Napoleon - Apple TV+ - Ridley Scott & Joaquin Phoenix

Agent Coulson · 10-07-2023 12:02pm #1

Directed by Ridley Scott from a screenplay by David Scarpa, “Napoleon” stars Joaquin Phoenix as the French emperor and military leader. The film is an original and personal look at Napoleon’s origins and his swift, ruthless climb to emperor, viewed through the prism of his addictive and often volatile relationship with his wife and one true love, Josephine, played by Vanessa Kirby. The film captures Napoleon’s famous battles, relentless ambition and astounding strategic mind as an extraordinary military leader and war visionary. An Apple Studios production in conjunction with Scott Free Productions, “Napoleon” is produced by Scott, Kevin Walsh, Mark Huffam and Phoenix, with Michael Pruss and Aidan Elliott serving as executive producers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBmWztLPp9c&ab_channel=AppleTV

Niska · 10-07-2023 1:03pm

While it'll be on Apple TV, it will be getting a cinema release Nov 22nd.

https://www.empireonline.com/movies/news/napoleon-trailer-joaquin-phoenix-ridley-scott-historical-epic/

Napoleon is coming our way before the end of the year – heading to UK cinemas on 22 November, before it makes its way to Apple TV+ at a later date.

pixelburp · 10-07-2023 2:09pm

Always remember, however productive you think you are, 85 year old Ridley Scott has you beat. His output has been variable and then some, but the man sure does work. Said it before but I daresay he'll pass while on an active project - his office a trove of scripts & manuscripts.

As to the trailer? While it might be all in the editing, it looks absolutely epic and gloriously old-school; could be one requiring the cinema before it appears on Apple+. I'm sure many of those crowd scenes are CGI but I can't deny I'm a sucker for something this gloriously operatic.

I do love this continued trend to have historical stories, set in France with French characters, speaking with plummy English accents. Wonder who started that; not that everyone talking with Allo Allo accents wouldn't itself be distracting - but why have everyone do it?

Agent Coulson · 10-07-2023 2:44pm

The cinema release for this I am sure for Oscar nominations.

bnt · 10-07-2023 2:54pm

The accent trend is not new, though I've seen it more in Russian settings e.g. The Death of Stalin or the Chernobyl series. In the latter the producers explicitly said they used English etc. accents because fake Russian accents would have been a distraction. But it goes back even further, to all those historical epics of the 1950s and '60s. Charlton Heston in Ben Hur, for example!

From the trailer, Vanessa Kirby is almost a dead ringer for the Joséphine in paintings, down to the hairstyle. But who was that as the Duke of Wellington at 1:40? He looks familiar but I can't see him in the IMDB credits.

10-07-2023 2:56pm

This looks fantastic.

Thelonious Monk · 10-07-2023 2:56pm

I love all things Napoleon, I hope this is good. Given what we've seen in the trailer this must be a really long film, but I could watch hours of this kind of thing if it's made well.

Ridley has had some clangers in recent years, let's hope he can produce something great again.

pixelburp · 10-07-2023 3:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120830704#Comment_120830704

That's true, forgot about those recent Russia set dramas (sidebar, Death of Stalin was a fanatically dark comedy - until oh wow it wasn't - where Jason Isaacs steals everyone's lunch).

At least those dramas were entirely contained within Russia, maintaining the illusion: maybe it just stuck out more in this instance, as the tale of Napoleon would involve actual English people. So the trailer made it look like one bunch of English aristos fighting against another bunch lol.

ancapailldorcha · 10-07-2023 4:45pm

This looks like it could be truly epic. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't hyped but it's a shame it's in English when it's centred on Napoleon and France.

SuperBowserWorld · 10-07-2023 4:52pm

Looking forward to this. Hope it's great. And want to see it in the cinema. Hard to believe Ridley Scott is making this stuff at 85. Joaquin Phoenix is a brilliant actor.

JP Liz V1 · 10-07-2023 11:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120831316#Comment_120831316

One of the best of this generation

speedboatchase · 11-07-2023 2:24pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120830629#Comment_120830629

No, Apple are actually going big on cinema releases: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-03-23/apple-to-splash-1-billion-a-year-on-films-to-break-into-cinemas

minimary · 11-07-2023 5:42pm

@bnt Fairly confident thats Rupert Everett at 1:40 but the film isn't listed as upcoming on his imdb https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000391/

JP Liz V1 · 12-07-2023 12:00am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120838292#Comment_120838292

Did look like him from the trailer

ancapailldorcha · 12-07-2023 7:21am

I'm a bit concerned about how accurate this is going to be. While I'm not expecting a work of scholarship along the lines of Braveheart, the real story is more than thrilling enough as it is.

pixelburp · 12-07-2023 7:37am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120840097#Comment_120840097

Start with the presumption it's gonna take wild simplifications of events at best, or plain fabrication of important individuals at worst, and anything above that will surprise. I can't even remember the last time a Hollywood historical epic tried to hew closely to events; maybe Outlaw King, but my Scottish history is patchy at best.

ancapailldorcha · 12-07-2023 7:50am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120840140#Comment_120840140

Outlaw King was fine as I recall. A bit boring but there wasn't anything too daft going on either.

I did enjoy Gladiator and Kingdom of Heaven. Scott is an incredible filmmaker. I just don't think Napoleon needs any sexing up. That said, I'm definitely going to be seeing this. I'm completely starved for historical epics as they're presumably too expensive and risky to make.

Nermal · 12-07-2023 8:00am

If only Kubrick had got to it...

pixelburp · 12-07-2023 8:28am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120840203#Comment_120840203

Did we ever have a sense what this mythological script was gonna cover? Something intimate or a big sweeping epic? IIRC Kubrick just came to the idea too late, when the historical epic was already on the wane (indeed IIRC one of the major flops that sounded the death knell was a Waterloo movie).

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120840178#Comment_120840178

Yeah Outlaw King was a bit tedious, perhaps because it tried to avoid sexing things up too much?

Ironically, with CGI now so prevalent, you'd think sweeping epics, with armies numbering the tens of thousands, would be more common now - not less. You don't need to hire the Spanish or Yugoslav army anymore for your battle scenes, lol. But sure all you need is a couple to do well and back comes the genre.

John_Rambo · 12-07-2023 8:32am

I don't think sweeping epics are what people want to see anymore. Present company excluded of course.

limnam · 12-07-2023 8:55am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120840097#Comment_120840097

"astounding strategic mind as an extraordinary military leader and war visionary"

Based on that one can assume it won't be making a fair assessment of the jumped up little man child.

ancapailldorcha · 12-07-2023 5:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120840303#Comment_120840303

One would think. I suspect it must be at least partly due to the dominance of cape-wearing types. If this is successful, we may get more historical epics which would be incredible.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120840414#Comment_120840414

0/10.

limnam · 12-07-2023 7:28pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120843057#Comment_120843057

I assume the score is for what you believe to be a troll.

Couldn't be further from the truth. While people may claim they want it to be accurate they don't.

Sure they may want the dates/places etc to be right. But they don't really want the truth.

They want something like this

"astounding strategic mind as an extraordinary military leader and war visionary"

Not the dross of the sad fat pathetic little man that he was.

ancapailldorcha · 12-07-2023 7:37pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120843452#Comment_120843452

I'm afraid I don't find your petty attempts at being edgy interesting. I won't be responding to any more of them.

limnam · 12-07-2023 8:01pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120843485#Comment_120843485

You think people who want to be edgy choose topics such as the potential factual inaccuracies of an epic based on napoleon?

Sound.

You could have just said you didn't mean THAT accurate and we could have carried on instead of making personal digs at me.

Calling me a troll then making personal comments. You should know better.

Sudden Valley · 13-07-2023 12:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120843580#Comment_120843580

Perhaps you can clarify do you not think Napoleon was an extraordinary military leader?- I think his contemporaries and most historians would share the viewpoint he was one of the best generals in world history.

ancapailldorcha · 13-07-2023 1:00pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120845982#Comment_120845982

The man was the greatest general of all time, led from the front, created a legal system which endures in much of continental Europe to this day and many of modern France's institutions can be traced back to him.

It's a bit cringey seeing some lad on the internet trying to be edgy by posting childish insults.

flasher0030 · 13-07-2023 1:08pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058304442/napoleon-apple-tv-ridley-scott-joaquin-phoenix

Looks really good. Looking forward to this. Can't beat Joachim Phoenix for a top notch character portrayal.

p to the e · 13-07-2023 4:26pm

I'd say Scott should go the whole hog and make it a triptych

conorhal · 14-07-2023 1:06pm

As much as I like Gladiator and Kingdom of Heaven (the less said about Scott's Robin Hood movie the better), Ridley Scott and 'historical accuracy' are not close friends. Gladiator gets a pass from me because 'history' is really just a backdrop for the story, I get less forgiving about Robin Hood and that awful guff about his daddy writing the Magna Carta.... seriously... there's historical backdrop, and then there's completely re-writing important moments in history, and that make me nervous about this film.

It's Ridley Scott, so doubtless it will look gorgeous, but another strike against the film for me is the casting of Joaquin Phoenix. Firstly, the film seems to encompas all of Napoleon's career and Phoenix is already as old as Napoleon when he died, yet he's clearly portraying him in events when he was a young officer. And what's with the depressive, sullen introvert Napoleon I'm seeing in the trailers? It doesn't exactly square with the charismatic military leader that inspired a cult of personality amongst his troops. Give me Armand Assante in the 80's mini-series any day of the week!

ancapailldorcha · 14-07-2023 1:20pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120850775#Comment_120850775

Some good points there. This feels like it would work much better as a two-parter or a trilogy. The Napoleon story is so thick that putting into even a three-hour film would involve a lot of corner-cutting and simplification.

I can tolerate limited amounts of alterations to history if it serves the plot and makes some degree of reasonable sense. I'm quite fond of Kingdom of Heaven but Baldwin IV and Saladin never met. It's a really cool scene though so I wasn't too bothered as the rest of the film is somewhat sensible, if overloaded with Orlando Bloom.

I don't think the sullen mood I'm getting from Phoenix is going to fit the film either. I'm prepared to wait for it and it being a historical epic means I have to see it regardless but it'll be quite depressing if he's going to be like that for 3 hours or more. It looks like Austerlitz is going to be just shooting cannons onto an icefield as well.

breezy1985 · 14-07-2023 1:50pm

Will be interesting to see if he is portrayed as the evil parody from British history or the anti church and class system hero.

Maybe they ignore both and just concentrate on the army general.

Another Ridley Scott movie has a quote that fits him well.

"How will the world speak my name in years to come? Will I be known as the philosopher? The warrior? The tyrant...? Or will I be the emperor who gave Rome back her true self?"

billyhead · 14-07-2023 7:04pm

Looking forward to seeing this. I presume there won't be any historical inaccuracies in it.

limnam · 15-07-2023 12:00pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120845982#Comment_120845982

There's also historians that counter that viewpoint. We can point to plenty of basic tactical/strategical blunders to suggest otherwise.

But to answer the question. No he's no hero of mine. Surely on the basis of "tactical genius". If that's the yardstick kutozov must be the real genius no ? :)

Anyway I fear we're going to pull this thread off in a direction it doesn't need to go. My fault for starting it and don't particularly want to be attacked by mods any further on it.

silverharp · 15-07-2023 1:46pm

Its worth watching the 1970 film Waterloo, its up on Youtube

pixelburp · 18-10-2023 6:38pm

Another trailer out for this; certainly appears to be swinging for an epic scope.

https://youtu.be/4zdMzTCZBVI?si=aK6QDXPy4FKP0cNT

buried · 18-10-2023 7:03pm

Looking forward to this. Hopefully 'Le Petit Homme Rouge' makes some sort of appearance in it.

odyssey06 · 18-10-2023 7:33pm

To whet the appetite Id recommend this from Ridley Scott also set in Napoleonic period

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Duellists

Loafing Oaf · 21-10-2023 2:49pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120852507#Comment_120852507

Yep every detail verified, just like Gladiator😝

TinyMuffin · 13-11-2023 11:37pm

Looking forward to this.

https://youtu.be/LIsfMO5Jd_w

Steviemak7 · 13-11-2023 11:39pm

Looks great

silverharp · 15-11-2023 10:52am

seem to be reviewed positively, im not screaming to see it in the cinema though , it will be on Apple around Feb 24

https://twitter.com/Luiz_Fernando_J/status/1724588114482540628

pixelburp · 15-11-2023 11:15am

Threads merged

ancapailldorcha · 15-11-2023 11:21am

This looks like it might be worth another trip to the BFI IMAX.

johnny_ultimate · 15-11-2023 11:31am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121370742#Comment_121370742

Funny enough it's a rare film that jumps out to me as not looking particularly cinematic. It has an ugly digital sheen to it in the trailers I've seen in cinema and online. Maybe that's just a trailer grading issue, but it's stood out quite significantly.

Early reviews are fairly all over the shop - leaning positive but a lot of very mixed to negative reviews out there too. Not a big fan of modern Ridley Scott films as they tend to feel a bit tossed off even at mega-budget level, but will get around to seeing this at some point.

johnny_ultimate · 15-11-2023 11:40am

Also worth noting: the theatrical version is actually significantly shortened, and Scott is promising a 'director's cut' that's 4 hours long for its Apple TV release down the line. Suggests to me the theatrical cut is maybe worth skipping on the big screen - and I never skip the big screen 😅

Seems quite a bit is missing going by Indiewire's review:

"Even if Scott hadn’t already promised a director’s cut of the movie, and even if the trailers hadn’t teased epic “Master and Commander”-worthy naval battles that are nowhere to be found in the theatrical version, it would still feel as if large and necessary chunks of “Napoleon” were missing at its current length."

https://www.indiewire.com/criticism/movies/napoleon-review-ridley-scott-joaquin-phoenix-1234926076/

ancapailldorcha · 15-11-2023 11:44am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121370781#Comment_121370781

I can't say that I noticed. Maybe I got distracted by the cannons and horses.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121370811#Comment_121370811

That's depressing. BFI's expensive as well. Might be worth just chancing Cineworld with the phone people.

silverharp · 15-11-2023 11:55am

The trailers came across as made for TV allbeit high quality , but primed maybe knowing that its made by Apple TV , not good branding? I assumed its was a limited release to allow it to qualify for Oscars?. Watching a few military history reviews of it , a purest wouldnt be too happy with it but if its entertaining , can live with it

speedboatchase · 15-11-2023 3:15pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121370870#Comment_121370870

This isn't like what Netflix do with their one-week releases to ensure their films are eligible for certain awards. Apple, for now at least, is fully invested in full cinematic releases for their movies, which will then be exclusive to Apple+. Amazon did similar this year for Creed 3 and Air.

TinyMuffin · 16-11-2023 9:07am

Waterloo from his memoirs.

Thelonious Monk · 16-11-2023 2:41pm

Looks good, Guardian gave it a 5 star review. My only gripe is that I think it uses modern music, Radiohead etc., in the soundtrack. Personal bugbear of mine in period pieces, I couldn't watch peaky blinders once the electric guitars started playing in the soundtrack! So hopefully it doesn't ruin the film for me.

Napoleon - Apple TV+ - Ridley Scott & Joaquin Phoenix

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