Irish Under-20's 2023

Telling alright

It's not the few that are there, I am talking about, it's the ones who disappeared over the years. The last international back 5 forward of any real note produced by the Academy is Iain Henderson. He got his first Ireland cap in 2012. The last prop of note before TOT was Simon Best who retired in 2007. The last back row of any quality was Ferris with a nod Chris Henry. The last 10 worth a place in the Ireland squad apart from P.J. was David Humphreys. The last scrum half from the academy before Doak was Paul Marshall and before that Doak's father. Lots of guys have gone through the academy in these positions and we never heard of then again. Yes, we have produced good hookers and backs over the years. I just refuse to believe that all those other guys over the years selected for the academy and who disappeared into the ether were no good. All of them? .....Nah!

Remember wqtching in bewilderment while Brian Mclaughlin and then Les Kiss turned out teams where the centres were on the wings, wings in the centres 6s at 7, 9s at 8 etc. Remember the jokes about selections by chicken entrails and Ouija Board. Well it isn't as bad as that but not a lot.

France simply excellent and unfortunately they dished out a hammering to Ireland in the end. I think we missed Cooney from a defensive point of view in the backs.

I'm usually a staunch defender of referees and this is a development tournament for referees too, but I thought the referee was out of his depth. Made a lot of technically poor decisions, was bailed out by his TMO more than once for what should have been relatively clear and obvious offences. He also had absolutely no relationship with players and had the game been tight, I think control may have become an issue.

His performance ultimately didn't affect the score line, but his performance was sub par in my opinion.

100% agree

A couple people already posted their guesses for next years XV a while back, and I've been thinking a little about which positions are looking to be the most up for debate and where some u19's might be promoted early.

I imagine O'Connell is the first name in the second row but the other spot seems open to me. Hopes probably has a running start on it as he's already played as an u19, but I don't think he really impressed all that much and the coaches could go with a heavier option or someone better at the dirty work. There are a couple of huge u19's but Walsh will still be in school and Spicer doesn't really seem to have started in interpros for Leinster much and seems more a project player rather that someone who will start for the u20s a year early.

Hooker looks very open to me. Sheehan played a year early but didn't really stand out, Zac Solomon just made Ulster's academy, and Stephen Smyth is a recent backrow convert and I thought he played well against Japan - just need to see if he has the lineouts and scrums down. Maybe is there's a standout u19 they can sneak in here but I reckon it's probably one of these three.

There are a few backrowers of similar quality all effectively fighting for two places because of Gleeson: Sheehan, Stevens, McKillop, Ward, Briggs. Sheehan has played u20 already but wasn't trusted much by the coaches and might not have played if Liam Moloney wasn't injured. Ward and McKillop missed out on Ulsters academy while Briggs made it. I think an u19 could win a place.

I'm not sure about the quality of the flyhalves next year or who's favoured over who.

The back three should be a tight contest, lots of good options there. McLaughlin, Kenny and O'Connor all highly regarded in their respective provinces. McFarlane, Kiely, Graham all good as well.

Kritzinger and Berman were the preferred centres at u18 level but Gavin played a lot for the u20's this year as an u19 and although was a mixed bag at times, his size and strength are great assets. I think he'll be the first name on the sheet but I'm not sure who'll partner him and who'll be 12/13. Kritzinger didn't stand out for me in the senior cup or for the 19s but he was out all year long with a bad injury I think, and Berman has u20 experience and had a few good moments but overall I wasn't very impressed. They were fairly poor defensively for the u19s against Japan but only had a couple of training sessions together whereas Japan were very well organised. Wales gave them a lot of bother in the u18 six nations but Akerman and Hennessey have both stood out for them in the u20s already. I feel like I'm forgetting someone else in contention and there are a couple of decent u18 centres this year but they are very small and still in school.

Anyway, that was a lot of rambling and obviously there's a lot of rugby/developing to do but at this stage I'll guess:

1. Jacob Boyd 2. Stephen Smyth 3. Andrew Sparrow 4. Joe Hopes 5. Evan O'Connell 6. Luke Murphy (u19) 7. Josh Stevens 8. Brian Gleeson 9. Jake O'Riordan 10. Jack Murphy 11. Ben O'Connor 12. Luke Kritzinger 13. Hugh Gavin 14. Lukas Kenny 15. Hugo McLaughlin

I thought Hicks might have a chance but all I've seen of him are those three u18 six nations games.

I wasn't too fussed about the back three's exact positions but I felt that I'd want McLaughlin on the ball as much as possible. You are probably right though and honestly all of McLaughlin, Kenny, McFarlane and O'Connor are very good and came through as fullbacks.

I've seen only a little of Edogbo but mostly didn't mention him here as he didn't feature at all in the four tests with Japan and France, and as you said, hadn't been picked up by Munster yet. He could very well feature in the squad though, this is all guesswork at this point without seeing how these guys do at a more senior level.

Ben McFarlane- put in one of the best individual performances I’ve ever seen in the schools cup final in 2022. Similar in height to Mike Lowry but a better looking player who’s goal kicking is very good. Very quick and great footwork

Ethan Graham- Electric pace and talented footballer who’s a very good tackler also. Came through the clubs pathway in ulster and has played regularly for Ballynahinch and ulster A

Lukas Kenny- Absolute game changing player on both sides of the ball, by far the best back in ulster and will probably make his senior debut straight out of school this season. Physical, Fast, Skillful. Has so much time on the ball

I thought Hugo McLaughlin was one of the better school prospects I've seen and putting him on the wing probably doesn't get the best of his kicking game/ playmaking as a second receiver. The fullback position does look competitive though.

Another year in school I believe

Cheers for that, good to know.

Does anyone see Charlie Sheridan being involved much next year or will his size work against him? He seems to be tearing it up in the AIL.

Side point, but does anyone know how Karl Martin has been faring at Montpellier? He looked so promising at u18 level.

I don’t see Sheridan on the NTS which is probably a bad sign. Although this is the first year the list is public i think so who knows how much it changes year to year. He does seem to be killing it in the AIL.

You’d imagine he’d want to as his kid will probably be the 10. One last year.

Leinster aren't afraid of taking in smaller centres - Liam Turner, Hugh Cooney and David Hawkshaw certainly aren't towering over anyone, although they've all shown to be fairly physical for their size.