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General British politics discussion thread

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  • Registered Users Posts: 26,409 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    Far be it from me to tell you what to do with your life, but I suspect the Paris riots and the causes that give rise to them will be addressed more rapidly and more effectively than the UK's political woes.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,631 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Will they though? France has been in turmoil for years - with protests and strikes since forever - did the mob not storm the Bastille on July 14th 1789?



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,442 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    I suspect so as well. Just seems like a bad omen but it's probably not indicative of the city's quality of life in the grand scheme of things.

    I think so. Most days are fine. If they weren't, the city would have burned to the ground and the millions of residents would have fled. I think things have improved since 1789, the Paris Commune, etc...

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,477 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    The Tory Party and their numerous press pals have gone in a very strange direction since June 2016. But actively seeing themselves as part of a divided Britain and being firmly on one side of the divide is really off the wall. People may have been prepared to give Sunak the benefit of the doubt after the horrendous Johnson and Truss, but he seems as bad as them in many ways.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,627 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Sunak is worse than most of them in terms of ideals. Economically he is way over on the right and always has been.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,599 ✭✭✭rock22


    That's only 230+ years. The Brexit mess might go on a lot longer than that!



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,477 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    Indeed, and people nearly forget Sunak was a Brexiteer before Johnson and Truss (albeit an economic Brexiteer rather than one who hated the EU or European people).

    He definitely looks a wrong 'un though. Quite a few strange quotes have been attributed to him recently and his doubling down on the Rwanda policy suggests he is not a decent person.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,442 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    What's weird is that they've moved towards targeting ever shrinking parts of the electorate. Here's one example:

    I was shocked when I saw that not a single person raised their hand. Not one.

    Then, you have this from former paper of record (IMO), The Telegraph:

    Source:

    They have no ideas so they're doubling down on stuff they think will fire up their base but which inevitably ends up alienating moderates. If there was a man who could present a progressive front for the party, it'd have been Sunak but he's done nothing whatsoever to plan for the future. I'm 35. Where is my incentive to vote Tory? I share a house in London with 7 people and all I really want is to see my material circumstances improve, make progress on climate change action and at least try and fix the damn NHS.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,477 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    David McWilliams had a good article a few months ago outlining how right wing populist parties are usually bad news for a country and its economy and had stats to back his arguments up. They actively promote division and love the idea of a fractured society with 'us versus them'. Since Brexit, Britain and its media have 100% gone down this route with predictably disastrous results.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,631 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    The French have had a lot of uprisings over the years.

    There was trouble over Algiers, and France withdrawing from there, in 1958. That was when De Gaul came to power with the fifth republic. [I assume the previous ones came to a sticky end.]

    Then they had the 'Events of May 1968'. It was a student based 'revolution' related to flower power. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_68

    Then plenty of street protests over various EEC/EU/CAP disagreements. Quite a few air traffic strikes. Plus quite a few police/race riots over recent years.

    Not as stable as here.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 920 ✭✭✭ilkhanid


    Heh heh.. Heh heh heh..What a shame. How shocking. 😀😃😊 You can't beat a good gloat.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,520 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    It seems Farage may have been "slightly economical" with the truth when claiming his bank account was closed due to his political opinions.





  • Registered Users Posts: 25,627 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    No way. Never.

    I am shocked. I simply can't believe he would lie like this.

    😂



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,154 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    The contempt Sunak has for the position of Prime Minister




  • Registered Users Posts: 15,580 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    Integrity, professionalism and accountability. At all levels. I will earn your trust!

    The guy can't even read a report but has enough time to not only go to cricket matches but issue letters about the behaviour of the opposition during the cricket.

    The man is an absolute disaster. The more I see him the more I understand why they actually chose Truss before him.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,442 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    That's truly pathetic. He couldn't appear less comfortable and can't even maintain eye contact with Bryant. Most pathetic of all is that this is nothing more than insipid theatre. Sunak will face no consequences and will proceed to govern however he pleases.

    I read today an opinion that the role has been turned into an internship for the US speakers' circuit. Hard to disagree.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,477 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    About the only thing in his favour is that he seems very affable when meeting other leaders and doesn't have that slightly menacing and aggressive vibe that Johnson and Truss had.

    But the more you see of him, the less impressed you are with him. He says way short of being the standard to be a PM....there's not much to him and he's out of his depth.



  • Registered Users Posts: 21,330 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Could we borrow Chris Bryant, to ask a few questions of RTE executives? Real car crash stuff for Sunak.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,520 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr




  • Registered Users Posts: 17,154 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    Starmer is on a mission now, the man is a cameleon




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  • Registered Users Posts: 21,330 ✭✭✭✭Water John




  • Registered Users Posts: 17,154 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    Nasty people running the UK



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,631 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Yes, the Nasty Party - as christened by Theresa May - former Nasty Party Prime Minister.

    She should know just how nasty they can be - she was on the receiving end of some of it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,986 ✭✭✭✭Tom Mann Centuria


    Nasty people in England running the UK, considerably more progressive in Wales and Scotland.

    Oh well, give me an easy life and a peaceful death.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,627 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    The less said about the North the better 🤣

    I honestly don't know what this is all about and why they think this direction works.None of the Tories I know would be proud of this. You just don't fuk with kids wherever they are from.

    And any of the UKIP scobes I have met don't really vote anyway so I don't know why Tories think it's worth courting them.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,292 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    There it is. Codified cruelty for no other reason that for its own sake. A modicum of kindness towards innocent children, presumably bewildered and scared throughout the journey (but alone either way), is still too much an ask for a political class likely so removed from that strata of existence that it's a dot. And some might wonder why there's such a depth of anger towards the Tories; maybe there are some good, honest social or financial conservatives in their ranks - but if you're only as good as your weakest link, they're a repugnant lot.

    Maybe it's cos I'm a recent father of two, and my baby brain's still in overdrive but that's a sickening, heartless story to read.

    Post edited by pixelburp on


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,442 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    James O'Brien's thoughts for anyone who is interested:

    Sadly, I'm not remotely surprised. It makes no sense on any sort of logical or political level. There's no benefit for them to eke out of this. It's purely a measure of cruelty because the cruelty is the point and I'm convinced now that people like Braverman and Jenrick do not see these people as human, let alone deserving any sort of help at all.

    Braverman was confronted by Joan Salter, 83, during a meeting in her Fareham constituency in Hampshire on Friday evening.

    Salter, who has been recognised with an MBE for her work on Holocaust education, likened Braverman’s rhetoric on migrants attempting to cross the Channel to that used by the Nazis during the second world war.

    In footage of the exchange, provided by the charity Freedom From Torture, Salter said: “I am a child survivor of the Holocaust.

    “In 1943, I was forced to flee my birthplace in Belgium and went across war-torn Europe and dangerous seas until I finally was able to come to the UK in 1947.

    “When I hear you using words against refugees like ‘swarms’ and an ‘invasion’, I am reminded of the language used to dehumanise and justify the murder of my family and millions of others.

    “Why do you find the need to use that kind of language?”

    Braverman thanked Salter for her question, and said that she “shared a huge amount of concern and sympathy” over the “challenge” of illegal immigration, adding that her own parents were not born in Britain.

    Anyone remember that? I know the Godwin accusations gets flung around quite a bit but when you've an actual holocaust survivor getting involved, one would think that that would give cause for a pause if nothing else.

    I don't want to just fling around insults but I've nought else. Keir Starmer's being awfully quiet on what should be an easy win. The cartoon art may have made things easier for the kids, cost nothing to maintain and I didn't see Disney's lawyers rattling sabres so what was the benefit beyond performative cruelty for what must be some of the most awful people in this country.

    I used to work with a few younger Tory types. The sort who (pre 23 June 2016) were coming out with lines about Johnson being a character. One went to volunteer in Calais for a bit even.

    It's like being in a toxic timewarp. Labour will win in 2024 while Jenrick, Braverman or 30p Lee Anderson will end up leading the Tories until they realise that there's limited votes in what I can only assume is white supremacy at this point.

    I honestly can't see myself ever voting Tory to be honest. Like, ever.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,477 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    The transformation of the Conservative Party from a centre right / right wing party to effectively being a far right and racist one is one of the strangest developments in British political history.

    It would be like Labour getting elected with a big majority and then going full on hard left or communist.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,627 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    People are beneath you, to be talked to not heard.

    Arguments are not about proving you are right. They are just a game to be won. It doesn't matter what the opposition believe as long as you "win" at believing the opposite.

    Children dying in the sea are not people but pawns in a game. Their death won't affect you or the good old boys you went to school with.

    That is the mindset of the Tory minister.

    They needed a cause any cause. The current group grew up on Thatcher who had a cause, read all about how their entitled blooded peers like Churchill had a cause or how Wellington and Cardigan had grand adventures.

    They don't give a fuk either way whether all the refugees die (and they are refugees not migrants) or those refugees "flood" Luton and Bradford. They only give a fuk about showing they are in charge.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 21,330 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    We'll see if Sunak has the guts to fire him? Think I know the answer.



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