ✭✭✭✭graememk


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120806495#Comment_120806495

    Oh I agree it's not all about money. I have way too much battery storage, although it only cost about the same as 10kwh.

    The only way I can use the 40 is charge the car from the battery. The car isn't at home during the the day anyway.



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    #2897
    Mr Q
    Registered Users Posts: 1,015 ✭✭✭Mr Q


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120806606#Comment_120806606

    My battery is smaller at about 30kWh. But at this time of the year I am using it to charge the car slowly later in the day and night.

    It is the only way I can use that much energy as the car is rarely at home during daytime, maybe one day a week at most. I assume a lot of people are similar.

    And I'm on the deemed export so trying to use as much as I can.



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    #2898
    yankinlk
    Registered Users Posts: 2,735 ✭✭✭yankinlk


    Im searching for a meme of scrooge mcduck sitting on a pile of gold... But the gold is the electricity stored in yer big batteries @graememk @MrQ



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    #2899
    MYSTICA1
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭MYSTICA1


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120800804#Comment_120800804

    I have been told by my provider that I need to be on a smart tariff in order to avail of the FIT. Is that correct? Is the above a smart tariff, and if I sign up for this, will I be paid by Flogas for the electricity I export from my solar panels? I am ashamed to admit, I have had the 4.92 kwp array since December and haven't seen a cent for the electricity I exported. I am now out of contract with my provider and looking for the best smart tariff. Can you guys help me? Thanks



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    #2900
    MYSTICA1
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭MYSTICA1


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817535#Comment_120817535

    Just to clarify, I do have a smart meter, just not on a smart tariff at present.



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    #2901
    Busman Paddy Lasty
    Registered Users Posts: 866 ✭✭✭Busman Paddy Lasty


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817559#Comment_120817559

    Nope. Smart meter here, Flogas BWG 24hr dual fuel (non-smart plan) and have already received an export payment 24c a unit.



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    #2902
    the_amazing_raisin
    Registered Users Posts: 11,225 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817535#Comment_120817535

    I believe suppliers can do this but the only one that does is SSE as far as I know

    Might be time to look at another supplier, although don't expect any straight answers from their customer service department as they're actively trying to move people to smart plans

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



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    #2903
    jkforde
    Registered Users Posts: 2,001 ✭✭✭jkforde


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817535#Comment_120817535

    so if you have a smart meter installed but on a non-smart tariff (eg 24hr), then they won't pay you deemed FIT? who's your supplier, Electric Ireland?

    🌦️ 6.7kwp, 45°, SSW, mid-Galway 🌦️



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    #2904
    MYSTICA1
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭MYSTICA1


    It is SSE. I want to switch now as I'm out of contract. Would the Flogas offer posted by con747 be the best to move to at the moment? I would expect to purchase around 2,000Kwh p.a. and feed-in around the same.



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    #2905
    Busman Paddy Lasty
    Registered Users Posts: 866 ✭✭✭Busman Paddy Lasty


    What's your current rate? The BWG day rate is, with rounding, 30c and export payment 24c.

    You would be paying 6c net for your electricity, while maintaining a non-activated smart meter.

    Ask SSE if they can beat that :)



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    #2906
    MYSTICA1
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭MYSTICA1


    Currently paying 42.49c ex VAT, no feed in credit and 76.03c per day (Rural) standing charge!

    Any votes for BWG Flogas ?



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    #2907
    jkforde
    Registered Users Posts: 2,001 ✭✭✭jkforde


    but if you move to Flogas with a 24-hour tariff on smart meter, you won't be getting any export credit from them either, will you?

    🌦️ 6.7kwp, 45°, SSW, mid-Galway 🌦️



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    #2908
    Busman Paddy Lasty
    Registered Users Posts: 866 ✭✭✭Busman Paddy Lasty


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120818142#Comment_120818142

    Just did exactly that and am getting 24c feed in.



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    #2909
    MYSTICA1
    Registered Users Posts: 125 ✭✭MYSTICA1


    Isn't that what Busman Paddy Lasty just implied though? .. that I would get 24c per Kwh export credit on that tariff?



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    #2910
    jkforde
    Registered Users Posts: 2,001 ✭✭✭jkforde


    that's great to hear, plough on so! though begs the question why you weren't getting any deemed CEG payment from SSE since December?!

    🌦️ 6.7kwp, 45°, SSW, mid-Galway 🌦️



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    #2911
    ColemanY2K
    Registered Users Posts: 891 ✭✭✭ColemanY2K


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120818703#Comment_120818703

    @MYSTICA1 could it be your NC6 hasn't been submitted?

    🌞 7.79kWp PV System. Comprised of 4.92kWp Tilting Ground Mount + 2.87kWp @ 27°, azimuth 180°, West Waterford 🌞



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