Brazilian Jiu Jitsu - General Thread

nozzferrahhtoo · 21-03-2023 3:45pm

Oh on another note I am on occasion back home in Ireland for sometimes days or weeks at a time. Which means I am not near my training. Are there any welcoming clubs that can be recommended within a relatively sane radius of Clontarf that allow (happily paying when required) people to walk in and train or "open mat" with the locals?

Black Sheep · 21-03-2023 5:03pm

I've yet to come across an Irish BJJ club that isn't happy to have visitor to regular class or an open mat.

10th Planet (North Strand)

Compound Martial Arts (Artane)

Aurum BJJ (Santry)

JSBJJ (Parnell St but it's still handy enough for Clontarf)

MrStuffins · 21-03-2023 5:30pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120383680#Comment_120383680

The guys at AURUM are great. I've gone to their Open Mat on a Saturday and it's a great session. YOu'll get some good rollsin and the gym itself is very impressive. Very clean, very modern ....... it's almost reminicent of a spa when you first walk in.

A spa where you get choked to death within 10 mins of course :D

MrStuffins · 21-03-2023 5:38pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120133276#Comment_120133276

I started off well here on the 150 hours (I said sessions, I meant hours) in 2023 but i've strugged over the last few weeks. I've just had a really mad social schedule and a holiday in between, so i've effectively been idle for the past three weeks but i'm getting back to it tonight with a view to training another two nights this week.

I don't think I have anything special on form April onwards with work on socially so i'm hoping to get back properly and make up for some of the lost sessions.

One thing i've been doing though is i've been adding in regular gym sessions as well. I've been managing to keep those up over the last few weeks as they're early in the morning and I can do them before work. Essentially i've just been doing bench, squats, deadlifts etc and trying to get stronger. I have my mate walking me through everything as i'm a complete novice. Any advice here form anyone as to what to do or, more importantly, what not to do in the regular gym that won't take away from activity on the mats?

nozzferrahhtoo · 22-03-2023 7:51am

Thanks all. I shall probably also be in Sligo area for the Easter Weekend if you know of any groups around there for a walk in just to keep me ticking over. Though I plan to run a half marathon in the area if I find a nice route for myself too. So might not wanna over do it too much :)

Black Sheep · 22-03-2023 6:07pm

When it comes to gym activity and BJJ, there are different schools of thought, but I've never been a believer in "sport specific" training for most people.

There probably is a value in having a few unilateral lower body movements in there to prehab the knees against common injuries, it does help.

I personally feel like doing direct neck training with a neck harness, and just weighted nods off a bench, did help with some neck pain I experienced years ago that was BJJ related.

Whatever you're doing, make sure you can recover from it combined with your BJJ. You don't want to be fatigued all week.

nozzferrahhtoo · 27-03-2023 6:45pm

Wow got totally choked out in training today. It came so suddenly that I was stunned and did not tap as quickly as I normally would.

I got the tap in, but not before some very strange auditory and visual hallucinations came, and lasted for a couple of seconds. In my ears it was like someone twanged a weird chord on an angry electric guitar. Or... maybe it was more like a metalic sounding version of someone twanging 100 eleastic bands in unison. I would not say it was pleasant or unpleasant.

I trust this is not normal? :) Feel fine now though, and do not think I had a mini stroke or anything :)

conor678 · 28-03-2023 7:40am

Sounds pretty right to me. No harm comes from it. I've been caught in particularly tight triangle chokes and tried to posture up etc and got choked out from it. Gave it a minute then been straight back rolling absolutely grand

Black Sheep · 28-03-2023 7:58am

We're not doctors but yes, it's in line with my experience of going out. Common to have rushing sounds in the ears, maybe a dreaming or waking dream experience.

The idea that being choked out is totally harmless... I'm not as sure as I was in the past. I think the it's probably low risk or the health risks are very statistically low but doubt its zero risk.

There's a suggestion that there is an increased stroke risk that's linked to being choked out. If you've got a neurological history in the family, strokes etc it is probably not ideal. There are a few stories and discussions about this online if you Google. I find it credible enough although wouldn't overreact.

There's also some people that lose bowel control, something to think about.

Personally, I try to keep it to a minimum (3 times in 15 plus years) and I would rest or drill the rest of a session after it happened.

RoboRat · 28-03-2023 8:12am

Been out about 8 months with a torn achilles - I have a deformity in my ankle where the bone is essentially severing the tendon. Been working hard to lengthen the tendon whilst rehabilitating the tear... this has led to complications in my knee (gave torn acl in both), and this dragged out my return.

Going back next month and really looking forward to it. If it wasn't for covid and injuries, I'd be pushing hard for my black but I'm getting older (46 next month), so I'm just enjoying the journey and not focused on the belt.

Regarding getting choked out, I tap even if I think I can get out. Once it's tight, and I know it's going to be close, I'm not taking a chance. It might not do damage now, but the brain is fragile and complex, and I'm not taking chances... plus I don't fancy pissing myself (I've seen this happen).

nozzferrahhtoo · 28-03-2023 8:43am

Yeah all good today so its not worrying me. It was an experience I have not had outside the realm of using substances of negotiable legality though. And it passed after a few seconds.

I usually tap out in good time especially on chokes. Its rolling not competition so I see no real benefit in pushing it. This was the first time that it happened that the choke seemed to launch absolutely out of nowhere and I was simply stunned by the move that it took me longer than normal to react.

The guy himself is starting as a white belt in BJJ but has his black belt in Judo. So it is always an experience rolling with him.

RoboRat · 28-03-2023 3:17pm

Tapping too late happens, especially when it's a sneaky blood choke. I remember putting a lad to sleep - had a cross collar from the mount, and it was tight. He bucked and tried to flip me but I knew the choke was tight so I didn't bother to block the sweep. By the time I flipped, he was out cold, snoring his head off.

Another time, I was demonstrating a one-arm RNC to my class and I was just showing where to grab the shoulder/ collarbone and where the pressure is being applied on the neck... when I heard him snoring. I hadn't actually applied the pressure but I was obviously cutting off the blood whilst I showed the positioning. He came to and swore he was never out... he just couldn't figure out how he was sitting one minute, and then lying on the ground with me holding his feet up the next.

The scariest one was when I was rolling and went for an assassin choke - it was a new one for my partner and he didn't realise he wasn't getting out of it, so kept fighting until he went limp. I was working on the technique so I wasn't aware that it was as tight as it was. It's now my go-to from turtle in the gi :-)

Mellor · 03-04-2023 4:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120383665#Comment_120383665

I competed often in multiple promotions, including a few times in AJP. It’s definitely one of the higher standard events, at least at coloured belts.

To be completely honest, I probably wouldn’t recommend it as your first competition. And not something to build up to over 12 months. Your first comp will be a learning experience and it’s highly likely that you’ll run into someone with more competition and JiuJitsu experience and be eliminated in your first match.

If you want to compete in AJP next year, I would try and compete 3-4 times prior to that at smaller competitions. Eliminate the first time jitters and novelty element, and make AJP as routine as possible.

As for the second part, Its easy to get a list of techniques as foundation of what you should know. But tbh, I’m not sure if that’s the best approach. You simply want to get better at BJJ. Knowing which submissions are hit from which position is a part of that.

Black Sheep · 07-04-2023 11:32am

I have never competed very much but in the beginning I was just as nervous at the smaller shows as the big shows. If someone did want to "get the most" out of a larger tournament and kind of squeeze the whole experience for the most out of it, then yes, I think it probably would be smart to acclimatise to competing beforehand. But there's no right or wrong way at the same time, as long as the OP enjoys it.

By training 1-1 with a black belt on a weekly basis on top of regular training that's a good amount of preparatory time in theory.

I think the issue is that when you compete it's managing the physical reaction that most people experience which is the biggest challenge, and you can't really mimic or prepare for that other actually doing it repeatedly.

Most people's mat ability degrades because of the nerves, and who among us has not done their first BJJ match and then spent the next ten minutes feeling as if their forearms are about to explode, from the death-gripping.

In terms of what the have going into a competition, I agree with Mellor that it's probably better to just plan to be an all-rounder. I did go into early competitions with a plan to pull guard and get a sub or sweep from closed guard, and I would have 2-3 technique options in my head. But although it's a low risk approach, it's also very hard to catch people from closed guard these days. Posturing up and not being submitted in closed guard is one of the few things most white belts actually have down quite well.

I was never a dynamic, accomplished takedowns guy, and still am not, but these days although I still have a guard game which is probably more varied, I really don't like to give up the chance to be on top and I will either try a simple takedown or (happens more often) when my opponent tries pull guard I will stuff it and then I'm happy to try pass from standing, which is a great low risk option.

Mellor · 06-05-2023 5:30am

Loud pop from my knee in training on Tuesday. Almost certainly it was my LCL. Will know more after an MRI.

Looking less likely I’ll be competing this year.

Black Sheep · 08-05-2023 10:18am

Ah, that BJJ life...!

Hope it's just a small tear.

Mellor · 08-05-2023 12:56pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120568823#Comment_120568823

Move about on it fine. So suspect it's a grade 1/2 tear. But also a linger feeling that it was the meniscus that has slide back in to place and is lying there waiting.

This my third time with a knee injury. This is probably the first time I blame myself.

Bot1 · 18-05-2023 2:39pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120409549#Comment_120409549

I hear ya bud!

I'm 43 myself. Missed 18 months due to COVID and I just missed another 6 months due to a meniscus tear.

I was probably weeks away from getting my Purple belt when COVID hit and then I ended up moving gyms in the middle of it.

So I've been a blue belt for 7 years. Lads in my old gym I started training with are brown belts!

Now, having said all that I don't feel like I'm good enough to be a purple belt so I'm happy out.

Being healthy enough to train is the goal for me these days!

First day back in 6 months yesterday! I forgot how much fun this **** is!

TitianGerm · 18-05-2023 3:02pm

My first day back training last Wednesday after nearly 3 years away and I managed to damage my shoulder and every muscle in my body is still sore a week later but it was great to be back on the mats.

All my movement is gone, I just couldn't get my body to do what I wanted it to do but hopefully the muscle memory will kick in after a few weeks.

Mellor · 22-05-2023 6:06am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120612570#Comment_120612570

A guy I started training with was a blackbelt before I was a purple. And he competes at the highest level (European champ, pans champ, Spyder champ).

People I've beaten me in comp are also blackbelts now, one competed at ADCC last year.

I long ago settled to myself to the reality that I'm on my own trajectory

Bot1 · 22-05-2023 9:47am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120625838#Comment_120625838

Absolutely.

Also, as Teddy Roosevelt said - 'comparison is the thief of joy'!

RonanP77 · 26-06-2023 9:58am

I used to post here regularly but haven't been on in years. I posted in December 2015 asking about what martial art to do in my local area and started Bjj in January 2016. Between Covid, a torn LCL and two broken ribs I missed about 18 months in that time, but two weeks ago, nearly 7.5 years after starting, and after switching clubs multiple times, I finally got my purple belt. Two weeks earlier I got my brown belt in Judo.

DrPhilG · 03-07-2023 10:50am

Getting ready to return to training after about a 3-4 year absence.

I feel like I've forgotten all I ever knew so I'll be going to the beginners class for a while.

MrStuffins · 03-07-2023 4:57pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120798456#Comment_120798456

What was your rank when you stopped going?

Great to hear you're getting back to it. You'll be in bits for a few days after your first session back but you'll be very glad of it!

DrPhilG · 03-07-2023 5:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120800251#Comment_120800251

Blue, but I probably only trained a dozen times in the year after getting it and then faded altogether.

Have lost 3 stone since the turn of the year and this is the next step.

MrStuffins · 04-07-2023 12:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120800284#Comment_120800284

Wow! Congrats on the weight loss.

Let us know how you get on getting back into training. I've found it a little difficult since getting my blue belt. The first 6 months was fine but then life started getting in the way. Every time I do get back into the swing of it, I get injured or I get Covid.

Looking to lose a good two stone myself over the next few months so BJJ is cntral to that strategy! Just gotta keep fit and healthy

DrPhilG · 04-07-2023 1:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120803223#Comment_120803223

Aye I've another 2 stone to shift. Along with diet I've been doing some cardio and weight training, but BJJ is a fantastic way to combine the 2.

Black Sheep · 20-07-2023 2:18pm

Does anyone know whatever became of efforts, years ago, to try to obtain some governing body status or recognition by Sports Ireland for BJJ?

At the time there was mention of an Irish BJJ Assocation being set up, but that it would be seeking NGB status without application to IMAC (Irish Martial Arts Commission).

In the interim, am I right in saying there is no official BJJ NGB or am I out of date?

Cheers.

Mellor · 24-07-2023 1:50am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120875411#Comment_120875411

Zero chance I think. One of the requirements to be a independent NGB in Martial arts is an international Federation/Governing Body. IMAC seems to serve to bridge that gap for some MAs. It's the really established martial arts that manage to be independent Judo, Wrestling, etc

The applicant body must satisfy Sport Ireland that it is recognised as the single national governing body for that sport in Ireland by that sport’s International Federation and that such recognition by the International Federation extends to all aspects of the relevant Sport in Ireland, including its disciplines and events.

There no international body for BJJ. An there's too much fighting and disputes historically - Mainly over money and territory - to ever create one. Also the reason that BJJ will never be in the Olympics.

Black Sheep · 24-07-2023 7:45am

It does "have" to be via IMAC, if the argument is taekwondo and judo have independent NGBs in Ireland only because they are Olympic sports. Ive heard that argument. But karate has a NGB so that kind of compromises that argument.

Currently, if you counted students, though, turnover and gauged the number of full time schools, it's hard to see how BJJ isn't on a better footing than anything except possibly kids TKD or karate, and even there it would only be numbers, and would be interesting to see trends.

But I'd say IMAC is the most likely route for BJJ Recognition if it ever occurred.

The lack of recognition by IMAC seems odd though, does it come down to the early clashes over connections to MMA? A real shame if so.

IMAC seems to have recognised a lot of smaller martial arts without difficulty, many with no single international governing body either.

I am not a club or business owner, does no one bother simply because there is no financial reason to these days I.e Bjj is already as commercially viable as it ever will be?

Mellor · 25-07-2023 7:48am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120889114#Comment_120889114

Karate is also an Olympic sport with a World Federation. As are boxing and wrestling. Being in the olympics helps, but its not a requirement. E.g. if wrestling was removed, it would not cease to be recognised. The Requirement is the one I quoted above, in that it is the national representative for the International Federation.

Currently, if you counted students, though, turnover and gauged the number of full time schools, it's hard to see how BJJ isn't on a better footing than anything except possibly kids TKD or karate, and even there it would only be numbers, and would be interesting to see trends.

If terms of size, I'd say that that it is possibly biggest now. But the difference is irrelevant.

The lack of recognition by IMAC seems odd though, does it come down to the early clashes over connections to MMA? A real shame if so.

IMAC seems to have recognised a lot of smaller martial arts without difficulty, many with no single international governing body either.

I would say that it's possibly the the connection to MMA, or if not the historic connection at the very least the people in a position to be representative for BJJ are the same people at loggerheads with IMAC.

IMAC seems to be the sensible choice, but I'd also question what they would require from BJJ. I'd need to understand what IMAC actually do. I don't know if they have anything to offer BJJ

There is no International Federation for BJJ, so I can't see how a National govern body can exist in any sort of functional way. If would just turn into a series of disagreements.

Black Sheep · 25-07-2023 5:10pm

Karate is an olympic sport? Wow, how did I miss that.

If you look at some of the bodies recognised by IMAC, not all of them have single international governing bodies either, it must be said. Some are quite idiosyncratic, and would make BJJ relatively straightforward.

Mellor · 26-07-2023 1:16am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120895360#Comment_120895360

Karate was added in 2020. The highlight being a guy getting DQ's in the final for kicking too hard. Opponent was dropped and given a gold medal. Not sure if it was a trial basis, or if it was simply for Tokyo. But it's not included in Paris. Might be one of the sports on a rotation list.

You are mixing up two different things regarding the International body. An international body is required to be recognised by Sport Ireland not to join IMAC. So Judo has the IJF, and all the other martial arts directly represented have a body. That, imo is a roadblock to BJJ being directly recognised with the IBJJF in its current form.

IMAC are themselves recognised as an umbrella organisation for other sports, they could add BJJ to the martial arts pretty easily. They recognise Sambo. I just don't think that would happen as BJJ historically lacks any cohesive organisation. The most likely suborganisation to be recognised would be the IBJJFs representative in Ireland. But why would try go under Mickey Mouse IMAC when they are in with the much bigger and organised IBJJF.

Black Sheep · 26-07-2023 9:50am

The issue is that some public sector entities still have an expectation of seeing a link to Sport Ireland (and thus IMAC becomes relevant).

It's a non issue if your BJJ is purely a commercial / private sector activity.

Mellor · 27-07-2023 1:54am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120897467#Comment_120897467

Ca you give an example? Do you mean like being employed in Dept of Sport and getting a grant towards sports fees? No idea if that exists, just trying to think of a connection between public sector and sporting interests.

Mellor · 27-07-2023 1:59am

Speaking on BJJ, I'm talking the classes while my coach was at the UFC london. Another week left. Last night reception tells me a guy has dropped in to train and speak to my coach. Yeah fine, tell him to jump in.

Guy was a Rickson Gracie blackbelt. Let me teach my throw and kneebars. The show us some awesome versions. 😂

Black Sheep · 27-07-2023 6:18am

In the public sector some larger organisations collect money from staff - on a voluntary basis - to fund sports and recreation clubs for them. I'm encountering some oldish rules that have it that there should be an NGB / sport ireland connection for sports clubs. It's not the end of the world but frustrating that you could be teaching "ninjutsu" and get the nod.

Mellor · 02-08-2023 5:38am

@RoboRat (or anyone) is Wolfhound fightwear still going? My wolfhound Gi is on it's last legs

RoboRat · 02-08-2023 12:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120928447#Comment_120928447

Yep, we are still going :-)

Had a hard time with the pandemic and it set us back a few years, but we are rebuilding. Hope to start increasing the range again and getting more stock.

Mellor · 02-08-2023 1:30pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120929641#Comment_120929641

Ok good stuff. My Púca has been my main gi for the last years. It’s starting to show. Rubber exposed. Knee ripped a bit.

Thinking maybe a dark one this time. As brother gave me a white gi that he doesn’t use…but also because I ripped the ass out my black gi.

conor678 · 02-08-2023 7:27pm

Glad to hear Wolfhound is rebuilding. Got the navy gi and it's great quality. Also love the retro Ireland rash guard. Again great quality and looks great.

Got few gi s on the go but one is starting to wear out so will look to get another one soon.

MrStuffins · 03-08-2023 10:27am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120931796#Comment_120931796

Have these exact ones. The Navy one is my favourite Gi. Absolutely smashing and great quality!

And a few lads int he gym are always bemoaning the fact that they can't get their hands on the retro Ireland rashguard! I've had a few threats from upper belts that they will fight me for it :D

Black Sheep · 04-08-2023 2:11pm

I had a black Wolfhound gi several years ago that had one of the coolest sublimated linings I've ever seen. I forget exactly what it was, but I think it was celtic sprituality in theme, there was a lot of orange and red.

Fully sublimated lined gis were popular as a premium option back then, I had another one from Scramble that was a crossover with The Warriors ... But the trend these days seems to be back towards more minimalist / lightweight gis. I guess without fail everyone is wearing a rashguard under their kimono anyway these days.

RoboRat · 04-08-2023 4:16pm

Thanks for the positive feedback... It's great to see the love for the gear :-)

I know we need to get the rashies back but it's a rebuilding task. I should also mention that after covid, we had some capital and knew we needed more stock. We put a large order in with a supplier whom we had been dealing with for around 8 years. Anyhow, he disappeared and we never received our stock which was worth around €10k. That was almost the end, thankfully a couple of clubs put in orders for custom gear and that allowed us to start rebuilding. It's been a rotten few years as we were really starting to take off, but sh1t happens and we just got to roll with it (pun intended!).

Hopefully this time next year, we will be in a much better place. I have a load of new designs that I want to get done - I used my time during covid creatively :-)

Black Sheep · 04-08-2023 4:45pm

That sucks re that supplier. Considering the countries usually involved, I can see how there would be zero chance of any effective comeback.

Mellor · 18-11-2023 1:22am

Lately, my rolls with my coach have been noticeably “harder” - as in more intense. Like i’ve unlocked the next level of resistance. I almost causght him in a darce this week, he won’t say it, but I know he really had to dig to get out. He just smiled and smashed me for the next 5 minutes. Literally submission, no reset, move, submission. Was close to puking.

Levels to the game.

MrStuffins · 18-11-2023 11:50pm

I've had an uneven year on the mats. Despite all the intention at the start of 2023, things changed in work and I ended up being extremely inconsistent.

But things have swung back the other way the last couple of months so I've managed to really get some good momentum going. Only issue is that my time being inactive has been time the other lads have been active and the rolls are much tougher these days 😂

Black Sheep · 21-11-2023 1:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121383040#Comment_121383040

I've had similar experiences over the years.

When I was a brown belt I was catching my coach here and there and I thought that was indicative of progress. It was, but more limited progress than I thought. There came the day when we suddenly started doing 8 minute rounds instead of 5 minute rounds, and he had learned all my subs, and then I didn't submit him for probably six months after that, too busy dying.

Mellor · 21-11-2023 10:15pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121395570#Comment_121395570

“When I was a brown belt…”

Have you been promoted to black and failed to mentioned it? Congrats if so

Black Sheep · 22-11-2023 6:03pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121397933#Comment_121397933

Yes, I got it the end of last year. Thanks for the congratulations.

I am 100% an example of someone who has just kept going to BJJ and punching the clock, I have never demonstrated anything remotely resembling talent or natural aptitude for it.

Happy to be a complete hobbyist, really, I feel quite 'free' to just explore the sport however I want.

I admire people like Chris Haueter who just show the jiu jitsu they want to show, even if it's "out of fashion" or things that we just don't tend to use these days. I saw him show some closed guard the other week, and he did two techniques that he obviously considered basic staples, and I'd never seen one of them before.

Brazilian Jiu Jitsu - General Thread

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