General Race Thread 2023 spoilers

breezy1985 · 28-06-2023 2:33pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120777822#Comment_120777822

That and Spartacus.

Weepsie · 28-06-2023 2:36pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120776384#Comment_120776384

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120776357#Comment_120776357

He hasn't had the results or form though and has not got them many UCI points this season. Meeuss is probably not winning any stages, but unless something changes with Sam, not sure he would be either. It's obviously not for lack of talent, but he doesn't seem to be putting himself into the correct position a lot this year and can't always rely on his pure pace. People hate him, but when Cavendish retires he should try and speak to him to learn a bit about using the wheels of other sprint trains and picking his time/spot a bit more

That said, Lorang said he'd be there only 3 weeks ago, if all was well. He could have an injury or something. Meuss has racked up a fair few podiums this year though, so could also just be a reward for good form.

breezy1985 · 28-06-2023 2:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120777853#Comment_120777853

Or better yet speak to Sagan who rarely ever had a sprint train. I wouldn't say Cavendish was any kind of expert looking at the teams he done well with compared to poorly.

Macy0161 · 28-06-2023 4:12pm

Doubt it's injury, given the nationals. The only thing I'd say in defence re: results, he was up there in a couple of Dauphine stages if you include the relegation one (he had the legs at least), and he was last pure sprinter left on the stage Alaphilippe won. I thought that was enough to get him his slot, if they were going to bring a sprinter.

MangleBadger · 28-06-2023 4:15pm

I could have understood if they brought no sprinter and just went for GC/stage hunting. But to bring Muess is just a kick in the teeth, no way is he a better sprinter than Sam even with his current form issues.

breezy1985 · 28-06-2023 4:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120778371#Comment_120778371

Maybe he is there to work for Van Poppel and they don't trust Sam to do the same.

breezy1985 · 28-06-2023 5:39pm

The new Lidl Trek sponsorship already showing results.

They are selling Kwaremont beer 😃

Weepsie · 29-06-2023 1:37am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120778371#Comment_120778371

Green tinted bias aside, I don't see how. He has 4 wins since joining.

He pissed away a stage win that he had in the bag in the dauphine with an uncharacteristic and massive deviation, but to me, he also looked like he was struggling to hold on to van poppels wheel in the same sprint lead up. I'd say had he won that stage as he probably should have, he's nailed on to be there.

There was another race earlier in the year when he had a perfect lead out, and just didn't seem to be paying attention to the road layout.

Muess isn't better, but he's racked up quite a few points for them this year and is being rewarded.

cunavalos · 29-06-2023 1:17pm

Bora have announced Sam will be back in action next week at the 4 day Sibiu tour in Romania. Far less glamorous but it is a case of rebuilding form for the next stage of his career.

There are 1 and a half stages for him to contest ( Final day is split into a morning tt and afternoon sprint stage).

While I have said previously his race program for the rest of the season may be reduced, if van Poppel and Meeus fail to impress during the TDF Bora may have little option but to give Sam more race time as it is not as if the rest of the team are pulling up trees with performances/results this season.

Dodge · 29-06-2023 7:08pm

Sam was always down for the Tour and Vuelta. The second half of the season doesn’t have much other than the Vuelta so not sure he can have more race time

I don’t see anyone suggesting he’s been in form or deserving of a place, but Meeus isn’t near his level. And Meeus’s decent results this year are at a step below who Sam has been competing against. This is his only win this year

https://www.procyclingstats.com/race/circuit-de-wallonie/2023/result

All immaterial of course

Dodge · 29-06-2023 7:36pm

He’s still annoyed about it too

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/cycling/2023/06/29/i-should-be-there-i-deserve-my-place-sam-bennett-admits-shock-at-missing-tour-de-france/

Mefistofelino · 29-06-2023 7:37pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120783964#Comment_120783964

While Meeus's results are at a lower level, he's still delivering them. Meeus is up with Hindley, Kamna and Higuita in terms of UCI points gained for Bora this year alomeand has over twice what Sam has delivered (460 vs 192). In fact, on the rolling total the UCI uses the gap is event greater. Is Meeus capable of delivering a big win like an in-form Bennett? No, but he's plugging away.

at1withmyself · 29-06-2023 7:42pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120781891#Comment_120781891

Well it's up to Sam now to prove to the team that they made at mistake and take a win in Romania.

Squidgy Black · 29-06-2023 8:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120784130#Comment_120784130

At this point I think it’s less so proving anything to Bora, and more so proving to other teams that you’re worthy of a WT spot, or even a Conti spot at this rate

griffin100 · 29-06-2023 8:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120784096#Comment_120784096

If he’d had performed at the Dauphine he’d be in the squad I’d say. Based on his poor form over the season that was probably his last chance to impress. If he’d been building towards the Tour as he says he should have been close to peak during the Dauphine and he wasn’t anywhere close to his best. It’s a pity as having an Irish sprinter in the race brings a much needed interest to what are generally relatively boring stages.

happytramp · 30-06-2023 12:20am

They'll be far less exciting for sure .. but the stress, even as a spectator, when he's competing, is mad. So a minor silver lining I suppose.... I'm just going to be up for the break on all the sprint stages now.

Macy0161 · 30-06-2023 10:16am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120784442#Comment_120784442

As said earlier, I would've said he did show form at the Dauphine, albeit not the results. Was just out of the top 10 on the stage Alaphilippe won, when it was only him and Porte left of the sprinters (most of them long dropped), and then the stage he was relegated. A lot of the "sprint" stages have enough lumps to put some of the sprinters in trouble. He wasn't ripping up trees, and I could understand if Bora brought no sprinter, but I think he has been hard done by with them selecting Meeus.

at1withmyself · 30-06-2023 1:42pm

Giro donne stage 1 cancelled due to rain

CramCycle · 30-06-2023 3:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120784098#Comment_120784098

By that logic if you are entering a team in the Ras you'd be better bringing an A3 who won 2 races than an A1 who was 10th in a few races. It does matter who the competition were. I placed in A4 races in certain parts of the country where in other parts of the country I'd have been dropped. You have to look at it in the round and to me this smacks of either, Bora aren't trying and hoping Meeus will get lucky or a petty punishment for not being as good as they wanted this year. Those aren't Irish eyes, those are facts, Sam isn't in his best form but he is better than Meeus at the minute in the round. This said, maybe they looked at the tour route in general and thought, Meeus has a better chance on some stags or making it through, it is hard to know.

With Irish eyes on, I hope he rips them asunder in the ToR and gets a good result in the Veulta

Mefistofelino · 30-06-2023 4:23pm

If the logic is that Meeus's performances aren't comparable on the basis he was winning 1.1 events like the Circuit de Charleroi Wallonie, then you can't really read anything into Sam "ripping them asunder in the ToR" either. It's not exactly a stacked field

https://www.procyclingstats.com/race/sibiu-cycling-tour/2023/startlist

100% agree on hoping he has a good Vuelta as it would make a big difference in his contract for 2024.

breezy1985 · 30-06-2023 4:27pm

Am I the only one in all this Sam vs Meeus talk who thinks neither of them are going to be or deserve to be the lead sprinter.

Danny Van Poppel is the fastest man on that team right now.

griffin100 · 30-06-2023 5:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788101#Comment_120788101

Bora must see something in Meeus’s training numbers, why else bring him as lead sprinter ahead of DVP (I’m assuming he is lead sprinter). If they want stage wind then a couple more climbers would be a better option than a long shot sprinter.

retalivity · 30-06-2023 6:16pm

Maybe Meuss will be leading out DVP...

breezy1985 · 30-06-2023 6:22pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788717#Comment_120788717

Thats my assumption. If not it's Van Poppel should be pssed not anyone else.

Dodge · 01-07-2023 8:14pm

Van Poppel isn’t a great sprinter. Either was Morkov or Renshaw before them.

Sure they’re fast, but they’re effectively sprinting when no one else is.

In a straight up sprint Sam beats DVP 9/10 times.

retalivity · 04-07-2023 9:05pm

Olympic RR & TT routes for 2024 revealed, RR looks very...Flandrien.

Surely one for MVDP, WVA, Jala if he gets back in form....get Ben Healy on the plane!

https://twitter.com/faustocoppi60/status/1676312766431260693

Dodge · 05-07-2023 10:20am

The other thing to note is that big nations will only have 4 at the Olympics (ie those ranked 1-5). Netherlands are ranked 7th so they’d only have 3

Ireland are currently 16th in the ranks so would have 2. Favours those who don’t really need a team…

Macy0161 · 05-07-2023 10:23am

Didn't catch it all, but Shane Stokes was on Game On (?) yesterday evening with excerpts of an interview with Sam. Sam sounded very disheartened tbh, hard to see him staying at Bora.

Raoul Duke · 05-07-2023 12:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120807463#Comment_120807463

When do those rankings crystallise? Is it too late to get another cyclist in there?

Dodge · 05-07-2023 12:25pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120808053#Comment_120808053

End of October. We have no chance of getting top 10 though.

1-5 gets 4

6-10 gets 3

11-20 gets 2

20-45 gets 1

General Race Thread 2023 **spoilers**

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General Race Thread 2023 spoilers