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12% minimum wage increase recommended

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    If Keeling cost goes up, then the price goes up. So they won't be up "s**t creek" because the customer is the one who will have to pay it



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,918 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Current minimum wage is 11.30.

    That's equivalent to an annual 22,600.

    Starting salary for a CO in the public sector is approx 26,500 (varies a bit between org-types).

    Of course it would have an effect.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,170 ✭✭✭limnam


    Why do you want to take out some of the biggest expenses?

    Mortgage/Rent/Insurance/wages/water charges/Maintenance for machines./Power (you're not just heating water)

    While some places might be gauging. Removing the heavy costs to come up with the price of a cup is a bit disingenuous



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,383 ✭✭✭✭Geuze


    I am simply repeating the information provided to me by the proprietor.

    Of course I know there are wages cost + overheads.

    But even with a low selling price of 2.00 in a city centre, there is still an 85% gross margin.

    There is plenty of gross margin to cover overheads.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    How much rent for the city centre location ? how many cups of tea do they need to sell before it covers the rent alone before electricity and staff costs



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  • Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    We’ve been hearing the scaremongering about businesses going under for years because of a few euro increase in wages for staff and yet the same talking heads making those doomsday fears are rolled out every year making the same remarks and they’re never being pulled up.

    In 2016, the Restaurants Association in its pre-Budget submission called for a freeze on the minimum wage until 2021. Five years. That is nothing to do with businesses going bust, that is complete and utter greed. The same group make demands about changing up the work permit rules because they can’t attract staff here. You literally couldn’t make it up.

    Many small businesses out there don’t pay the minimum wage because they understand the value of good, honest, hard-working staff, and they’re doing just fine.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,984 ✭✭✭✭Potential-Monke


    I think the biggest issue when an increase in min wage is announced is that people who are not on minimum wage won't see any increase and will think that's unfair. But that's a different arguement, should everyone elses wages go up too. I'd like it if they did, but they won't, and that's where I reckon people have issue with it. Won't affect me anyway.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,441 ✭✭✭beachhead


    The ones who are going under don't go showboating on whatever tv station wants to parade the usual suspects on air.Restaurants and hotels together with pubs here have always had the poor mouth.There is a government department that inspects businesses for labour laws compliance.They obviously don't do their job 100%-possibly deliberately understaffed to avoid upsetting the business classes.If it did work then businesses would put up or shut up.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,430 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    If minimum wage goes up all pay scales will have to rise accordingly.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,774 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    It's getting to the stage that it's only young adults with no kids or a mortgage and are living at home with their parents can take up those CO jobs. The money is woefully sh1te.

    I've no objection to a rise in the minimum wage but it would have a knock on effect for everyone else too.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,553 ✭✭✭lmimmfn


    When minimum wage increases the cost of basic services increase, which causes inflation increases resulting in those using the services requesting pay increases to at least maintain their standard of living and on and on.

    Let's put out the current inflation fire with some petrol!!!



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub




  • Registered Users Posts: 22,409 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Minimum wages don't drive inflation. They very very rarely increase faster than background inflation, and if wages don't keep up with background inflation then it's just a transfer of wealth from the poor to the rich and that eats away at the fabric of society.

    Minimum wages should be index linked and rise every single year. Corporations should be banned from writing in index linked price increases into their contracts ( like broadband providers increasing prices by inflation plus 3% every year)

    The whole point of private capitalism is that entrapreneurs can do things more efficiently while in a competitive environment so they should be able to increase productivity through innovation and not just cutting employee wages and driving up prices



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,430 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    Minimum wage doesn't live in isolation though. All pay grades above it are based on it. Raise minimum wage all other pay grades obviously have to increase and it would certainly contribute to inflation.



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,409 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Let the higher paid workers negotiate their wage with their employers like they already do. But minimum wages are set by the state and the state should ensure that there isn't an ever increasing gap between the lowest paid workers and the cost of living.

    If that means inflation then so be it. Ultimately inflation hurts people who own debt.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    Minimum wages push's all wages up. Increases inflation

    Ultimately it hurts everyone because from a tea bag to a car the price increases.



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,409 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    A 10% increase for minimum wage workers is 1.30 an hour. A 10% increase for someone on 40k a year is 2 euros an hour, 4 euros an hour for someone on 80k yet some people will try to blame the minimum wage earners for the inflation rate going up.


    The government should set a livable wage as minimum wage and raise it in line with inflation. If higher wage earners want to keep up withijinum wage workers, offer them 1.30 extra an hour. Most wouldn't even notice if they got it or not



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,430 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    It's not just higher paid workers, it's everyone in-between.



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,409 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Everyone on above minimum wage is a higher paid worker than minimum wage...



  • Registered Users Posts: 580 ✭✭✭batman75


    As someone who works in retail whenever the minimum wage rises it rises for all employees regardless of their wage. You now have sick pay to pay as an employer which will gradually increase. You will soon have pension contributions to make starting in the next two years or so. Retail is on its knees in our sector of it. Same in the UK. People, who have spare cash, are spending their money on holidays and entertainment.

    The problem with such an increase, any in reality, is that it will increase the cost of living to where the increase for the recipient is wiped out so its constantly tail chasing. The only way an increase in wages would mean anything would be for the Government to reduce it's tax burden on workers. For the Government to take measures to reduce the cost of living ie more housing, free GP visits for all etc.

    We are fast heading towards a Scandinavian level of cost of living.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 22,409 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    If you give someone on 40k the same absolute Increase as someone on minimum wage then it's less than half the rate of inflation....



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,409 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    And if workers aren't getting increases in line with inflation, then that money is going to shareholders instead, the wealthiest getting richer while everyone else gets poorer



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,600 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    The minimum wage should be abolished. It always has harmful effects.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,430 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    Not everyone works for a PLC,nor do they always make increased profits.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,319 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...again folks, we re currently experiencing primarily supply side lead inflation, not demand side, this is ultimately not coming from an increase in pay, but from the likes of record profiteering by many major sectors of our economies..



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,409 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Whats that got to do with the minimum wage going up?

    Paying people a living wage is a minimum cost of doing business.



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,409 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Interesting phraseology there. Minimum wage has hugely beneficial effects. Maybe there are some harmful effects but on balance places with higher minimum wages and a fair welfare system tend to be much better places to live than places with starvation wages in a race to the bottom where the desperate compete against each other



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,430 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    Thought it was down to supy issues after COVID and difficulties with the war.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,319 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    .yup, and that to, again, thats all supply side, but global supply chains are now settling since covid, energy markets are to, so inflation has now probably moved more so towards widescale profiteering, although its very difficult to be absolutely certain about this as many make it very difficult to gain access to such data, irish grocery retailers are notorious with this....



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  • Registered Users Posts: 29,319 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    a livable wage makes sense for many reasons, the most obvious being lifting more out of poverty, but it would actually greatly help many sme's by providing them with more available money from spending customers, this is where pup payments truly came into their own, and it worked, the increase in money was in fact eventually spent into the economy, saving many businesses from going under during the pandemic....



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